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Personal Finance Mods

Crashby

Monkey
Jan 26, 2003
947
1
Rochester, NY
Here's another topic about saving greenbacks...

How do you control your personal finances? Here are some general rules and a few things I have done in my life to get ready for a (hopefully) early retirement:

• Live below your means: Even though I was a fairly well paid executive, I lived in a $60,000 city house for 4 years, driving an old and reliable Honda Accord. Once you establish a certain level of existence, it’s rather difficult to go back down. Moving up slowly is easy, enjoyable, comfortable, and relatively stress free
• Cars: I have only owned cars that I could pay cash for. I started out with a $900 Oldsmobile Cutlass, and now have a ’06 Subie. You should only buy a new car if you are silly rich
• Houses: Don’t buy what the bank approves you for. Being house poor is one of the most uncomfortable situations you can put yourself in. And if you lose your job and have little equity in your house, you could lose it all. I fix up houses as a side business, and am on my 7th property. I have made just enough profit on each one to own my current home outright. This takes time (1-2000 hours per year), but a great way to build equity and eliminate your largest bill (not to mention avoiding hundreds of thousands in interest debt)
• Keep ‘possessions’ to a minimum: Have a few really high quality items around you that make you happy… be it a really nice guitar, cooking set, flat screen TV, whatever floats your boat, but don’t let your possessions own you by having too much. Ask yourself of each item you own: “Do you love it, need it, or does it make you money”? If not, you can probably give it the boot
• Buy from the Internets: I buy almost everything online. Shop at the mall, but hop on Amazon, etc to buy. I save around 60% on annual purchases (electronics, clothes, shoes, etc.). Always browse Woot, Dealnews, Pricegrabber, etc. for things you need
• Insure yourself properly but cheaply: Always be insured (house, apartment, car), but shop around! Few people make more than one or two calls to insurance agencies. Spend 4-5 hours once a year to see how you can reduce this large annual cost
• Feed yourself well but simply: I only spend around $160/month on food. Always look at the per pound cost and compare brands. Avoid red meat (except bacon) and other ‘luxury’ foods that you don’t really need. Also shop infrequently. I shop once every 4-5 weeks and freeze much of what I need. This cuts down on gas and car wear and tear as well
• Retirement planning: especially now, pump the heck out of your 401k and Roth accounts. The markets may go a bit lower, but averaging your cost basis on domestic and emerging market equities over the next 18 months will pay off handsomely over the next 10-20 years. Always invest at least to what your company matches for your 401k. If you can, max it out. I contribute the maximum $15,500 per year to my 401k and the full $5,000 to a Roth IRA

How do you "feed the pig"?
 

loco-gringo

Crusading Clamp Monkey
Sep 27, 2006
8,887
14
Deep in the heart of TEXAS
• Buy from the Internets: I buy almost everything online. Shop at the mall, but hop on Amazon, etc to buy. I save around 60% on annual purchases (electronics, clothes, shoes, etc.). Always browse Woot, Dealnews, Pricegrabber, etc. for things you need
I love this part. It works wonders to support the local economy. I hope your taxes show you how unimportant the local tax base is one day. If you're so good at online shopping, don't waste the people at the mall's time. If you don't ask for their help, but they still have to remerchandise when you leave, you wasted their time. I understand saving dollars, but using someone else to do it is super lame. That's why people bitch when someone comes in the LBS to play 20 questions to go shop online to save money. Whatever.

The rest makes pretty good sense. I, however, am a poor example of financial health.
 

AngryMetalsmith

Business is good, thanks for asking
Jun 4, 2006
21,230
10,096
I have no idea where I am
Loco is right.

Stop treating local businesses as a source of information. Either support them or don't waste their time that could be used to actually make a sale. And don't tell a local store owner about the fantastic deal you got on the interwebs either.
 

Crashby

Monkey
Jan 26, 2003
947
1
Rochester, NY
I love this part. It works wonders to support the local economy. I hope your taxes show you how unimportant the local tax base is one day. If you're so good at online shopping, don't waste the people at the mall's time. If you don't ask for their help, but they still have to remerchandise when you leave, you wasted their time. I understand saving dollars, but using someone else to do it is super lame. That's why people bitch when someone comes in the LBS to play 20 questions to go shop online to save money. Whatever.

The rest makes pretty good sense. I, however, am a poor example of financial health.
I personally only "go to the mall" about once a year. I was giving good advice to those that are mall-rats and shop-a-holics. And you think any of the mall stores are "local"?

And sheesh... "Support the local economy?" You think buying at Best Buy and Home Depot really does much to help the local economy? A small tax contribution, yes, but all the real profits go back to the corporate headquarters in Delaware or what have you - and into the hands of the corporate fat-cats and share holders... Due to my income and place of residance, I certainly support the "local" (town, city and state) economy by 'contributing' about $30,000 per year.:bonk:

And any and all bike related purchases are strictly LBS btw...
 

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
41,192
13,339
Portland, OR
I shop local when I can (walk to the store), I take the bus to work, I steal wifi rather than pay for roaming service, and use Netflix rather than buy movies I may only watch once ever.

I haven't had any credit debt (other than student loans) in nearly 5 years and I am buying a foreclosed house for about half what the previous owner paid. I hope to own the house outright in 10 years.

My friends make fun of me because I make more than 90% of them, but I am the one driving an 80's truck, a salvage title motorcycle, and a DH bike from 2001. But I paid cash for them all and laugh when they bitch about the $400 truck payment or how my motorcycle is just as fast and cost half the price. :D
 

stosh

Darth Bailer
Jul 20, 2001
22,238
393
NY
This is a great list for living single.


I agree in principle with a lot of your points. Try going grocery shopping for a family only once every 5 weeks.

I will tell you one thing, this recession has taught my wife and I some very valuable lessons.
 

Crashby

Monkey
Jan 26, 2003
947
1
Rochester, NY
the people who work there probably do.
I fully agree to the theory of supporting my 'local' economy. Heck, Ive laid out over $200,000 over the past 5 years locally on home supplies, cars, taxes, and even Realtor fees.

What my points are aiming to do is give general tips on how be become more financially viable.

I'm actually liking (much to my surprise) some of the actions taken by Obama over the past few weeks (cabinet appointments etc.) regarding the economy. But I think we are still right on the brink of heading into a *read: depression. There are many posters on this board that may have poor financial habits and may fall victim to the harsh economic downturn and 10% unemployment rates that we may be heading towards. If I and others can help just a little bit to get our peeps to a better place, than thats the goal...
 

ridiculous

Turbo Monkey
Jan 18, 2005
2,907
1
MD / NoVA
I really only shop local for produce. When it comes to electronics and such it really doesnt matter to me. I am guilty of going in to a store and tinkering with things in person before buying online. A best buy on average sells about $150,000/day worth of crap so I dont feel bad at all. Especially when they try to talk you into buying something you dont need, give you false information, or make up some story on how they have 6 subwoofers wired to their computer.

Many small business are turning to the interwebs for help now a days anyway. Take Full Cycles for example. They have 3 stores in Colorado I believe, and when you visit the stores you would think they are a small time bike shop. But after talking with one of their associates she said that most of their sales have come from internet sales and have allowed them to stay afloat and expand. SO maybe shopping online actually helps the small guys.
 

mandown

Poopdeck Repost
Jun 1, 2004
20,261
7,788
Transylvania 90210
i'm becoming less likely to do intertubes shopping unless i cannot find what i want local. i just bought a new bass amp on the internet and i felt lame about not buying from a local shop. luckily it was busted and i was able to ship it back for a refund. i took that cash and walked into the local shop, paid a few extra dollars and got what i wanted. it was worth the extra dollars to deal with the help in the shop who knew their products and were able to guide me to the right amp for me. the older i get, the better i feel about buying "local" whenever i can. it may not be the most cost effective option in the short term, but it does support the local economy (yes, even the best buy employees) which has long-term benefits.
 

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
41,192
13,339
Portland, OR
Especially if you like eating fresh produce.
Who eats that crap?

We joined an organic CSA this year and it was WAY more than we could use. They also sell at the farmers market, so we will go back to that for stuff we didn't/can't grow ourselves.

We do a big trip to the store every pay period and usually one or two "emergency" trips for things like milk or eggs if my wife/daughter go nuts during the week. Our freezer is packed and we have been debating about getting a stand alone freezer to support Costco trips, but that goes against our energy savings at home.

Safeway is only a mile away, so I walk for ice cream runs or other impulse buys. But we do our bulk shopping between Winco (cheap) and Grocery Outlet (overstocks).
 

SkaredShtles

Michael Bolton
Sep 21, 2003
65,706
12,739
In a van.... down by the river
Who eats that crap?

We joined an organic CSA this year and it was WAY more than we could use. They also sell at the farmers market, so we will go back to that for stuff we didn't/can't grow ourselves.

We do a big trip to the store every pay period and usually one or two "emergency" trips for things like milk or eggs if my wife/daughter go nuts during the week. Our freezer is packed and we have been debating about getting a stand alone freezer to support Costco trips, but that goes against our energy savings at home.
I'm pretty sure modern chest freezers use VERY little energy. We have one and it didn't make much of a difference in our utility bill IIRC.
 

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
41,192
13,339
Portland, OR
I'm pretty sure modern chest freezers use VERY little energy. We have one and it didn't make much of a difference in our utility bill IIRC.
We were talking about it last night. My wife was looking on CL (as we often do) and I said I would rather spend a little more and get a new one that is more efficient unless we can find a newer one, rather than an old school one.
 

chuffer

Turbo Monkey
Sep 2, 2004
1,557
901
McMinnville, OR
to the OP: while I mostly agree with the idea of living below your means, i would never be able to only spend $160 / month on groceries. Unless, of course, I was growing my own veggies. perhaps it is my upbringing, but eating good quality and healthy food that I enjoy is extremely important to me & my girl. while we dont subsist on caviar and champagne, I sure enjoy fresh veggies, fruit and meat more than the canned or frozen variants. The level of enjoyment and satisfaction from preparing and eating good food is the most important investment you can make in your life(style). If you say that there is no difference between fresh and frozen, then I suppose this discussion is over before it got started.
 
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DirtMcGirk

<b>WAY</b> Dumber than N8 (to the power of ten alm
Feb 21, 2008
6,379
1
Oz
I've gotten my daily expenses (gas, food, utilities) down to around $15 a day. That's with my commute to the mountain every day.

However, when the wife is in town, I am going to be honest, I like spoiling her. I can, without hesitation, justify $1000 in lingerie, clothes or shoes for her. When she spends eight out of every twelve months of the year in the sand and the suck, I don't care about the money or the "long term need" for these things. It makes her happy, and to me that's worth more then having it in the bank.

Besides, I plan on being dead in 2012.
 

Austin Bike

Turbo Monkey
Jan 26, 2003
1,558
0
Duh, Austin
1. Pay off your mortgage early. It's like getting a $2000/month raise.

2. Charge everything to float your money for 30+ days.

3. Pay off your credit card bills in full every month (if you can't do #3, then don't do #2)

4. If you have credit card debt, do NOT save money. Keep a buffer to get by and pay off your debt. There is nothing worse than saving money and making 6% while you have credit card debt at 18%. You are losing 12% per month.

5. Maximize your 401K. Social security will not pay for your retirement. It is a supplement and may not be there when you retire.

6. Don't invest in "hot stock tips." By the time the info filters to you it is worthless. Don't invest in individual stocks unless you are able to lose the whole stake. Mutual funds have better growth opportunities over time and less risk.

7. Don't have kids unless you can afford them. It is selfish to bring children into the world that you can't afford to raise. If you are having kids, think about what things in your life you need to do without. Unless you have no debts and you are saving handfuls of money, any major change to your life should be a time to reassess your spending.
 

SkaredShtles

Michael Bolton
Sep 21, 2003
65,706
12,739
In a van.... down by the river
1. Pay off your mortgage early. It's like getting a $2000/month raise.
I would *strongly* suggest people don't take this advice without analyzing their situation. A LOT of people have really cheap mortgages (percentage-wise) and money would be better invested than paying off the mortgage early.

Your other advice is spot on in almost ANY circumstance. :thumb:
 

Crashby

Monkey
Jan 26, 2003
947
1
Rochester, NY
I would *strongly* suggest people don't take this advice without analyzing their situation. A LOT of people have really cheap mortgages (percentage-wise) and money would be better invested than paying off the mortgage early.

Your other advice is spot on in almost ANY circumstance. :thumb:
This is a GREAT point... the S&P has returned 0% over the past 10 years, so in general, it would have made more sense to pay off your mortgage early. However, over the next 10-20 years, it would probably make more sense to invest in domestic/emerging markets for a better return than you are paying in interest. When calculating this, don't forget to take into consideration the tax benefit of deducting your interest payments. So, your 6% mortgage is actually costing you closer to 4%. Therefore, if you can invest and return better than 4% on average over the life of the mortgage, then its better to put your money in equities, metals, etc.

But..... there is a 'benefit' and peace of mind to not having a mortgage at all which is hard to quantify in dollars... :lighten:
 

Austin Bike

Turbo Monkey
Jan 26, 2003
1,558
0
Duh, Austin
I would *strongly* suggest people don't take this advice without analyzing their situation. A LOT of people have really cheap mortgages (percentage-wise) and money would be better invested than paying off the mortgage early.

Your other advice is spot on in almost ANY circumstance. :thumb:
Point taken. You shouldn't be borrowing money (i.e. charging instead of paying cash) in order to pay off your mortgage.

Here's how you should pay down debt:

1. Credit cards (typically 18-25% interest)
2. Student loans
3. Cars
4. Houses

If you can clean the first 3 off your list, then it is best to clear off the mortgage.

Especially in tough times. Losing your job sucks. Losing your job with a mortgage over your head really sucks.

The goal of everyone should be to minimize their monthly cash outlays in order to be in the best position to invest their proceeds for the future.

The worst reason you could ever have for not pre-paying on your mortgage is the idea that you get some kind of tax break.

You only get a break on the interest that you pay. Pay $1 in interest, get roughly $.25 back. You're still out the $.75 in interest.
 

DirtMcGirk

<b>WAY</b> Dumber than N8 (to the power of ten alm
Feb 21, 2008
6,379
1
Oz
There is no future.
12/21/2012 is coming.

Not sure why you're all worrying.
The end is nigh.