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Question for the gun nuts - what would it take...

What would it take?

  • No more income tax of any sort

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • TRULY free health care

    Votes: 5 25.0%
  • A shiny new pick-up truck

    Votes: 2 10.0%
  • Free college tuition for your kids

    Votes: 1 5.0%
  • Nothing. There is nothing more important than my gun

    Votes: 12 60.0%

  • Total voters
    20

MMike

A fowl peckerwood.
Sep 5, 2001
18,207
105
just sittin' here drinkin' scotch
I don't think pretending that I'm too retarded to see through an absurd situation is "thinking outside the box."

HEY GUYS. IF YOU COULD GET ALL THE FREE PIE YOU WANT BUT HAD TO GIVE UP YOUR RIGHT TO WEAR FLIP FLOPS TO DO IT, WOULD YOU?
So what if it's absurd? I know it is. It can't happen. Of course it can't.

I'm just asking "what if?"

Why is that bad?

This is like when John Lennon got in all that hot water from the christians for saying "Imagine there's no heaven".

"But there IS a heaven!! How dare you suggest otherwise!!"
"Ok fine fine.You believe there is a heaven. But for a moment suppose there wasn't"
"NO because there IS a heaven!!"
"Ok sure but just say...."
"NO!!! There's a heaven!!!"
"Nevermind"

Yep. I'm John Lennon.
 

N8 v2.0

Not the sharpest tool in the shed
Oct 18, 2002
11,003
149
The Cleft of Venus
So what if it's absurd? I know it is. It can't happen. Of course it can't.

I'm just asking "what if?"

Why is that bad?

This is like when John Lennon got in all that hot water from the christians for saying "Imagine there's no heaven".

"But there IS a heaven!! How dare you suggest otherwise!!"
"Ok fine fine.You believe there is a heaven. But for a moment suppose there wasn't"
"NO because there IS a heaven!!"
"Ok sure but just say...."
"NO!!! There's a heaven!!!"
"Nevermind"

Yep. I'm John Lennon.
ur doing it wrong..


Imagine there's no heaven --- COOKIE MONSTER!
It's easy if you try --- COOKIE MONSTER!
No hell below us --- COOKIE MONSTER!
Above us only sky --- COOKIE MONSTER!
Imagine all the people Living for today --- COOKIE MONSTER!
 

Lowlight7

Monkey
Apr 4, 2008
355
0
Virginia, USA
I missed this one...

a) How many people with MBA's are out there knocking over liquor stores at gun point. Of course there's white collar crime. How much white collar violent crime is there?
You think gangbangers took up a life of crime because they did OK in high school but couldn't afford to go to college? Meanwhile, plenty of high school graduates (and dropouts) manage to make an honest living?

Being a violent criminal is a choice.

b) No I would not trade the right to free speach(sic) for a car or a PhD. Because like you, I place a high value on that right. I place zero value on gun ownership because it never affects my day to day life in the least. Freedom of speech however does actually affect me. So in my case, it's really not a fair comparison.
Well, my last dealing with the law on any level was about 5 years ago, so one could argue that I have no need for my 5th and 6th amendment rights. I don't even speed, so they don't really affect my day to day life.

But I'm not going to trade them for anything.
 

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
41,705
13,834
Portland, OR
I'd give up my guns if I could legally punch people in the face for doing stupid things. Things like balancing their checkbook in the grocery line or going slow in the left lane.
I would give up all Westy's guns, buy some of my own to give up, and toss in a $100 for those rights!
 

MMike

A fowl peckerwood.
Sep 5, 2001
18,207
105
just sittin' here drinkin' scotch
Well, my last dealing with the law on any level was about 5 years ago, so one could argue that I have no need for my 5th and 6th amendment rights. I don't even speed, so they don't really affect my day to day life.

But I'm not going to trade them for anything.
I would disagree.....those other rights are keeping the cops from pulling you over and tossing you in a van and you're never heard from again....Guantanamo notwithstanding of course.

The fact that you are allowed to have a gun (or not) is not affecting how the gov't deals with you.

For me, the Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness has nothing to do with whether you're allowed to own a gun.
 

valve bouncer

Master Dildoist
Feb 11, 2002
7,843
114
Japan
So what if it's absurd? I know it is. It can't happen. Of course it can't.

I'm just asking "what if?"

Why is that bad?

This is like when John Lennon got in all that hot water from the christians for saying "Imagine there's no heaven".

"But there IS a heaven!! How dare you suggest otherwise!!"
"Ok fine fine.You believe there is a heaven. But for a moment suppose there wasn't"
"NO because there IS a heaven!!"
"Ok sure but just say...."
"NO!!! There's a heaven!!!"
"Nevermind"

Yep. I'm John Lennon.
You are not John Lennon you bastard. John Lennon is dead man, he's dead. You heartless f*cker.
 

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
As a man, I'm guaranteed rights by the creator which include access to, and possession of can openers. This right, wholly sovereign, is in no way dependent upon, nor excluded by other such rights. To suggest such is to impede upon mah freedum, and undermines that which we hold dearly as our system of law and gubbahmint.

Can opner gonna save mah ass. It's what the orginal cambells would have wanted.
 

binary visions

The voice of reason
Jun 13, 2002
22,116
1,184
NC
So what if it's absurd? I know it is. It can't happen. Of course it can't.

I'm just asking "what if?"

Why is that bad?
I think it's a perfectly cromulent idea.

P.S. There's a difference between asking "what if?" and proposing completely preposterous scenarios that have no basis in the real world.
 

MikeD

Leader and Demogogue of the Ridemonkey Satinists
Oct 26, 2001
11,729
1,793
chez moi
Damn, actually, I'd do it for a pony, now that I think about it.
 

MikeD

Leader and Demogogue of the Ridemonkey Satinists
Oct 26, 2001
11,729
1,793
chez moi
I know.


The magic of sheep, although great........does in fact fade. Sometimes we just need bigger fences to help the livestock over.
Don't bring up sheep. Mine cheated on me with the lead singer of NOFX.

(And, I still suspect, had a one-night three way with VB, Partsy, and DaveW.)
 

MikeD

Leader and Demogogue of the Ridemonkey Satinists
Oct 26, 2001
11,729
1,793
chez moi
That's more than three.......
Not the way they do it.

(Must spread rep...you deserve it just for the thread, which has brought us embiggenment, cromulence, and robot insurance...a three-way of Ridemonkey classics.)
 

dante

Unabomber
Feb 13, 2004
8,807
9
looking for classic NE singletrack
"ordnance." It's plural is the same as it's singular, like "deer."

There is plenty of ordnance available to U.S. citizens for purchase.
thank you very much for the spelling lesson.


however, you still haven't addressed the fact that US citizens can not purchase the ordnance that has been used so effectively against us, ie artillery shells for IEDs, fully automatic weapons, mortars, RPGs, etc. *maybe* there are some snipers in Iraq with hunting rifles, but the majority of the fighting has been done with far better/more destructive weapons than the ordinary US citizen can get their hands on here (legally).
 

MikeD

Leader and Demogogue of the Ridemonkey Satinists
Oct 26, 2001
11,729
1,793
chez moi
thank you very much for the spelling lesson.


however, you still haven't addressed the fact that US citizens can not purchase the ordnance that has been used so effectively against us, ie artillery shells for IEDs, fully automatic weapons, mortars, RPGs, etc. *maybe* there are some snipers in Iraq with hunting rifles, but the majority of the fighting has been done with far better/more destructive weapons than the ordinary US citizen can get their hands on here (legally).
Iraqis aren't buying theirs at wal-mart, either, or getting any sort of license.

This stuff makes itself available in a war zone. There's plenty of it here, too. If I was starting an insurgency, I'd get plenty of civilian explosives before the .gov even started leaving dud arty shells around.

Semi auto AK47s are just as or more effective than fully auto variants, and they're legally available. And, once bets are off, they can be modified by formerly law-abiding citizens.

Plus, we can own machine guns if we wanna pay the fee...that said, of course, the gov knows who has them, which makes it easy to come and get them.

There's also the fact that if the federal government becomes oppressive, state armories exist which have military weaponry. Local federal stockpiles (guarded by the likes of Wackenhut for the most part) aren't too hard to get at, especially if servicemembers of conscience hold themselves to their oath to the Constitution and decide to uphold it rather than fight for an oppressor.

You need to watch Red Dawn again to get some guerilla warfare in your blood. You make Patrick Swayze sad. (LL7, don't turn this into another "Wargames" back and forth...)

The fact is that there's not likely to be any combat between the American people and the government. Ever. I'd put the chance in some number that has lots of exponents and negatives and stuff and exists as only a quantum theoretical idea. I think we have a pretty good system to address problems before they rise to that level.

But if you spend some time in places in the world where people are truly oppressed by the government, you can see what the right to bear arms actually means. When government goon squads are terrorizing people and ethnic groups, co-opting the political process, and cementing themselves in power with violence, you see what something as "live free or die" might actually have mean in extremis, and what a remarkable thing it is that our society is actually founded in a concept of individual liberties, not wrung piece-by-piece from a now-vestigal central authority.

And along with the "overthrow the government" thing, there's a recognized right to self-defense in bearing arms...as we're an individualist society, not a collectivist one, our own defense is our own concern. The cops aren't there to protect you as a person--that's your job. (and collectivist societies simply don't respect the right of an individual to keep himself safe at the expense of an abstract public order...it's not like they have a cop assigned to every person to keep him safe.)
 
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ohio

The Fresno Kid
Nov 26, 2001
6,649
25
SF, CA
The fact is that there's not likely to be any combat between the American people and the government. Ever. I'd put the chance in some number that has lots of exponents and negatives and stuff and exists as only a quantum theoretical idea. I think we have a pretty good system to address problems before they rise to that level.

But if you spend some time in places in the world where people are truly oppressed by the government, you can see what the right to bear arms actually means.
And I credit it (along with the rest of the BOR) with getting the US government to where it is now, from formerly one of those "places in the world." Who knows what kind of tyranny could have been formed, even by well-meaning colonists, were those rights not in place? Unfortunately it's a legacy we now have no choice but to maintain even if it's value has passed. However, claiming we're still protecting ourselves from tyranny or foreign invasion is tin-foil hat-ism at its most cromulent.
 
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MikeD

Leader and Demogogue of the Ridemonkey Satinists
Oct 26, 2001
11,729
1,793
chez moi
However, claiming we're still protecting ourselves from tyranny or foreign invasion is tin-foil hat-ism at it's most cromulent.
Ahhh, well, when the war with China goes down, I hope the Chinese generals think what Admiral Yamamoto thought. Foreign invasion isn't actually all that far-fetched of an idea.

Plus, although you or I can't foresee tyranny here doesn't mean it'll be the same in 200 years or a thousand (if we last beyond the next 100, which seems suspect...) We can't strip away this right from posterity based on what we can see on our own horizon. I was regretting saying "ever" with such finality in my previous post. Just because we can't imagine it doesn't mean it's not possible.
 
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Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,838
20,697
Sleazattle
Any foreign invader would quickly be wooed over to our side without violence. Who can resist muffin tops, McDonald's, Hooters and strip malls as far as the eye can see? It would become more of an immigration problem at that point.
 

MikeD

Leader and Demogogue of the Ridemonkey Satinists
Oct 26, 2001
11,729
1,793
chez moi
Any foreign invader would quickly be wooed over to our side without violence. Who can resist muffin tops, McDonald's and strip malls as far as the eye can see. It would become more of an immigration problem at that point.
Tattoo-adorned muffintops, no less.

Ed: It's tragic what's happening to the countryside around c-ville, Fredricksburg, and Manassas, isn't it?! Not that it's my land or my place to say, but still, sad.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,838
20,697
Sleazattle
Tattoo-adorned muffintops, no less.

Ed: It's tragic what's happening to the countryside around c-ville, Fredricksburg, and Manassas, isn't it?! Not that it's my land or my place to say, but still, sad.
I pass exactly 5 slash and burn construction sites on my short drive to work. Many have sat empty for years, construction started on pure speculation. All are making way for strip malls and Walmarts. Fredericksburg and Manassas are already lost, this area is not far behind. It makes me sad, growth is inevitable but it has been handled horribly. The area is losing all character,turning into treeless vista of corporate logos pasted on cookie cutter buildings.

I am hoping the recent real estate issues will slow things down.
 

N8 v2.0

Not the sharpest tool in the shed
Oct 18, 2002
11,003
149
The Cleft of Venus
via intraweb mail:

Schools are finally starting to teach practical math that these kids can use in real-world situations!!



NAME ____________________ Gang/Crew _______________ Crib _______________



1. ATOMICFIREBALL has an AK 47 with a 30 round clip. He usually misses 6 out of
every 10 shots and he uses 13 rounds per drive by shooting. How many drive
by shootings can ATOMICFIREBALL attempt before he has to reload?



2. Westy has 2 ounces of cocaine. If he sells an 8 ball to ohio for
$320 and 2 grams to Juan for $85 per gram, what is the street value of
the rest of his hold?



3. pinkshirtphotos pimps 3 ho's. If the price is $85 per trick, how many tricks
per day must each ho turn to support Dwayne's $800 per day crack habit?



4. Mmike wants to cut the pound of cocaine he bought for $40,000 to make
a 20% profit. How many ounce bags will he need to make to obtain the
20% profit?



5. H8R gets $200 for a stolen BMW, $150 for stealing a corvette, and
$100 for a 4x4. If he steals 1 BMW, 2 Corvettes, and 3 4x4's how many more
corvettes must he steal to have $900?



6. Silver got 6 years for murder. He also got $10,000 for the hit. If his
common law wife spends $100 of his hit money per month, how much money
will be left when he gets out?



7. If an average can of spray paint covers 22 square feet and the average
letter is 3 square feet, how much tagging can be sprayed with three 8 oz. cans
of spray paint with 20% paint left over?



8. n8 knocked up 4 girls in the gang. There are 20 girls in his gang.
What is the exact percentage of girls n8 knocked up?



9. Laura is a lookout for the gang. Laura has a Boa Constrictor
that eat 5 rats per week at a cost of $5 per rat. If Laura makes $700 a week as
a lookout, how many weeks can she feed the Boa Constrictor on one weeks salary?



10. Lord Opie steals DRB's skate board. As Lord Opie skates away at 15 mph,
DRB loads his 357 magnum. If it takes DRB 20 seconds to load his piece, how far
away will Lord Opie be when he gets whacked?
 
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valve bouncer

Master Dildoist
Feb 11, 2002
7,843
114
Japan
via intraweb mail:
You forget one: Vb's anus has a capacity of 47 cubic inches. If each octopus tentacle takes up 2.35 cubic inches, how many can he fit up his ring piece before he reaches capacity? Warning trick question!
 

MikeD

Leader and Demogogue of the Ridemonkey Satinists
Oct 26, 2001
11,729
1,793
chez moi
You forget one: Vb's anus has a capacity of 47 cubic inches. If each octopus tentacle takes up 2.35 cubic inches, how many can he fit up his ring piece before he reaches capacity? Warning trick question!
I know the trick--Partsy keeps sucking 'em back out, and Grizza is standing by drawing a picture of the whole thing. So I'd say it takes a few gleeful hours.