[dante]

So the debt limit deal has gotten me thinking about the overall civil war that's going on in the GOP right now... Last night the Republicans made it *worse* for themselves by rejecting Boehner's bill. If they'd sucked it up and passed it, it would have at least put the onus on the Democrats in the Senate, and they could have ended up with a stronger (for them) deal. After killing the current bill, however, it's obvious that whatever passes is going to be with a small (30) number of Moderate Republicans and all of the Democrats. Suddenly it's going to be a far more bitter pill for the TeaTards to swallow. Similarly to the Health Care Debate, the "I'm taking my ball and going home" ends up with you getting *less* than if you'd stayed at the negotiating table.

So this got me thinking: Was the rejection of Boehner's bill an attempt by the Tea Party to strangle the moderate Republican leadership and exert control over the entire party? Are they willing to take casualties (like the debt-ceiling debate) just to drive the knife into their own leadership? Are they trying to kill this to kill Boehner, so that Cantor, or some other TeaTard can assume control? I really am wondering if this is more about flat-out Civil War in the Republican party than any ideological aspects. The TeaTards saw Boehner have a moment of weakness and pounced, and the actual legislation doesn't matter...

And if so, what about any of the moderate members of the House? I know that House members have gotten more extreme lately, but what of any of the Moderates? If a hard-liner gets the Speaker's role (and decides what legislation gets to come to the floor, meaning that the House is going to take an even harder shift rightward), what are any of the moderates going to do? Shut up and sing with the rest of them? Balk? Form their own party? Ditch and side with the Democrats?

I was wondering how long it was going to take the Republicans to completely disintegrate while they were fighting for control... now I wonder whether that's what's happening right now?

 

[golgiaparatus]

One of the main reasons Washington is broken is because they care more about passing bills that gain them strategical political gains than they do passing bills with good ideas.

It's all a retarded chess match that's driven by partisan media coverage and fueled by the idiots that pay such close attention to it.

 

[stevew]

and here you thought republicans didn't think for themselves....

 

[jimmydean]

So this got me thinking: Was the rejection of Boehner's bill an attempt by the Tea Party to strangle the moderate Republican leadership and exert control over the entire party? Are they willing to take casualties (like the debt-ceiling debate) just to drive the knife into their own leadership? Are they trying to kill this to kill Boehner, so that Cantor, or some other TeaTard can assume control? I really am wondering if this is more about flat-out Civil War in the Republican party than any ideological aspects. The TeaTards saw Boehner have a moment of weakness and pounced, and the actual legislation doesn't matter...

Yes. Most of the tea baggers are single term. They are there to shake sh!t up while they can and if they get enough support, they will eat each other alive.

My only concern is if they get enough jackasses to back them, they might wind up with some actual power.

 

[stoney]

Do you know how he Republican party was formed? Google the Whig party.

 

[dante]

Yes. Most of the tea baggers are single term. They are there to shake sh!t up while they can and if they get enough support, they will eat each other alive.

My only concern is if they get enough jackasses to back them, they might wind up with some actual power.

They actually don't need a whole lot of jackasses... all they need is enough Republicans to get the Speaker's role, and then they can decide *exactly* which legislation comes to the floor, and which doesn't, and which amendments are allowed to be voted on, and which aren't. That would SUCK for anyone who wants to see the government accomplish anything....

Aaaaand it looks like Boehner just raised the white flag and surrendered to the Tea Party in a desperate attempt to keep his job. Boehner's re(re)vised bill now includes mandatory passage of a balanced budget amendment before the 2nd debt ceiling increase. It's the exact same bill that was passed earlier this week that the Senate already voted down. There's *no* way this is getting passed in the Senate, even just in "shell" form (ie, they take Boehner's bill, strip everything out and put their own bill in instead so that they fight it out in conference instead). The Senate is just going to discard this out of hand, pass their own bill on Sunday (night), give it to the House Republicans on Monday and dare them to vote it down.

If anything, what we're seeing is the complete distancing of corporate America from the Republican party.............

 

[dante]

By the way, it's hysterical how BO can jam the phone lines at the capital with just a quick mention in a press conference and a tweet. It's not called the "bully pulpit" for nothing...

 

[Beef Supreme]

Ideology uber alles.

 

[eaterofdog]

This is only the beginning.

 

[rockofullr]

This whole thing is now officially out of hand.

 

[Pesqueeb]

 

[$tinkle]

I was wondering how long it was going to take the Republicans to completely disintegrate while they were fighting for control...

keep wondering

 

[dante]

Lol.

Rep. David Dreier of California said the revised measure would still raise the nation's debt limit by $900 billion _ essential to allow the government to keep paying its bills _ and cut spending by $917 billion. But a later increase in borrowing authority wouldn't take effect unless Congress sent a constitutional balanced budget amendment to the states for ratification.

Oh, I can see this going over *really* well.......

 

[$tinkle]

Oh, I can see this going over *really* well.......

what? it could happen

maybe not in *our* lifetime, but still

 

[dante]

what? it could happen

maybe not in *our* lifetime, but still

And the House GOP wants it to happen sometime in the next 6mo, or we'll default on all of our obligations...

 

[rockofullr]

keep wondering

lolwut?

The fact that Boehner had to rewrite the bill because he couldn't get his own party to line up behind him proves that the Republican "leadership" is no longer in charge.

I think the Newt-ster probably shed a tear today.

I am disappoint​

 

[$tinkle]

so the party leader shows leadership [which is acknowledged by members following him], and you use that as evidence of how ineffective he is, & how divided the party is?

that's an odd angle

oh, and newt's on a beach somewhere groping his 3rd wife's pre-cancerous fake rack (if the poolboy's done w/ her)

 

[dante]

The fact that Boehner had to rewrite the bill because he couldn't get his own party to line up behind him proves that the Republican "leadership" is no longer in charge.

What's funny is that there's no way Boehner can spin this as anything less than a complete loss of confidence in his leadership. They passed the balanced budget amendment bill earlier this week. Now that he couldn't get his own bill passed, he has to literally revert back to the one that was passed already just to get enough votes.

 

[rockofullr]

so the party leader shows leadership [which is acknowledged by members following him], and you use that as evidence of how ineffective he is, & how divided the party is?

that's an odd angle

Stink's glasses:

Boehner tried to lead but he failed. Now he is following the Teatards in an attempt to save face.

 

[$tinkle]

for comparison, how would you measure obama's leadership chops? he's got the bully pulpit, the senate is in his hip pocket...

what has he got done, either with or without republicans on board? i just want to know what 'leadership' looks like to you.

go ahead...say 'obl'....please...

 

[rockofullr]

for comparison, how would you measure obama's leadership chops? he's got the bully pulpit, the senate is in his hip pocket...

what has he got done, either with or without republicans on board? i just want to know what 'leadership' looks like to you.

go ahead...say 'obl'....please...

Try to change the subject all you want. Dems are lined up behind their man. Where are the Repubs? They cant even whip the freshmen members.

 

[jimmydean]

So real, it hurts.

 

[$tinkle]

Try to change the subject all you want. Dems are lined up behind their man. Where are the Repubs? They cant even whip the freshmen members.

when dems line up, they're what? principled?
and when republicans do it, they're what? ideologues?

and reid seems to have changed his mind on voting for a balanced budget amendment. is this, too, a parting from leadership?

i have no truck w/ boehner; reid, however, is a pathetic, wretched, stupid man, unworthy to change pelosi's dried up tampon

 

[Dogboy]

and when republicans do it, they're what? ideologues?

They aren't lining up. That's the point.

 

[dante]

Last I checked "leadership" didn't include deep-throating your subordinates....

 

[$tinkle]

They aren't lining up. That's the point.

i believe the point is there's some sort of civil war, which is not the same as short-sighted freshmen teatards getting uppity

Last I checked "leadership" didn't include deep-throating your subordinates....

we're talking about republicans here

/silver

 

[rockofullr]

when dems line up, they're what? principled?
and when republicans do it, they're what? ideologues?

Obama and friends have done what reasonable people do when a difference of opinion arises and must be overcome. Offer a compromise; you give a little on taxes and we give a little on spending. Sounds good to me!

Bhoehner can't compromise with Democrats because he has to compromise with hard liners in his own party first.

i believe the point is there's some sort of civil war, which is not the same as short-sighted freshmen teatards getting uppity
we're talking about republicans here

/silver

short-sighted freshmen teatards getting uppity and starting a civil war

Republican leadership can't let this go without handing someone their a$$.

 

[dante]

we're talking about republicans here

/silver

Mark Foley?

 

[zdubyadubya]

Obama and friends have done what reasonable people do when a difference of opinion arises and must be overcome. Offer a compromise; you give a little on taxes and we give a little on spending. Sounds good to me!

Bhoehner can't compromise with Democrats because he has to compromise with hard liners in his own party first.

This. A million times. My thoughts/sentiments exactly. The very fact that the tea-tards are saying that "there will be no compromise" shows that a) they have no fvckin clue how government works and b)the GOP big wigs can't control their pets

 

[Beef Supreme]

What's funny is that there's no way Boehner can spin this as anything less than a complete loss of confidence in his leadership. They passed the balanced budget amendment bill earlier this week. Now that he couldn't get his own bill passed, he has to literally revert back to the one that was passed already just to get enough votes.

This would pretty much be known as Thursday in the Democratic Party. Hell, we would have single payer health care if Reid and Pelosi could get their members to get in line.

I can't believe I am defending Boehner. I feel icky.

 

[Beef Supreme]

and reid seems to have changed his mind on voting for a balanced budget amendment. is this, too, a parting from leadership?

The devil is in the details. An amendment to balance the budget is one thing, an amendment to cripple government is another.

 

[dante]

The devil is in the details. An amendment to balance the budget is one thing, an amendment to cripple government is another.

Can you imagine if we'd had a balanced budget in 2000 so Bush couldn't have done any of his wars/tax cuts/etc?


Oh that's right, the GOP specifically exempts wars and tax cuts from their balanced budget amendment............

 

[rockofullr]

This would pretty much be known as Thursday in the Democratic Party. Hell, we would have single payer health care if Reid and Pelosi could get their members to get in line.

I can't believe I am defending Boehner. I feel icky.

Indeed. For years the divided Democrats have battled a monolithicly united GOP. Seems maybe the tables have turned (at a fairly inopportune moment for all us little people).

 

[jimmydean]

Indeed. For years the divided Democrats have battled a monolithicly united GOP. Seems maybe the tables have turned (at a fairly inopportune moment for all us little people).

Is there a GOOD time for government implosion?

 

[rockofullr]

^^^^

When we don't need them to be paying the bills.

Like my grandfather always said, "The best thing a politician can do is nothing at all" lol