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Ok, so explain this one to me:

Discussion in 'Politics & World News' started by Silver, Oct 8, 2005.

  1. Silver

    Silver find me a tampon

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    "Abstinence is the best way to prevent HPV," she said. "Giving the HPV vaccine to young women could be potentially harmful, because they may see it as a license to engage in premarital sex."

    http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cach...2032+hpv+vaccine+controversy+abstinence&hl=en

    Yeah, nice. And suppose your daughter does refrain from sex until marriage. How do you know her husband did? You're willing roll the dice on cervical cancer for that?

    What a bunch of ****wads.
     
    #1 -   Oct 8, 2005

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  2. ridetoofast

    ridetoofast scarred, broken and drunk

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    um perhaps if she has any sense she will insist that he is tested before they bump uglies???
     
    #2 -   Oct 8, 2005
  3. Silver

    Silver find me a tampon

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    http://www.cdc.gov/std/HPV/STDFact-HPV.htm

    No test for men.

    Besides, what happens if he cheats after they are married? Now your church going mother of 3 develops cervical cancer becasue you didn't vaccinate her when she was a kid because you were worried about her virtue.
     
    #3 -   Oct 8, 2005
  4. ummbikes

    ummbikes Don't mess with the Santas

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    If women have an option that may prevent cancer then by God they should take it.
     
    #4 -   Oct 8, 2005
  5. ridetoofast

    ridetoofast scarred, broken and drunk

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    if he cheats on her when they are married he could get ANY number of non vaccine-able diseases...wtf kind of logic is that?
     
    #5 -   Oct 8, 2005
  6. ummbikes

    ummbikes Don't mess with the Santas

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    WTF version of logic would conclude that not vaccinating is morally right? :nuts:
     
    #6 -   Oct 8, 2005
  7. ridetoofast

    ridetoofast scarred, broken and drunk

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    im not saying there is one for that but he makes it sound as though the cheating IS a logical reason for it

    if he is going to come up with a reason for vaccination it needs to be more solid than cheating because there are numerous 'prizes' said cheatn' hubby could get aside from HPV
     
    #7 -   Oct 8, 2005
  8. Reactor

    Reactor Turbo Monkey

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    I think the point is that this particular "prize" is preventable with a vaccine, whether or not she gets it from her husband. And cervical cancer isn't cured with a shot of antibiotic, it's deadly. What if the husband got HPV from his previous cheating wife, now dead of cervical cancer? If there were a vaccine for AIDS, I'd make sure my daughter got it, because the result is so horrific,
     
    #8 -   Oct 8, 2005
  9. BuddhaRoadkill

    BuddhaRoadkill I suck at Tool

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    WTF kinda logic is that?!?! That's like saying "I'm not getting a polio vaccine because they don't have one for the common cold".
    Just because you cannot prevent them all does not mean you should
    not prevent the ones you can.

    Would the fact that one out of six women are raped better fit your need for a reason?
     
    #9 -   Oct 8, 2005
  10. kidwoo

    kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

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    It's true.

    If we allow a vaccine, we may see for the first time ever, teenagers engaging in coitus before marriage. Personally, I'm not ready to accept that reality. I mean can you imagine? Teenagers.....sex?
     
  11. Silver

    Silver find me a tampon

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    <Religious Right>They wouldn't be raped if God didn't want to punish them. They probably masturbated once, late at night, under the covers.</Religious Right>
     
  12. valve bouncer

    valve bouncer Master Dildoist

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    :thumb: :D
    Exactly right, and we all know that sex leads to dancing and we can't have that.
     
  13. narlus

    narlus Eastcoast Softcore
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    we've already seen the consequences once, please god don't let it happen again:

     
  14. spam16v

    spam16v Monkey

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    it's already spread....

     
  15. ohio

    ohio The Fresno Kid

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    Ignoring the obvious that people engage in sex before marraige whether you want to believe it or not, let's assume that we can actually convince folks to women to wait until they get married. What proportion of women do you think WOULD actually ask their husbands to get tested? We're talking good God-fearing women here, that are in love with their fiances and wouldn't dare to believe their fiance could be lying with the following statements:
    "I'm a virgin."
    "I was tested before we started dating and I'm clean"
    Even if they believe their fiance capable of lying, most are afraid to ask for appearing distrustful, for ruining the romance, for inserting questions about their OWN faithfulness and purity into the fiance's head.

    You know HPV has NO symptoms in men? And there's NO test for it in men? Even if a man does the right thing and gets tested, there's no way for him to know whether or not he has the disease.

    I can't possibly fathom what it means to think in a way that I'm happy to let people die in an early, awful death to make a statement about what's right and wrong. Who are you to act as parent to all these children, to take decision away from their real parents?
     
  16. Andyman_1970

    Andyman_1970 Turbo Monkey

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    HPV has no symptoms in men...........what?

    HPV is what causes genital warts........just check your pee pee, the symtom would be warts on it.............
     
  17. Silver

    Silver find me a tampon

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    From that CDC link above:

    Most people who have a genital HPV infection do not know they are infected. The virus lives in the skin or mucous membranes and usually causes no symptoms. Some people get visible genital warts...

    You know, this is the same thinking that prevents advocating condom use in Africa. It used to be quaint, then it was simply retarded, but it's starting to cross over into murderous.

    (Not directed at you specifically, Andy. But hey, if God reserves judgement, it seems to me that people who prejudge condom distribution or an HPV vaccine have their own special box seat in hell.)
     
  18. Damn True

    Damn True Monkey Pimp

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    Hey, if there is a vaccine for it, by all means, shoot-em-up. Then remind them that abstainance, when used correctly, is 100% effective.
     
  19. ohio

    ohio The Fresno Kid

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    Someone note this: DT and I agree.

    Did someone get that down? This is important.
     
  20. valve bouncer

    valve bouncer Master Dildoist

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    I've also heard that not drinking is 100% effective in stopping hangovers but like the abstinence thing I don't wanna find out myself. You've had plenty of experience with both DT. Is it true? ;) :D :p
     
  21. Andyman_1970

    Andyman_1970 Turbo Monkey

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    I've heard HPV is the STD with the highest infection rate of any in the US. Oh and BTW, you can be infected, not have symptoms, get warts later, have them treated and never have them again, or have warts right off the bat and continue to have them treated and they still return.
     
  22. Echo

    Echo crooked smile

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    It's a website about abstinence. What do you think their solution to EVERYTHING is going to be?

    I can't even believe anyone listens to them. They obviously have no concept of reality.
     
  23. ohio

    ohio The Fresno Kid

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    Your first stat I believe is correct. The second part (and it's surprising how hard info is to come by) is not quite right. I think there are two strains, one which presents itself as warts and one which doesn't. The reason it's so prevalent (some of the stats I've seen for the male population are STAGGERING), is because of the strain that doesn't present itself, AND has no test in men. It also doesn't show up in normal STD (blood/urine) tests in women... they need a pap smear.

    It may be along that I'm wrong and it's just that it doesn't present in most of the population, but the effect is the same...

    It's a vaccine. It will save lives. A guy can have one sexual experience in his teens, find God and be abstinent for the next 10 years, GET TESTED, and still not know he has it when he gets married. It needs to be understood that, even in religious communities, people (especially teens) make mistakes, and while they should take responsibility for them, we OWE it to them to minimize the physical consequences.

    There is nothing wrong with vaccinating your child, and (as DT said) letting them know there are still PLENTY of diseases out there (with really nasty symptoms) and the only 100% certain way to avoid them is to abstain. I think the government ALSO has a responsibility to tell them that if they choose not to abstain, a condom will significantly reduce the likelihood that they will get something nasty.

    In the 2002 CDC survey around half of all UNMARRIED 15-19 year olds (46% of females, 46% of males) reported having had sexual intercourse. This survey was administered by interviewers, so you can expect that number to be extremely low compared to reality... I've seen other numbers around 70%. Even of teens that took virginity pledges "61 percent of the consistent pledgers and 79 percent of the inconsistent pledgers reported having intercourse before marrying or prior to 2002 interviews" (this may have occured outside their teens, but it's still pre-marital).

    Quite simply, the abstinence message doesn't work with most teens. We can keep preaching it, hope the rates improve with reduced peer pressure and better scare tactics, but it would take an absolutely massive shift and decades of cultural change. And even then, we don't know how far we can shift the dial (10, maybe 20 percent... we've managed about 8% improvement since the 80s). In the meantime, people are dying, unwanted babies are being born, unwanted fetuses aborted... in my mind it is absolutely unconscionable to withhold information (or in this case A VACCINE) from teens because we're afraid it will encourage sex.
     
  24. Andyman_1970

    Andyman_1970 Turbo Monkey

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    BTW - I'm not on the "don't vaccinate" side........................
     
  25. ohio

    ohio The Fresno Kid

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    I thought you were... that was more of a general statement that I wanted to get down while I was thinking of it.

    edit: ack more misunderstanding. What I meant was "I thought SO." So we're on the same page...
     
  26. Andyman_1970

    Andyman_1970 Turbo Monkey

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    Nope, if I had a daughter I'd get her vaccinated - though we will teach abstinence is best, the reality is the potential mates to my children may not have been taught or lived out such, being able to prevent cervical cancer is just too important to pass up.
     
  27. Damn True

    Damn True Monkey Pimp

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    Well, I don't get a hangover every time I drink.
    But if I don't drink, I never get a hangover.

    The difference is that the risk of a hangover is not reason enough to have a couple of glasses of scotch while sitting on the couch watching the Giants.

    The risk of getting a fatal dose of atomic crotch-rot is reason enough to not have sex.
     
  28. beestiboy

    beestiboy Monkey

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    I thought HPV stood for Human Powered Vehicle?
     
  29. golgiaparatus

    golgiaparatus Out of my element

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    Puritan b!tches that are afraid of imaginary social shame.
     
  30. golgiaparatus

    golgiaparatus Out of my element

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    One of my relatives got it from her fiancee. He had no symptoms and didnt ever know he had it. Now she has to get routine checkups and get surgery sometimes which makes her feel horrible and depressed for weeks :(
     
  31. ALEXIS_DH

    ALEXIS_DH Tirelessly Awesome

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