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Push Seals Breaking Down

djjohnr

djjohnr

Turbo Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
3,109
1,799
Northern California
This is more of a PSA than anything else. I switched one my Lyriks to Push low friction seals a few months back. Did a lower leg service last night and found the seals appear to be breaking down into little black chunks using stock RS oil and seal grease. Going back to RS seals.
 
englertracing

englertracing

you owe me a sandwich
Mar 5, 2012
1,657
1,143
La Verne
djjohnr said:
My other Lyrik and Boxxer are using the stock RS SKF seals. No issues. Also, the Push seals never felt like they had reduced friction over stock after breaking in, and the oil was was no cleaner.
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it should be just about impossible for a company like push to one up a company like skf on a seal....
 
Scrub

Scrub

Turbo Monkey
Feb 4, 2003
1,456
127
NOR CAL, Sac/CoCo County
In the past I've used the Push seals with Maxima Plush oil and Slick Honey lube on my Boxxer with no problems in between services. This was every month services from riding Northstar weekly. Now I have a Marz380 with SKF seals and same oil and lube combo.
 
F

FarkinRyan

Monkey
Dec 15, 2003
611
193
Pemberton, BC
In order to actually contribute something useful here; all the SKF produced seals are the same thing be they Fox, Rockshox or SKF-branded green ones, use slickoleum on all of them despite what Fox tell you. The green SKFs come with lame foam rings and the RS branded ones cost about half of any other option and are a sweet deal. Push seals are neither noticeably lower friction nor longer lasting than SKF seals in either 35mm or 36mm variants in my experience.
 
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ebarker9

Monkey
Oct 2, 2007
884
278
FarkinRyan said:
The green SKFs come with lame foam rings and the RS branded ones cost about half of any other option and are a sweet deal.
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Foam rings as a concept are lame or the SKF supplied ones are lame? I was trying to find just the foam rings for sale separately to the seals at one point because the seals seem to stay in good shape longer, but couldn't find a source.
 
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FarkinRyan

Monkey
Dec 15, 2003
611
193
Pemberton, BC
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PUSHIND

PUSHIND

PUSH Industries (Duh)
Dec 5, 2003
221
251
Colorado
djjohnr said:
This is more of a PSA than anything else. I switched one my Lyriks to Push low friction seals a few months back. Did a lower leg service last night and found the seals appear to be breaking down into little black chunks using stock RS oil and seal grease. Going back to RS seals.
Click to expand...
Definitely not normal. You should hit up sales@pushindustries.com for a warranty set. We've sold tens of thousands of those seals with great success. With what you're describing something was up....could've simply just been a defect.

For the record....we obviously don't make our fork seals. They are however made by a household name in MTB fork seal suppliers. Vendors such as SKF, NOK, etc have a catalog of materials, cases, and springs to choose from. As an Aftermarket company we just choose a recipe that offers greater performance, but at a greater cost to us.

Darren
 
Lelandjt

Lelandjt

adorbs
Apr 4, 2008
2,636
997
Breckenridge, CO/Lahaina,HI
The only source of Fox size foam rings I've heard of is Push. At Interbike they told me our shop can order bags of foam rings for Fox forks so whenever we do an oil change we can replace the foam rings instead of trying to clean them. Yeah, we should get around to doing that. Honestly I don't know why it isn't standard practice industry wide. You do what, 10 oil changes before you change the seals? And each time Fox wants you to try to wipe and squeeze the dirt out of the foam rings, then put'em back in? Seems sub-optimal.
 
jstuhlman

jstuhlman

bagpipe wanker
Dec 3, 2009
17,313
14,123
Cackalacka du Nord
Lelandjt said:
The only source of Fox size foam rings I've heard of is Push. At Interbike they told me our shop can order bags of foam rings for Fox forks so whenever we do an oil change we can replace the foam rings instead of trying to clean them. Yeah, we should get around to doing that. Honestly I don't know why it isn't standard practice industry wide. You do what, 10 oil changes before you change the seals? And each time Fox wants you to try to wipe and squeeze the dirt out of the foam rings, then put'em back in? Seems sub-optimal.
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enduro sells em...not sure about in bulk: https://www.enduroforkseals.com/products/front-suspension/small-parts/2XFR-35-36.html
 
mykel

mykel

closer to Periwinkle
Apr 19, 2013
5,470
4,204
sw ontario canada
I ended up pulling the foam rings on a set of forks and ended up running a grease pack. Trying to get fine clay silt out of foam rings is a fools errand as they ended up a bit misshapen ...and they were still full of grit.

Flush and squeeze with suspension fluid removed some.
Flush and squeeze with with soap and water removed some.
After being unable to clean a few sets to my satisfaction, I just gave and packed the void with slickoleum.

There has to be something better-er.
 
StiHacka

StiHacka

Compensating for something
Jan 4, 2013
21,560
12,508
In hell. Welcome!
mykel said:
I ended up pulling the foam rings on a set of forks and ended up running a grease pack. Trying to get fine clay silt out of foam rings is a fools errand as they ended up a bit misshapen ...and they were still full of grit.

Flush and squeeze with suspension fluid removed some.
Flush and squeeze with with soap and water removed some.
After being unable to clean a few sets to my satisfaction, I just gave and packed the void with slickoleum.

There has to be something better-er.
Click to expand...
Zocchi 380 (and 888 IRC) run without foam rings. Granted, they have a pair of wiper + seal per side, but still.
 
Westy

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
55,943
21,973
Sleazattle
mykel said:
I ended up pulling the foam rings on a set of forks and ended up running a grease pack. Trying to get fine clay silt out of foam rings is a fools errand as they ended up a bit misshapen ...and they were still full of grit.

Flush and squeeze with suspension fluid removed some.
Flush and squeeze with with soap and water removed some.
After being unable to clean a few sets to my satisfaction, I just gave and packed the void with slickoleum.

There has to be something better-er.
Click to expand...
Depends on your fork, but that could work its way into your damping oil and throw the viscosity way off.
 
mykel

mykel

closer to Periwinkle
Apr 19, 2013
5,470
4,204
sw ontario canada
2013 888 Evo Ti
Avy cartridge
SKF green seals
Fluids on the damper side were Redline pre Avy and Golden Spectro with the Avy cart. Spring side is usually Fox Gold.

Never had a problem with it.
When you pull the lowers, the area the foam ring sits looks the same as when I pack it except the top layer is dirty. A finger wipe to remove the top layer, replace with a bit of fresh and it is good to go. I drop them a couple times a season, so they don't get long periods without love.

Damper bath fluid comes out looking pretty good, a bit of silt will settle out, but the colour is not too far off of fresh fluid, just a bit cloudy and darker.
Spring side looks like Saturdays bath water after you fish the last kid out.

It runs smoother longer, doesn't get that sticky feeling like it did when the rings were manked.

Honestly, it started as a kluge. I needed yet another set of foam rings, and could not get any. Figured it was worth a try for the weekend. When I pulled it apart I was surprised to find no visible washout with just the top layer of grease covered in clay silt.

It worked, so I have just kept at it.
 
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