[DHperu]

hey guys....i just got sent a brand spankin new marzocchi roco rc shock, put it on the bike and the rebound damping doesnt work at all. shock is like a pogo stick. unfortunatly im in Peru so going to a local marzocchi service place or whatever is out of my power, so i just wanted to see if there´s a quick fix to this problem like replacing an O ring or something like that. the rebound knob does not rotate freely as one guy posted on mtbr so this could be something else..

holla if anybody knows how to help out!

thanks people

 

[manwithgun]

post removed to prevent rumor mill ****storm... our shock may have been cycled at low psi. Boosting to 220 made little difference.

 

[evilbob]

2 questions:

1) Does it have at least 185 psi in it?

2) Is it completely full of oil?

I know it is not a platform shock but all shocks with a gas resevoir can suffer from loss of compression and/or rebound functions if they do not at least have a mininum pressure in them (mininum pressure is different for different shocks). If the minunum pressure is not in the shock it just wants to move the oil around a little without it going through the valving correctly. If the pressure is too low and the compression is set incorrectly it could possibly push more oil into the resevoir than it is supposed too as the shock rebounds it just cycles the oil back into the body. A low pressure charge can cause severe cavitation allowing air past the shaft seal which if pressurized would still leave a condition of an incomplete oil fill. Too little oil or too much air in the oil can cause the shock to loss controle and adjustability.

Just some thoughts as this is the way mine came also. I let the pressure out all the way. Then removed the bleed screw. Burped the air out and topped the oil. Then I put the bleed screw back in, charged the shock to the recomended range (185 to 225) and it works perfectly. Good luck and don't give up on your ROCO shock, it truely is amazing when set up properly.

 

[funkendrenchman]

nevermind... you already ruled out what someone else said.

 

[offtheedge]

I got the same problem. I mounted it, set the sag and low and behold absolutely no rebound control, that and the fact that the adjustment knob turns for shyte is only compounded by the design of the knob.

now i have to say the shock ruled out on the mountain. it ate up drops and square edge hits without being bouncy, but i guess as with any Marz product i have had........must add oil!

thanks evilbob

 

[DHperu]

sure enough...the shock came with just a few drops of oil..no wonder it wasnt damping....thanks zocchi

thanks for the help people, i´ll be trying out the shock this weekend...
the verdict from the parking lot test was that it felt sort of like an avy, very buttery travel a la 888

 

[evilbob]

.......... it felt sort of like an avy, very buttery travel a la 888

Oh yea, that's it!

 

[cogs]

Does anyone have any documents on how to install new oil? What tools...etc? I cannot find anything on Marzocchi's website...

 

[offtheedge]

did a rebuild/add oil last night and good god things feel good now. Since every Zocchi i have owned needed the oil topped off theres no need to whine, but I will give it to them for making the shock so easy to service.

 

[in the trees]

Does anyone have any documents on how to install new oil? What tools...etc? I cannot find anything on Marzocchi's website...

I'd like some more inof on this, too. Where's Brian P?

toby

 

[offtheedge]

remove spring
let air out, compress shock and let air out again
remove bleed screw..i.e. phillips head on backside of air chamber end
pump out any old oil
fill with new oil and pressurize
cycle shock a few times then bleed air, top off oil and pressurize
the end

 

[evilbob]

I love it when simple things work. On my Demo 9 the bleed screw is accessable when the bike is turned upsidedown. In this position the air that does build up migrates to the area where the bleed port is. So for me I just release the pressure charge. Flip the bike over and walk away for about 10 minutes or so. Take the bleed screw out and with something like a cattle syringe put oil back in to displace the air. Put the screw back in charge the shock and bouncy bouncy. If I don't here it sucking air through the valves everything is primo at that point. If there is air, depending on how bad it is I may burp the shock again. That's just general maintenance. Whenever it sounds like it has air inside the oil just burp it. Stratos used to have a good shock burp instruction on their site for the Helix Pro, I don't know if it is still there but could be worth a check for those who want to look. The ROCO is by far the easiest shock to work on and maintain and if maintained on a regular basis should give the highest levels of performance for a long time. When seal kits become available I will be ordering 2 for mine, no more waiting for shocks sent back to the manufacture causing down time.

 

[cogs]

remove spring
let air out, compress shock and let air out again
remove bleed screw..i.e. phillips head on backside of air chamber end
pump out any old oil
fill with new oil and pressurize
cycle shock a few times then bleed air, top off oil and pressurize
the end

What did you use to fill the shock with oil (tools?) and what oil did you use?

 

[offtheedge]

$2 plastic syringe and 10wt non-synthetic oil.

I don't know what brand/weight Marz recomends, so i'm just telling you what i did, not what you should do.

hopefully someone from Marz will chime in here.

 

[evilbob]

I use Spectro Golden Suspension Fluid (ultra light) for my ROCO and Golden Spectro Cartridge Fork Fluid (125/150) for my 888

 

[OhTeeBee]

Excellent info here! Thanks to all who posted. Now I can at least get my Roco Rollin like it should!

Thanks again!!!:dancing:

 

[erikkellison]

So when you all have your Roco's rebound cranked on slow, does it rebount kinda slow, or SLOW like my 888? My Roco just doesn't move that slowly. It sounds good, doesn't make any sounds of any kind (my 888 actually makes that sucking sound when rebounding), but it just doesn't seem like "all slow" is actually all that slow. I'm thinking of bleeding it, but I want to be sure that there's actually something wrong, and that it's not just me.
For what it's worth, it's on a VP-Free, 450lb spring, I weigh 185, the compression is all the way out, and the pressure is at 200 psi. Though, I just put air in it. Apparently it had none, and I rode it 3 times like this.

 

[jonKranked]

i'm confused by your statement - is yours rebounding too slow or too fast?


if its too slow, take out all the pressure, and let it sit for a while. Turn it upside and take the oil screw out and burp it (let it sit upside for a while to get all the remaining air out) then remove a small amount of oil. Do it incrementally or you'll find yourself having to add oil.


if its too fast, add oil. I'd recommend replacing all of the oil at the same time.

 

[erikkellison]

I think it's rebounding too slow (just kidding, fast!! Not slow, what was I thinking when I wrote that? - It's too dang fast!), but I was just reading a thread about the VP-Free. Apparently a falling rate of compression is directly related to a rising rate of rebound (duh). So maybe the fact that I push down on the shock and it rebounds pretty quick is just part of that rising rebound effect. Anyone else out there with a Roco on a Free?

 

[Eren]

didnt read the thread so i dont know what everyone said, but i had the same problem theres a thread inside the rebound knob for an allen wrench a 5mm i believe use it to change the rebound, worked for me

 

[erikkellison]

The adjustment has some effect, but not much. Overall it's just too fast. I can hardly get my hand in there to adjust it. I will look for an adjuster, and get back.

 

[nycurse]

$2 plastic syringe and 10wt non-synthetic oil.

I don't know what brand/weight Marz recomends, so i'm just telling you what i did, not what you should do.

hopefully someone from Marz will chime in here.

thats to heavy of oil. its 2.5 oil that is stock

 

[offtheedge]

thats to heavy of oil. its 2.5 oil that is stock

have you felt my shock?
There is no right or wrong here, all oils have different viscosities and depending on spring rate, rider weight, frame and liking how would you know what is right or wrong?

we've already established that the stock oil is worthless and I have put all three weights of proper shock oil in it. I've ridden the shock with; 5, 7.5 and 10 weight. I now have dropped my spring rate by 200lbs and used 10wt(which to me is seems about like 7.5wt) before I've gotten the shock to stop kicking back

 

[ElTORO]

The guys at MZ us a bath to bleed the ROCO's I have a pic of it some where at home. The Tech. said when he goes up to whistler he use's a bucket full of oil to bleed. (IT MAKES SURE NO AIR GET'S IN THE SYSTEM) They used to do it like explained above, but was a pain and did not always come out that well.

Also check your rebound Knobs for OVER locktight. Most off the shelfs had this prob. could not get full adj. of rebound. 2/4 in my crew had the prob. of over locktight. If yours is rebout is to fast on the highest setting you prob. have this prob.

 

[Brian Peterson]

To you guys talking about using 10wt in the ROCO... According to my techs who just had to rebuild somebody's ROCO after reading about that here... Just say no.

Brian

 

[evilbob]

Thanks for the update on this Brian. I think allot of people think shock and fork fluid viscosities are supposed to be the same.....they are not. Incase anyone is wondering the fluid I use is Spectro Golden Suspension Fluid (ultra light) which is about a 2.5wt and specific for the sealed conditions in a shock (not fork fluid). Even most Moto shocks run a much lighter oil in their shocks than in forks. Moto shock fluid also must perform at higher temperature levels than fork fluid so there may be some differences there also as forks never see the temps that Moto shocks do.

 

[offtheedge]

thanks Brian.

Bob whats your weight and spring rate?

 

[vitox]

Thanks for the update on this Brian. I think allot of people think shock and fork fluid viscosities are supposed to be the same.....they are not. Incase anyone is wondering the fluid I use is Spectro Golden Suspension Fluid (ultra light) which is about a 2.5wt and specific for the sealed conditions in a shock (not fork fluid). Even most Moto shocks run a much lighter oil in their shocks than in forks. Moto shock fluid also must perform at higher temperature levels than fork fluid so there may be some differences there also as forks never see the temps that Moto shocks do.

ditto to that, if there is a place where an extra 5 bucks or so goes a long way, this is it. ask for shock specific fluid (RSF) or at least use high end (racing) fork fluid.

 

[J5ive]

To you guys talking about using 10wt in the ROCO... According to my techs who just had to rebuild somebody's ROCO after reading about that here... Just say no.

Brian

Surely you can't blame the user when you advertise the shock as 'user servicable' and yet provide no documentation?

 

[davep]

Surely you can't blame the user when you advertise the shock as 'user servicable' and yet provide no documentation?

No $hit!!!

Marzocchi has become THE worst at documentation. At the very best you get a google-ish translation from italian of the most basic "don't do this" with a fork. EVERY other fork Mfg has tech info available on their web sites EXCEPT Marz.

Look at R.S, still mfg over seas and trying to fight off a legacy of poor quility and performance.... BUT they hava a full tech catalog available to ANYONE! Cad drawings, exploded diagrams with part numbers, tech set-up suggestions, spring weights and recomendations, and full maintainance instructions. Any info that you could want is available.

Even through a wholesale distributor I can not get tech info. The latest that I have found currently available is 2003.

If you buy a Marz, you had better be mech inclined, and a do-it-your self-er, as they will offer NO help! Once you buy it, you are on you own!



For the others...about oils!!!! read this!! http://www.peterverdonedesigns.com/lowspeed.htm

When you are done, go to the top directory and start reading more.

 

[J5ive]

Its pretty average Marzocchi.

My 06 Fox float I just unwrapped comes with a CD full of data! And the 06 boxxer range of guides are brillant. Manitou is a little ****ty, but its there at least.

 

[evilbob]

thanks Brian.

Bob whats your weight and spring rate?

I am about 220lbs and run a 450lb RCS Ti spring on a med Demo 9 with 1 stock and 1 heavy spring in an 05 888 with a compression sleeve.

 

[vitox]

Surely you can't blame the user when you advertise the shock as 'user servicable' and yet provide no documentation?

it dont look to me like any blaming is going on, he's just pointing out what others are saying, the shock uses a less viscous oil thats all.

as for the tech documentation being inexistant, too true, lets hope it was a glitch since for the shock it would be tremendously useful.

 

[J5ive]

It sounded like 'stupid people on the internet trying to hack the system using the wrong materials and in turn stuffing the shock'. Maybe thats just my interpretation.

 

[nycurse]

remove spring
let air out, compress shock and let air out again
remove bleed screw..i.e. phillips head on backside of air chamber end
pump out any old oil
fill with new oil and pressurize
cycle shock a few times then bleed air, top off oil and pressurize
the end

how do you pressurize it?

 

[offtheedge]

how do you pressurize it?

ehhhhhh, shock pump, and as mentioned 10wt. is too heavy. if the rebound won't slow the shock down the knob is stuck. turn it from the back side with a screwdriver.

 

[dandurston]

remove spring
let air out, compress shock and let air out again
remove bleed screw..i.e. phillips head on backside of air chamber end
pump out any old oil
fill with new oil and pressurize
cycle shock a few times then bleed air, top off oil and pressurize
the end

I've got a Roco TST coming my way in the mail and I'm just trying to understand this procedure so I can check things when it gets here. My question is, once I've removed the bleed screw and pumped out the old oil, do I fill it up completely with new oil? or just fill it up to a certain line or point? And then when you say 'pressurize', do you mean add a bit of air? or pump it right up? I don't understand why you'd pressurize the shock before you cycle it. Wouldn't that just make it harder to cycle?

 

[jonKranked]

to cycle it and change the oil, you wanna do it in a full submersion bath to prevent air from getting cycled into the shock and reservoir. You can cycle the shock piston into an empty container if you wanna get all the old oil out, but don't move it if its out of an oil bath. If you are doing a complete oil flush you're gonna wanna cycle the shock while in the submersion bath for about half an hour to get all the oil out. This is straight from a Marzocchi tech guy.

After this put the bleed screw back in, then pressurize it with the a shock pump to 185 minimum, more air pressure (up to around 225psi i think is the max) will just give you more rebound resistance if i'm not mistaken.


FWIW I'm currently using 7.5 wt oil and I find it to be too slow for my liking, I'm gonna drop down to 5wt and if thats still to slow then I'm gonna do 2.5wt (which is actually what Marzocchi recommends and puts into the shock stock).

 

[dandurston]

Okay so the idea is to have the shock 100% full of oil. What if (hypothetically) I cycled it unsubmerged and sucked a bunch of air in? Would the fix be as simple as just re-doing this step with it submerged to cycle out the air?

Also, thanks for the info about 185/225psi being the min/max. That seems like sort of a narrow range but I imagine it works fine. Are there any guides online on how to dial in the Roco TST in terms of air pressure, preload, rebound damping etc.?

Oh, and how can I tell if my shock is fine or needs to be filled? Can I just pop out the bleed screw and look for an air pocket?

 

[offtheedge]

Okay so the idea is to have the shock 100% full of oil. What if (hypothetically) I cycled it unsubmerged and sucked a bunch of air in? Would the fix be as simple as just re-doing this step with it submerged to cycle out the air?

Also, thanks for the info about 185/225psi being the min/max. That seems like sort of a narrow range but I imagine it works fine. Are there any guides online on how to dial in the Roco TST in terms of air pressure, preload, rebound damping etc.?

Oh, and how can I tell if my shock is fine or needs to be filled? Can I just pop out the bleed screw and look for an air pocket?

the shock will have a top out knock....a dead spot at the end of rebound if it has air in it. if this happens just redo the submerged steps until it's gone.