[MikeD]

Can someone explain this to me?

You're talking about people who have, by definition, demonstrated blatant contempt for laws...especially those requiring registration and compliance with standards.

If it's to ensure safer drivers, try again. Anyone who fails the test to get a DL will simply drive without one, if he even bothers to try and get one in the first place. Worst that'll happen to him if he's caught without one is deportation, which he's facing anyhow.

If it's to ensure insurance coverage for all drivers, see the point above.

Is it to make life easier for them by giving them an ID that will conceal their illegal status from entities like schools and welfare agencies?

If it's to give some legitimacy to their presence in the States, lawmakers should admit that up front.

Is there something I'm missing?

 

[binary visions]

I heard an interesting point on NPR that it was better for law enforcement if they actually had a visible presence in the national databases/records, since the DMV database is the most heavily accessed database in the country.

 

[MikeD]

If they went and got them, that is. Also, there'd have to be some preclusion for using DMV info against them, because otherwise ICE could just check every new entry and head to the registered address.

So if it's being used as a br'er rabbit trap for stupid illegals, it'll last about a week before no one registers anymore. If it's not, it'll in fact be used to shield the illegals from apprehension or interference.

MD

 

[manimal]

Worst that'll happen to him if he's caught without one is deportation, which he's facing anyhow.

yeah right! i call our local ICE folks everytime i catch an illegal driving w/out a license and they tell me that they'll "follow-up" on it. i know nothing will happen but at least i'm trying to make an attempt. all i can do is arrest them for "no operators license" and put them in jail for the night on what i hope is their real name

i have had cases where i've had a violent offender who is illegal and has no valid ID of any sort. I spoke with the judge and had him placed in jail until he either produced an ID or the INS picked him up. unfortunately, it took several hours just to deal with that one subject, and most officers on the street don't have the time to be that thorough.

 

[MikeD]

I said the worst result, as in the worst that'll happen if I kill this guy is that I'll get the chair. Not the likely result.

Believe me, I know...

 

[manimal]

for sure, i wan't bagging on your comment, just the fact that the worst never happens.

 

[Reactor]

Locally an officer killed this year when he stopped a small group of gang bangers. One of them gave a fake name, which happened to have a warrant out for arrest. The officer was shot, then the illegal alien gang member car jacked a car from another illegal alien and lead officers on along car chase. After he was cornered he waved a gun around and the swat team took him out with one shot.

 

[Echo]

DL's for illegals is not going to happen anyway, at least not now. Spitzer finally got slapped down by enough people from both parties that he changed his feeble mind.

I really think it's going to bite Hillary in the ass that she supported him on this.

 

[blue]

Since rounding up and deporting everyone is NOT feasible (though others will lead you to believe differently), a DP card is a good stopgap to keep things orderly.

A) There's some form of record on them, and a name attached.

B) They're required to learn the rules of the road here, as paltry as that may be.

The people screaming "round them all up and deport them" really need to consider coming to terms with reality...

 

[Silver]

The whole "contempt for the laws" thing is overblown.

If getting a driver's license basically required a lawyer with a total cost of $5000+, and a waiting period of more than a year, you can be damned sure that most legal citizens of the country wouldn't bother to get one.

 

[Reactor]

Since rounding up and deporting everyone is NOT feasible (though others will lead you to believe differently), a DP card is a good stopgap to keep things orderly.

A) There's some form of record on them, and a name attached.

B) They're required to learn the rules of the road here, as paltry as that may be.

The people screaming "round them all up and deport them" really need to consider coming to terms with reality...

Arizona has it's own solution, one most of the legal immigrants support.

 

[manimal]

I ran across this today. one of those "extreme" examples of anti-illegal immigration laws. while i applaud their effort to at least, do something, this law reaks of ethnic cleansing and i'm guessing that the supreme court will shoot it down. i have little respect for those who have no respect for our laws and procedures, however, i dislike codified "purging" even more.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/11/02/oklahoma.immigration/

The new law restricts the ability of illegal immigrants to obtain government IDs or public assistance. It also gives police authority to check the immigration status of anyone arrested, which can lead to deportations.

It doesn't stop at illegal immigrants. The law also makes it a felony for U.S. citizens to knowingly provide shelter, transportation or employment to illegal immigrants.

this part seems a little too nazi-esque to me.

It's not yet clear how the law will be enforced. Illegal immigrants in Oklahoma fear police will use the law for roundups of anyone working and living in the state illegally.

 

[Silver]

"The new law restricts the ability of illegal immigrants to obtain government IDs or public assistance. It also gives police authority to check the immigration status of anyone arrested, which can lead to deportations."

ICE still needs to do the deportations, and I'd imagine they won't. So that part is basically hand waving.

 

[MikeD]

The whole "contempt for the laws" thing is overblown.

If getting a driver's license basically required a lawyer with a total cost of $5000+, and a waiting period of more than a year, you can be damned sure that most legal citizens of the country wouldn't bother to get one.

Umm, OK? Now that we're done with the non-sequiturs... (Actually, I understand your point, but it's insubstantial, and if the majority of the legal residents of this country flouted a law/system, that law or system would be changed or penalties increased until the legal alternative was the more palatable of the two options.)

The fact that the immigration system is largely ****ed does not give anyone the right to go around it. Just because you want to be here doesn't mean you get to be. I wanted to move to New Zealand. The fact that their laws don't let me doesn't mean I have a right to sneak across their borders or defraud their government to slide past the rules.

Instead of focusing on legitimizing criminals (it is, in fact, illegal to cross the US border without permission...they're illegal as well as undocumented), we should be focusing on un-screwing our legal immigration system and making a workable guest-worker program (which should not be a path to citizenship...it should be a guest-worker program). Those making the effort to do things the right way should be the beneficiaries of American time, effort, and money, not those who are flouting the law.

 

[MikeD]

a DP card

Is that what Jenna Jameson carries?

A) There's some form of record on them, and a name attached.

This is why they're going to be useless...no one will get them, or if they do, they'll do it with fraudulent documents and/or addresses

B) They're required to learn the rules of the road here, as paltry as that may be.

See point #1, and even if an illegal fails the test, he'll still drive. He doesn't care about the laws, and doesn't face any greater penalty for breaking the law than a free trip home.

The people screaming "round them all up and deport them" really need to consider coming to terms with reality...

In a way, yeah, but why shouldn't illegals who come into contact with US authorities be immediately deported?

 

[Silver]

Instead of focusing on legitimizing criminals (it is, in fact, illegal to cross the US border without permission...they're illegal as well as undocumented), we should be focusing on un-screwing our legal immigration system and making a workable guest-worker program (which should not be a path to citizenship...it should be a guest-worker program). Those making the effort to do things the right way should be the beneficiaries of American time, effort, and money, not those who are flouting the law.

I totally agree with you. The free marketer in me would like to see totally unfettered immigration, but the realist in me knows that is impossible for a ton of reasons, not the least of which is reciprocity.

I wasn't making a romantic argument about the merits of undocumented immigrants, I was just pointing out that comparing the DMV to ICE is only a good comparison when you're comparing agencies that are three letter acronyms.

Hell, I think we need to amend the constitution to get rid of birthright citizenship...