[sanjuro]

This is a personal observation nothing provable. But I bet every person complaining about oil drilling and the spill has done nothing to reduce their driving and energy usage.

One of the few people I respect about this is Ed Begley Jr, who often seems like a nut but actually tries as hard as anyone can to save energy.

Personally, I avoid driving out of irritation sake, but I have been riding the motorcycle regularly. Now 45 miles to a gallon is pretty good, but I wonder I need to start pedaling more (or going slower so I get get to 55mpg).

Just keep that in mind before you start criticizing more drilling. The gasoline you pump into your car doesn't get to the station without drilling for oil.

 

[DickusCheezus]

And what about the carbon footprint you just left while having your computer on and the electricity used by your monitor and and and and...whatever, just my personal observation

 

[Capricorn]

I dont think sarcasm is the solution. god knows the size of the carbon footprint from that outgassing of hot air, Dick..

in generally, i think we will almost never be able to wean ourselves off oil completely. It's there for a reason, but humans should be reasonable about it's usage. Sanju, i think, is just advocating a step closer to being reasonable by questioning our attitudes regarding energy usage. Screw teh carbon footprint rationale though. I think that is more fear mongering than anything, something with which to screw the public out of further taxes, which inevitably, flow to the those In the Know and Deep Pockets™.

so Dick. u just a dick. Unfortunately, lotsa morons share that attitude that, since we use it any way, might as well go overboard. Takes all kinds to make a world.

But i'm with Sanju, in trying to find ways to reduce usage of oil based energy sources, but it's almost impossible without alternatives that are pragmatic relative to our needs. I would love to commute by bicycle, but until Cape Town's integrated rapid transit system is properly baked, i'm gonna have to keep making $hell, Caltex etc richer

Pity battery technology hasnt advanced sufficiently. I wont mind an electric car. Hell, wont mind a hydrogen car. It's the bomb! (btw: work for a nuclear utility, so I'm pro fission)

 

[DaveW]

And what about the carbon footprint you just left while having your computer on and the electricity used by your monitor and and and and...whatever, just my personal observation

Less than driving in that beat up old tank down to the local bar to jaw about it (at a guess).

 

[Toshi]

This is a personal observation nothing provable. But I bet every person complaining about oil drilling and the spill has done nothing to reduce their driving and energy usage.

I went carless for a year and now I walk to work, so bite me.

 

[Pesqueeb]

Now that the weather has turned (relatively) nice here I've pretty much parked my Wrangler (which only gets about 18mpg). The last three weeks its been about the motorcycle or the bicycle, even for errands. I can get a shocking amount of stuff into the bicycle trailer, even with the kid in it, which has killed me a couple time since we live in a fairly hilly area. (20lb kid + weeks worth of groceries= knee killing climbs) If we didn't have winter here I would totally sell one of the cars.
Sanjuro, what kind of beast are you riding that only gets 45mpg? My bmw 650 gets an easy 60+mpg.

 

[stevew]

I went carless for a year and now I walk to work, so bite me.

hahaha...i consume...therefore i don't bitch.

 

[sanjuro]

DISCLOSURE: I used to work for BP in the Deepwater exploration section. No, I wasn't the guy who built the rig or the safety features, just a computer dude supporting the people who built Horizon.

I remember a talk with one of the senior guys. I had asked him, does Amoco (we hadn't merged yet with BP) drill safely and ethically? He told me, "We drill according to the letter of the law, no more, no less".

Knowing how easy it is to lobby and manipulate regulations, that is probably what allowed whatever happen for the rig to spew oil, even after a catastrophic failure.

Now, I feel especially guilty because of this reason, despite living a moderately energy using lifestyle.

I work 35 miles away from home. I ride to work a total of once a year. I am part of the problem.

 

[gsweet]

DISCLOSURE: I used to work for BP in the Deepwater exploration section. No, I wasn't the guy who built the rig or the safety features, just a computer dude supporting the people who built Horizon.

I remember a talk with one of the senior guys. I had asked him, does Amoco (we hadn't merged yet with BP) drill safely and ethically? He told me, "We drill according to the letter of the law, no more, no less".

Knowing how easy it is to lobby and manipulate regulations, that is probably what allowed whatever happen for the rig to spew oil, even after a catastrophic failure.

Now, I feel especially guilty because of this reason, despite living a moderately energy using lifestyle.

I work 35 miles away from home. I ride to work a total of once a year. I am part of the problem.

We're all part of the problem, Sanjuro, and unfortunately the saying goes: "People won't change until it becomes inconvenient not to."

It's more a mentality in this country, though; there's a massive disconnect for the general population with regards to origin of consumed products (be that petroleum or other natural resources) and the products themselves. All the petroleum-based compounds, rare earth elements, etc that go into new technology and toys come from somewhere. I can't tell you how many times I've seen a congregation of people at an anti-mining rally in their home state, picketing for several hours and then hopping into their Mercedes, BMW and Volvo SUVs to jaw away on their new iPhone about how their protecting their local environment. It's a damn disgrace...

Full disclosure: I work for mineral exploration and big mining, so yea...

 

[Capricorn]

gsweet: dont 4get to mention those who rush out to buy the latest prius: save the planet, speed control be damned!

but that saying sums it up: nothings gonna change until enough people are inconvenienced.

 

[JRogers]

but that saying sums it up: nothings gonna change until enough people are inconvenienced.

Largely, I agree. It's human nature, to a large degree (especially in America, perhaps).

To Sanjuro's original point: well said. I do what I can to reduce energy usage, partially for selfish reasons (lower cost) and partially for environmental and ethical reasons. I don't keep my apartment around 62 in the winter for fun. I have a lot of friends that would probably rail against offshore drilling and its "evils" but might not do much on their own. One good friend of mine I know must be against all the recent stuff about more domestic drilling. She drives a Prius, of course. And drives to school all the time despite living about a mile (probably less) away. I can understand that part of the reason is because she lives in a crappy neighborhood and it's not good to walk home at night. But it's mostly out of laziness.

I'm not saying the Prius or other similar things are "bad" on the whole, but this is part of the problem with commodifying "green." People start thinking "oh, I bought this 'green' solution, now I can use it all the time." It goes to durable goods (like the Prius) and small stuff like paper towels. Okay, you want recycled paper towels. Great. Not a bad idea. But how about not buying crap that you are going to throw away and have to buy again next week? How about not driving instead of riding in your 'green' car?

I just thought of an interesting parallel: this is similar to why 'low-fat/fat-free' foods often don't do anything as far as making people healthier or less, well, fat. One, because they often just pump the stuff full of sugar or salt or corn syrup to make up for lost flavor. And, two, because people think they can eat more because it's "healthy" and it doesn't fill them up (due to no fat), so they do.

 

[$tinkle]

I work 35 miles away from home. I ride to work a total of once a year. I am part of the problem.

i don't view the free market as a problem. i think if the gov't arbitrarily assigned a financial incentive to motivate you (much like what a free market would do bereft of emotion or politics), *that* would be a problem.

the bigger teh gov't, the smaller the citizen.