Rear wheel play.

sanjuro · Feb 17, 2006

rooftest said:
A few weeks ago, I bought my first road bike (a LeMond.)

Tonight, I've noticed that there's some play in the rear wheel - I can easily move the rim from side to side (a few mm each way; accompanied by a clicking sound) with my hand.

The rims and hubs are Bontrager Race Lite - I've got the quick release tightened right, and there doesn't seem to be any movement in the hub.

Any suggestions?

The QR wouldn't do much. Take the wheel off and feel each side of the axle. You might have to take the cassette off to get a good feel of the right side.

ito · Feb 17, 2006

Is it slipping while you ride?

If so your description sounds the same as about 10 others I've heard, so I'm guessing that is it. Race Lites had a problem this past year with a driveside bearing disinegrating. Take it into the shop you bought it from and they should be able to fix it up.

Also, just so you know, most wheels will move a few mm's if you torque on them with your hands while they are clamped in the dropouts. Usually they don't click though.

The Ito

AustinM · Feb 17, 2006

Probably just the bearings or the cones need tightening. LBS should be able to fix it easily.

JRB · Feb 17, 2006

Aren't the hubs on there DT sealed hubs of some sort??? I doubt they have cups and cones. It will likely need a new bearing pressed in.

JRB · Feb 17, 2006

They are sealed, but could still have something for tension. It's worth looking at.

Race Lite

*

Low profile, eyeletted rim for improved ride charateristics
*

Easily convertible between Shimano and Campagnolo
*

Sealed cartridge bearing hubs for increased durability
*

Bladed, stainless steel spokes with E-coating makes these wheels look great
*

Alloy locking nipples
*

US Pat 5,931,544

JRB · Feb 17, 2006

If it's a DT Onyx hub, like I am thinking, here is a PDF link that will show you what makes the hub up. It may have a little adjustability.

http://www.dtswiss.com/data/files/MAN_EN_50215101788.pdf

ito · Feb 17, 2006

loco said:
If it's a DT Onyx hub, like I am thinking, here is a PDF link that will show you what makes the hub up. It may have a little adjustability.

http://www.dtswiss.com/data/files/MAN_EN_50215101788.pdf

I don't think they are DT hubs, however you can service them with the DT hub kit. They also use the same bearings. as far as I can recall there is no adjustability on them, you just press in the sealed cartriges.

Most Trek dealers are aware of the problem and have a set of tools to fix it, hope it works out for you.

The Ito

JRB · Feb 17, 2006

ito said:
I don't think they are DT hubs, however you can service them with the DT hub kit. They also use the same bearings. as far as I can recall there is no adjustability on them, you just press in the sealed cartriges.

Most Trek dealers are aware of the problem and have a set of tools to fix it, hope it works out for you.

The Ito

What's the axle nut for if they don't adjust??? Don't know if it's anything, but it seems weird. So they are not just relabeled DTs??? I know the high end wheels use 240s, so I assumed that these were lower end DTs.

I'm with Ito though. Go to the shop first.

JRB · Feb 17, 2006

More from the Bontrager site -

Road Wheel Troubleshooting

Front or Rear Symptom Problem Possible Cause Remedy Guidelines

Rear Rough or tight rotating freehub body Contaminated or Defective Freehub body
1) Disassemble and lubricate freehub body as specified in the service manual for a given hub model.
2) Replace cassette body if possible. Consult service manual regarding freehub body removal procedures for a specific model hub.
3) Contact technical service representative

Front Wheel makes a creaking noise when pedaling out of the saddle

1) Squeaky Skewer
a) Lubricate skewer lever at the silver barrel nut and at the delrin washer interface with a tacky oil.
b) Contact technical service representative. Front and Rear Wheel emits a creaking noise or pinging noise

2) Dirty / Dry metal interfaces on wheel
a) Lubricate all metal to metal contacts - (rim/nipples, spoke/spoke, spoke/hub flange)
b) Insert small pieces of teflon tape at spoke crossing interfaces
c) Contact technical service representative.

3) Low spoke tension
a) Verify spoke tension as specified in the technical service manual.
b) If spoke tensions are low, lubricate nipples and adjust tensions as specified in the technical service manual.
c) Contact technical service representative.

Front and Rear Wheel emits a creak once per wheel revolution while coasting

Weld insert is loose in rim
1) Apply a lubricant to the inside of the rim in the location of the weld insert
2) Contact technical service representative.

Bearing and Hub Issues

Rear Rough freehub body with axle play Broken bearing cup inside freehub body. Replace part and bearing, TCG # 72679, consult technical service manual. Front Rough Bearing Worn or contaminated bearing or poor bearing fit into shell If the bearing feels rough to rotate when it is removed from the hub shell, replace the bearing with a matching bearing model. If the bearing feels good upon removing from the hubshell, the bearing seat in hubshell is probably mis-sized. Contact technical service representative.

Rear Rough Bearing (Right side likely) Worn or contaminated bearing or poor bearing fit into shell If the bearing feels rough to rotate when it is removed from the hub shell, replace the bearing with a matching bearing model. If the bearing feels good upon removing from the hubshell, the bearing seat in hubshell is probably mis-sized. Contact technical service representative.

Front and Rear Wheel keeps coming out of true Locking mechanism between the nipple and spoke is not working properly.
1) Verify that there are no dents or untrueable bends in the rim. If there are - recommend a rim replacement.
2) Identify loose spoke. Completely loosen spoke from nipple and apply a locking compound and bring wheel to correct tension as specified in the technical service manual. Use the correct locking mechanism as specified for a given model wheel.
3) Contact service representative.

Front and Rear Not able to turn nipples Nipple oxidized onto the spoke
1) Apply generous lubricant to the spoke / nipple interface. Attempt to turn nipple while holding the spoke to prevent the spoke from turning.
2) Replace all nipples with anodized finish nipple. This should only be attempted by an authorized service center.
3) Contact service representative.

Rear Play in Hub Loose fit Left Bearing
1) Remove left side shell bearing as specified in technical service manual. Loctite the bearing into the shell.
2) Contact service representative.

Pro series hubs Replacement bearings Normal wear
New model : front (2 x 6802), rear (4 x 6902).
Old model : front (2 x 6802), rear (right side shell 3802, all rest 6902)

JRB · Feb 17, 2006

More Bontrager hub stuff - I am impressed that they posted all of this.

http://www.bontrager.com/assets/File_Listings/asset_upload_file335_970.pdf

What year model are the wheels?

JRB · Feb 17, 2006

If they are loose again, I would try the loctite trick with blue loctite, even though I think that is a lame fix for something like that. Can you post a close up pic of your hub later?

ito · Feb 17, 2006

loco said:
What's the axle nut for if they don't adjust??? Don't know if it's anything, but it seems weird. So they are not just relabeled DTs??? I know the high end wheels use 240s, so I assumed that these were lower end DTs.

I'm with Ito though. Go to the shop first.

http://www2.bontrager.com/images/products/x-large/250690.jpg

These are the wheels, they don't look like any DT hub I know. I believe the end caps just come off, they don't offer any tension adjust. I know on the X Lites there is a 5mm hex adjustment, similar to that on other wheels. Don't think the Lites have them.

DT Swiss has the slowest website ever.....ya I am positive they aren't DT's.

The Ito

EDIT: I'd take it back to the shop if it doesn't turn out right after your ride. Trek should cover that stuff.

JRB · Feb 17, 2006

ito said:
http://www2.bontrager.com/images/products/x-large/250690.jpg

These are the wheels, they don't look like any DT hub I know. I believe the end caps just come off, they don't offer any tension adjust. I know on the X Lites there is a 5mm hex adjustment, similar to that on other wheels. Don't think the Lites have them.

DT Swiss has the slowest website ever.....ya I am positive they aren't DT's.

The Ito

EDIT: I'd take it back to the shop if it doesn't turn out right after your ride. Trek should cover that stuff.

Yeah - those don't look like DT hubs there. The older ones were though, correct? Am I high???

LordOpie · Feb 17, 2006

rooftest said:
I just got back from the LBS - most of the problem (the clicking) was caused by loose screws in the frame...

WTF? Dude, I would exchange the bike in whole. Even if the shop was sure the frame was safe, I would be too hesistant to ride it.

I suppose that's one of the problems with multi-material frames?

ito · Feb 17, 2006

LordOpie said:
WTF? Dude, I would exchange the bike in whole. Even if the shop was sure the frame was safe, I would be too hesistant to ride it.

I suppose that's one of the problems with multi-material frames?

Well, there aren't any screws holding together the Lemond frames. Perhaps he means water bottle cage bolts? I know those can make some funny noises. Regardless, a shop should make sure things like that are tight and not going to move before selling a bike.

Could you clear up the loose screw things?

The Ito

LordOpie · Feb 17, 2006

yeah, I did think the spine frames were glued, so I dunno.

That said... steel is real :blah:

LordOpie · Mar 6, 2006

is the wheel damaged due to the bike being assembled improperly? If so, maybe they should give you a completely new wheel.

Changleen · Mar 6, 2006

They're clearly machine built wheels. That is a common problem with such things.

Roof, I think you should try a little home wrenching yourself. The things you have described arn't to hard to fix with the right tools and a bit of time and effort.

Arsbars · Mar 6, 2006

loco said:
If they are loose again, I would try the loctite trick with blue loctite, even though I think that is a lame fix for something like that. Can you post a close up pic of your hub later?

Try green loctite (there's two & I can't recall what number it is off hand) -- it is made for retaining cartridge bearings.

LordOpie · Mar 6, 2006

Changleen said:
The things you have described arn't to hard to fix with the right tools and a bit of time and effort.

you are, of course, right, but the issue is that the bike is only a month old (it was brand new purchased from a store, yeah?)

Changleen · Mar 6, 2006

rooftest said:
Changleen - you mean it's not George Bush's fault?

You seem to have a very shallow view of my politics. It's clearly Opie's fault.

Rear wheel play.

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