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djjohnr

Turbo Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
3,052
1,767
Northern California
Geo of my Knolly Delirium was pretty damn good and the construction quality was top notch. However, beyond being fugly there was a lot of drag in the suspension from the number of bushings it used.
 

mykel

closer to Periwinkle
Apr 19, 2013
5,198
3,943
sw ontario canada
You got some pictures mykel?

Avy
Avy

Podium V2 - Frame is Noels personal final prototype. Same as production except the Ti hardware does not have a fancy finish. Bought the frame off of him Spring of 2013.
Big rotors.jpg


Fugitive LT - 2019 Stock production frame.
Fall at Georges..jpg
 

Avy

Turbo Monkey
Jan 24, 2006
1,208
405
Avy

Podium V2 - Frame is Noels personal final prototype. Same as production except the Ti hardware does not have a fancy finish. Bought the frame off of him Spring of 2013.
View attachment 191007

Fugitive LT - 2019 Stock production frame.
View attachment 191010
Fuckin Sick,I’m lovin that dam Podium. I dont think she’s too busy,she looks ready rip. I see a lot of my favorite riders going huge when I see that bike. I also love the coil rear shock on the Fugitive,and the Down Tube is a Trip? I would love to have um,or just rip um for a day.

Do you still have them?
Are you not disclosing any upgrades since this shot,the people need to know damit.

Avy
 

mykel

closer to Periwinkle
Apr 19, 2013
5,198
3,943
sw ontario canada
Fuckin Sick,I’m lovin that dam Podium. I dont think she’s too busy,she looks ready rip. I see a lot of my favorite riders going huge when I see that bike. I also love the coil rear shock on the Fugitive,and the Down Tube is a Trip? I would love to have um,or just rip um for a day.

Do you still have them?
Are you not disclosing any upgrades since this shot,the people need to know damit.

Avy
Those two are my daily drivers.

Last updates were a few weeks ago - had the Podium's CCDB rebuilt and the Fugitives fork had the bushings sized/burnished.

I will throw up some pics when I put the fork back together. I'm waffling, cause I have to tear the smashpot apart (travel change and re-shim the HBO) and don't want to do it in a cold shop. :nope:
 

Avy

Turbo Monkey
Jan 24, 2006
1,208
405
Those two are my daily drivers.

Last updates were a few weeks ago - had the Podium's CCDB rebuilt and the Fugitives fork had the bushings sized/burnished.

I will throw up some pics when I put the fork back together. I'm waffling, cause I have to tear the smashpot apart (travel change and re-shim the HBO) and don't want to do it in a cold shop. :nope:
Now we are cookin. So that is 888RC2X Ti? Did you put a Avy Cart in her?
The brakes are Shimy 4 pots with Goodridge lines?
Sram Carbon cranks? I think the Podium deserves better. I am not a sram fan,save for their chains.
Shifter,Der.? Med size frame?

What are you droping the fork to,4”? It looks good where it is?
Last,how often,and how easy it to replace the bushings? Does Knolly have all of them for the owners?
I always read about the bushings. Too many,too much drag etc.

Avy
 

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
11,465
1,679
Warsaw :/
Geo of my Knolly Delirium was pretty damn good and the construction quality was top notch. However, beyond being fugly there was a lot of drag in the suspension from the number of bushings it used.
Is this really noticeable outside of when you take out the shock and play around? I get that drag is an issue for front forks but I never felt like that was a big issue at the rear. The Warden I tried was really fun.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
19,253
9,893
AK
Is this really noticeable outside of when you take out the shock and play around? I get that drag is an issue for front forks but I never felt like that was a big issue at the rear. The Warden I tried was really fun.
I'd be thinking more along the lines of alignment, rather than bushings. If even one of those is a little misaligned, the drag would go up exponentially I'd think and there's simply more on that bike that has to be perfectly aligned. Bushing drag is nothing at normal leverage ratios IMO.
 

Happymtb.fr

Turbo Monkey
Feb 9, 2016
1,954
1,317
SWE
My Turner Sultan with only bushings is very nice as long as the bushings are cleaned and greased. I agree with Jm that alignment is more important
 

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
11,465
1,679
Warsaw :/
I'd be thinking more along the lines of alignment, rather than bushings. If even one of those is a little misaligned, the drag would go up exponentially I'd think and there's simply more on that bike that has to be perfectly aligned. Bushing drag is nothing at normal leverage ratios IMO.
Yeah It's just if that was a huge issue people would raise it and people who ride them would feel it.

I get knocking knolly on useless overcomplication. That's fair but the drag issue seems to be fairly hypothetical. I'd rather dunk on companies designing bikes around production quality tolerances they can't meet at their factories.

Also I'd still go with bearings over bushings but I'm biased and I think every bike should run on big beefy bearings.
 

HardtailHack

used an iron once
Jan 20, 2009
6,917
5,881
My Turner Sultan with only bushings is very nice as long as the bushings are cleaned and greased. I agree with Jm that alignment is more important
I remember talking to a Turner dealer and he said he had to run different thickness shims at the pivots because the frames weren't aligned all that well.

My trusty old Corsair would spit the seal on the pivot around the BB after not very long. The super stiff misaligned frame was brutal on bearings.

Current bike still has a noise and I think it is coming from the Cane Creek headset used as the main pivot. I need to pull it apart to see how it works, CC headset bearings wear in to the cups a bit as they move around. So hopefully there are shims I can remove......
I like hardtails.
 

slimshady

¡Mira, una ardilla!
Rob hopefully will sell that frame, shock and gearbox for $4000 or less. But I am not holding my breathe.....
... and the official presentations are airing now


 
Last edited:
Feb 21, 2020
865
1,221
SoCo Western Slope
Rob hopefully will sell that frame, shock and gearbox for $4000 or less. But I am not holding my breathe.....
Did they fix the pedaling issue from the 1st gen where it felt like the chain was a rubber band?

I'm interested in a G3 with a lift being 30 minutes up the hill....still have not ridden a DH bike that handled the chunk like that first gen 26" Zerode did 10+ years ago. :rockout:
 

djjohnr

Turbo Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
3,052
1,767
Northern California
Is this really noticeable outside of when you take out the shock and play around? I get that drag is an issue for front forks but I never felt like that was a big issue at the rear. The Warden I tried was really fun.
Hard to tell. The rear never felt like it moved as quickly when riding as many of the other bikes I've owned, however I have no idea how much the drag from the bushings accounted for that. I've had other bikes with bushings, but those all used bushings at one pivot, not multiple like the knolly did.
 

mykel

closer to Periwinkle
Apr 19, 2013
5,198
3,943
sw ontario canada
Hard to tell. The rear never felt like it moved as quickly when riding as many of the other bikes I've owned, however I have no idea how much the drag from the bushings accounted for that. I've had other bikes with bushings, but those all used bushings at one pivot, not multiple like the knolly did.
I have had a few Knolly's.

07 Delirium-T - broken.
09 Delirium-T - warranty replacement.
10 Delirium
13 Podium
14 Endorphin
19 Fugitive LT

The only one with any issues was the 2014 Endorphin. It was a bit tight. New bushings helped, but you could still feel the drag. Having said that, it would cycle fully under its own weight. All of the other have been good, cycle freely with no play. The Endo was bought used, the Podium was Knolly's owners personal bike and the final pre-production prototype. All the others were bought new. The absolute best is the Podium, that one moves like butter, next would be the Fugitive, followed by the 2010 Delirium, then the DT's, and finally the Endo. I would imagine the Podium being so good is because of its pedigree. The Endo was raced by a Knolly grass-roots rider. Maybe it was tweaked a bit and that is why it was a bit stiffer. Anyway I have never felt that the rear end could not keep up on any of the bikes.

/coolstorybro
 

djjohnr

Turbo Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
3,052
1,767
Northern California
I have had a few Knolly's.

07 Delirium-T - broken.
09 Delirium-T - warranty replacement.
10 Delirium
13 Podium
14 Endorphin
19 Fugitive LT

The only one with any issues was the 2014 Endorphin. It was a bit tight. New bushings helped, but you could still feel the drag. Having said that, it would cycle fully under its own weight. All of the other have been good, cycle freely with no play. The Endo was bought used, the Podium was Knolly's owners personal bike and the final pre-production prototype. All the others were bought new. The absolute best is the Podium, that one moves like butter, next would be the Fugitive, followed by the 2010 Delirium, then the DT's, and finally the Endo. I would imagine the Podium being so good is because of its pedigree. The Endo was raced by a Knolly grass-roots rider. Maybe it was tweaked a bit and that is why it was a bit stiffer. Anyway I have never felt that the rear end could not keep up on any of the bikes.

/coolstorybro
Mine could have been alignment of my particular frame. The rear would definitely not cycle under it's own weight - not even close.
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,646
4,968
Australia
1679345241705.png


Commencal proto enduro looking more ready for final release. Along with TRP drivetrain and brakes and maybe the new Schwalbe tyre on the back there.
 

Avy

Turbo Monkey
Jan 24, 2006
1,208
405
Hey all,I was just dream shopping for a Fatty and was lookin at Reeb as Avy Loves Steel. My Lord,$2395 for a Steel frame? 4130 steel at that,not my first choice. That is what Surly uses. Strong,but not light and sure ain’t worth that kinda monies. Why the sliding drop outs? Single Speed is not ideal for this bike No? That price is an Insult.

Avy
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,646
4,968
Australia
Isn't that just an Addix Ultra soft Big Betty?

Edit: ah, nope, the center knobs form sort of a triangular pattern
Someone on Vital pointed out the name is visible in one shot. Something like Hunting Helen or whatever. All new tyre. Some kind of faster rolling Betty alternative maybe.
 

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
11,465
1,679
Warsaw :/
Hard to tell. The rear never felt like it moved as quickly when riding as many of the other bikes I've owned, however I have no idea how much the drag from the bushings accounted for that. I've had other bikes with bushings, but those all used bushings at one pivot, not multiple like the knolly did.
I mean it's still a bad idea I just wonder if it's really an issue that affects riding not "dry" testing and parking lots. I would still prefer to what was on my legend as it had no drag at all but I'm still surprised that frame isn't more expensive given how well it's made.
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,993
20,123
Canaderp
I mean it's still a bad idea I just wonder if it's really an issue that affects riding not "dry" testing and parking lots. I would still prefer to what was on my legend as it had no drag at all but I'm still surprised that frame isn't more expensive given how well it's made.
They've definitely gone up in price over the years. A Banshee Legend frame with shock is priced at $4100cdn now.

All the V3 frames also had a price jump, over the V2's.
 

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
11,465
1,679
Warsaw :/
They've definitely gone up in price over the years. A Banshee Legend frame with shock is priced at $4100cdn now.

All the V3 frames also had a price jump, over the V2's.
Missed that. The OG price was sub $3000 in 2010 so it's probably in line with inflation but the basket construction and ti pivot axles are probably not lowering production costs on them. If I had to rebuy a DH bike it would still probably be a legend
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,993
20,123
Canaderp
Missed that. The OG price was sub $3000 in 2010 so it's probably in line with inflation but the basket construction and ti pivot axles are probably not lowering production costs on them. If I had to rebuy a DH bike it would still probably be a legend
Yeah you used to be able to get a Banshee frame for quite cheap.

The v1 Spitfire I had was purchased for $1500 with shock.

V2 Rune frame I picked up a few years ago was I believe around $1800 or so.

Now the V3 frames are a stout $3100ish Canadian.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
19,253
9,893
AK
Why the sliding drop outs?

Avy
Because F-you. Sliding dropouts maybe for different tire sizes so you can put a smaller one in there and put the wheel closer, but IME, sliding dropouts are a horrible way to do this. My $500 chinese frame has two dropout positions, one for big tires and one for really big tires (the biggest they make). There are two brake mounts and switching everything takes less than 5 min.
 

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
11,465
1,679
Warsaw :/
Yeah you used to be able to get a Banshee frame for quite cheap.

The v1 Spitfire I had was purchased for $1500 with shock.

V2 Rune frame I picked up a few years ago was I believe around $1800 or so.

Now the V3 frames are a stout $3100ish Canadian.
The Legends were considerably more than the rest of their offer but that's because the Legend was a fair bit more expensive to produce. I think Titan is closest to it. $3100 is rough. I paid $4000 for an ohlins equipped YT Capra. Frame only offers in 2023 seem to be available only to 40+ year old ppl with good jobs or young pple who can spend all their income on bikes since they have no other expenses.