[JeffKill]

That said, there's a LOT of trails out there that people don't know about. What if those trails become as popular as the main ones? They'll be closed, that's what. And even if saying the name won't get people on the trail, telling them to meet you there saturday at 9 AM certainly will. All I'm saying is unmarked, potentially questionable trails+convoy truckloads of downhillers=shut down trails.

I'm glad you enjoy the trails, and I'm glad they were shown to you, just as they were to me, but there's a difference between taking a friend out for a tour and posting an open invitation to anyone with internet access.

First off, those other trails werent mentioned in your post. Thats why I only spoke of wilsons. Second, posting to meet at 9 am is pretty damn vague. Did we give directions?? And last, I myself have never given an open invitation to anyone and everyone on here. The only time I ever said anything remotely close was in reply to Butch when he asked if he was welcome to ride with us if he showed up. At that point I simply said anyone who shows up is welcome to ride with us. "Anyone" meaning the people who were already discussing the ride in that particular thread. Nobody new showed up for that ride.

 

[drkenan]

Those XC riders on MTBR are pretty disrespectful if you ask me. In an effort to meet new riders I once went to their "Fall Gathering" and it was pretty bunk for a DH/Freerider. Lots of talk of climbing and spandex.

Anyway, I doubt anyone will be riding Bad Fork again so maybe we can just drop it? And taking people to Wilson's Creek will continue and will be perfectly fine so stop worrying and talking and blaming people for showing others a good time.

 

[FCLinder]

I'm not trying to SLAM Cecil. I'm trying to use it as an example of just how serious the FS is about poaching.

Butch I am a little confused here? You posted you are trying not to Slam me? Please correct me if I am wrong but it looks as you are in this post on MTBR. Am I wrong?

Hey...just to give you a heads up that 99% of the guys on that ride didn't know it was illegal. They were ALL from out of town...but the organizer who ran them there should have known better. He ain't on the bright side of life and if you've ever met him I don't have to give much detail for you to understand that one.

 

[JohnBoy]

I dont understand what posting a group ride at Wilsons creek has to do with a trail being poached by a group of people? The trails we have had bigger groups on, are all legal and public trails, and are in no danger of being shut down that I know of. And maybe Im just reading it wrong but from reading your(T-pirate) last two posts it almost seems like you've got some kind of problem with us posting about having rides out at Wilson's? If thats the case just come out say it, cause I'd like to know why that would be a problum with anyone. Like I said maybe Im reading it wrong and those werent your intentions, but again, I dont get how this has gotten turned around from Butch posting about a group poaching a trail,(not even remotely close to Wilsons Creek) to you saying "Im glad everyone is having fun up there, and I hope it stays that way, but if things turn sour I wont be totally surprised". Do you know something we dont? Have you heard that area is being watched or something. Cause we have been out there pretty much every weekend and havent seen anything out of the normal, no rangers, or cops. Just people we normally see up there riding, and the local yocal driving around on the fire roads.

 

[FCLinder]

Those XC riders on MTBR are pretty disrespectful if you ask me. In an effort to meet new riders I once went to their "Fall Gathering" and it was pretty bunk for a DH/Freerider. Lots of talk of climbing and spandex.

Anyway, I doubt anyone will be riding Bad Fork again so maybe we can just drop it? And taking people to Wilson's Creek will continue and will be perfectly fine so stop worrying and talking and blaming people for showing others a good time.

I am for that. No one can just blame one person here and there is no need to name names ether. Everyone there road the trail. Now we know not to ride there and we will not go there again and will stop others that try to ride there. They still need to put a sign at the top saying so to keep others from riding there.

 

[T-Pirate]

I guess I just feel a public forum is not the place to plan big rides in national forests. I know the trails are legal and well known, but I've also seen legal, well-known trails (the ones I described above) get closed in the past because of increased traffic. Much of that increased traffic came from forums such as this one. Is it going to go down like that in wilsons? Maybe...maybe not, but if it does it will hurt all of us. I can't have a problem with ya'll planning group rides, it's not my forest...I just feel like the increased traffic might hurt mtb access in the forest, especially if Wilson's were to convert to a more "pisgah-esque" trail marking/mapping system.

I know this thread wasn't about wilson's. The reason I brought it into the thread was to alert people that what seems harmless may have more impact than you'd think. We didn't see anything wrong with running shuttles down in davidson every weekend, but then suddenly our favorite run is closed, with bikers cited as the reason. I agree nobody seems to have a problem with bikers in Wilson's, but if traffic increases to a level detrimental to the forest, people may, because they have in the past at other places.

Also, Jeffkill those "other trails" I was referring to ARE in Wilson's...who knows the legality of some of the more remote, unmarked trails out there. If those start to see the kind of traffic that the more well-known ones do, who knows what will happen.

And no, I wasn't implying that I know anything you guys don't, I ride out there as much as anyone, I'm just saying being careful couldn't hurt.

 

[profro]

I still can't believe you guys on the NC side of the mountains have't organized and started to build LEGAL shuttle/lift trails at some place that welcomes you.

Its seems that people spend too much time and effort trying to locate a new shuttle in and around Pisgah. You could have just built something legal somewhere else by now. Or get a 5-6" all mountain bike with a front derailleur and climb you asses to the top.

 

[MTB_Rob_NC]

I still can't believe you guys on the NC side of the mountains have't organized and started to build LEGAL shuttle/lift trails at some place that welcomes you.

Its seems that people spend too much time and effort trying to locate a new shuttle in and around Pisgah. You could have just built something legal somewhere else by now. Or get a 5-6" all mountain bike with a front derailleur and climb you asses to the top.

Why climb when there is a perfectly good ROAD already in existence. I find it funny. I, nor none of the people I am friendly with that have gone "Shuttling" in Pisgah have ever had an issue.

Its the Intraweb's fault

 

[MTB_Rob_NC]

FYi... having bounced back and forth between here and MTBR while I watch TV and do some work. I really realize how the suck MTBR is.

Just a side note

 

[drkenan]

FYi... having bounced back and forth between here and MTBR while I watch TV and do some work. I really realize how the suck MTBR is.

Just a side note

Yeah that place is a ****1ng joke. I used to post there and read their bs a lot but after I met all of you at windrock I don't try to make friends over there anymore.

On a side note I have tried several times to get some legal trails going but it's impossible to get our group together because we all live in different cities. Asheville even has a "freeride park" set aside that is now completely overgrown and I would like to have a chat about it with the city but don't particularly want to do it solo.

 

[JeffKill]

I still can't believe you guys on the NC side of the mountains have't organized and started to build LEGAL shuttle/lift trails at some place that welcomes you.

Its seems that people spend too much time and effort trying to locate a new shuttle in and around Pisgah. You could have just built something legal somewhere else by now. Or get a 5-6" all mountain bike with a front derailleur and climb you asses to the top.

Actually, the rides we have up there dont involve all that much "shuttling". We do quite a bit of climbing. When you're riding at wilsons and you wanna ride more than just headly, it comes with the territory. And as I've already said, all the trails we're riding up there are LEGAL. There are plenty of legal trails in NC that we all have access to. No, we dont have a place like windrock, but really, how many places do?? Look how far people drive to ride that place.

I guess I just feel a public forum is not the place to plan big rides in national forests. I know the trails are legal and well known, but I've also seen legal, well-known trails (the ones I described above) get closed in the past because of increased traffic. Much of that increased traffic came from forums such as this one. Is it going to go down like that in wilsons? Maybe...maybe not, but if it does it will hurt all of us. I can't have a problem with ya'll planning group rides, it's not my forest...I just feel like the increased traffic might hurt mtb access in the forest, especially if Wilson's were to convert to a more "pisgah-esque" trail marking/mapping system.

This is the last thing Im going to say about this. The couple of rides we've organized on here have brought out the same people we ride with up there every weekend. I think maybe 2 new people have been introduced to the area through us on here, and I pm'd them directions. So our postings on here havent caused increased traffic. Like I said, we've never just invited everyone on ridemonkey to come ride. If you look at those threads, its the same 4 or 5 people posting. The rides we've organized on here with our friends have done no damage. So drop it already.

 

[missiongravity]

I quit. If you guys wanna hang out I will be at the river.


For Sale: Two big bikes, one with springs in the rear and one without springs in the rear, both have big fat matching mud gripper tires. Some kind of fancy high fangled discer brakes and shifty gears.

And I thought kayakers could get pissy on access issues.

 

[zod]

Jeffkill you didn't know that 9AM at the dirtmounds (that haven't even existed for 5 years) is too much information?

Hey T-pirate....I wanna come ride with you boys sometime if you don't mind waiting on an old man. Maybe ya'll can show me a route I don't know!

ps. this thread equals the suck (reminds me of an MTBR thread)

 

[MTB_Rob_NC]

Where is Biggins?

 

[JeffKill]

Jeffkill you didn't know that 9AM at the dirtmounds (that haven't even existed for 5 years) is too much information?

I've been meeting there for rides for about 6 years now actually. It was called the dirt mounds then, and still is now.

 

[psychobiker]

:biggrin:

I still can't believe you guys on the NC side of the mountains have't organized and started to build LEGAL shuttle/lift trails at some place that welcomes you.

Its seems that people spend too much time and effort trying to locate a new shuttle in and around Pisgah. You could have just built something legal somewhere else by now. Or get a 5-6" all mountain bike with a front derailleur and climb you asses to the top.

my 2 cents....i pedalled up those with everyone else on my 7 inch "big bike" we got plenty of trails that are shuttle or climb and drop in

 

[zod]

I've been meeting there for rides for about 6 years now actually. It was called the dirt mounds then, and still is now.

I'm with ya dude....what I'm saying is there ain't even dirt mounds there anymore and haven't been for a long time so it's not like announcing a meeting gives away a location.

 

[JeffKill]

I'm with ya dude....what I'm saying is there ain't even dirt mounds there anymore and haven't been for a long time so it's not like announcing a meeting gives away a location.

Right on.

 

[bizutch]

I can understand what Mueller is trying to say. Back in the day, we used to shuttle the snot of a trail in Pisgah that was legal. Not a ton of people even knew you could shuttle to the top.

One leg of the trail was then closed to bikes.

Then one day RM was born and this shuttle was posted like crazy. Almost immediately after it being posted on RM...in far more subtle form than your posts on Wilsons, everybody with a big or semi-big rig from NC, GA, SC and TN hopped in the trucks and blasted the road up and down every weekend. The trail that IS legal is seasonal. They didn't care.

They would bang out runs and leave and the rangers would be nuts. Finally one weekend they had a big gathering in Pisgah organized on RM. It's the same one as every year, but this one year they all ran some shuttles. They DID NOT run their shuttle on that particular trail, but a full legal one.

But...two things happened that weekend. A bunch of weekend warriors banged out runs on the illegal trail at the same time. So, the rangers were freaking out b/c they had reports of a LARGE group of MTBers in Pisgah banging out DH runs on an illegal trail.

They were separate groups doing separate trails with separate agendas. But they all got grouped together...and we ALL got a bad rap with Randy Burgess and company that is still there today.


Basicly, T-Pirate is just trying to say that regardless of who you think is riding Wilsons, who already knows about, who you ride with...there are way more guys out there finding out about b/c of RM and at some point may head in that direction with "less than respect" for the trails you cherish.

Yes, they're public trails, but in the end in your heart you know they're "your trails"...

My suggestion to you guys that really love Wilsons is to call the Ranger District and inquire if you can adopt Headley and take over maintenance. Then, we all get a good rep, some good features..and a better foothold.

DAMN...since when the hell am I the middle ground in a conversation???

 

[drkenan]

My suggestion to you guys that really love Wilsons is to call the Ranger District and inquire if you can adopt Headley and take over maintenance. Then, we all get a good rep, some good features..and a better foothold.

That's probably a good idea. I know I'd be down for doing some maintainence up there as I'm sure the other guys would be. [Just maintainence - no root cutting or destroying trails in any way - got it?????]

 

[MTB_Rob_NC]

My suggestion to you guys that really love Wilsons is to call the Ranger District and inquire if you can adopt Headley and take over maintenance. Then, we all get a good rep, some good features..and a better foothold.

That'd be sweet, since that girl got stuck in that mud hole the other week, we now know how to access other parts of the trail with vehicles.

 

[missiongravity]

girl stuck in a mud hole... I have one guess as to who that could have been. Lets hear the rest of the story.

 

[zod]

That's probably a good idea. I know I'd be down for doing some maintainence up there as I'm sure the other guys would be. In fact we were just having a conversation a few weeks ago about roots, etc popping thru on Headley.

Oh boy.....I feel a sh!t storm coming on

 

[drkenan]

girl stuck in a mud hole... I have one guess as to who that could have been. Lets hear the rest of the story.

Nah...it was some random girl from Boone that was trying to shuttle a couple of dudes and made a wrong turn. We all blew buy her so fast that no one stopped but another group helped push her out. It was really kind of funny.

 

[Greyhound]

In fact we were just having a conversation a few weeks ago about roots, etc popping thru on Headley.

God forbid you might have roots on a bike trail.....

 

[missiongravity]

ahhh...got a vehicle stuck in the mud. I had visions of someone knee deep falling over repeatedly heaving and hoing a big bike whilst covering themselves head to well you know where with mud. Gotta love Wilsons. Who wants to go spelunking this weekend since the weather looks to be taking a turn for the worse.

Off to eat some sushi....later

 

[drkenan]

God forbid you might have roots on a bike trail.....

Hey now...

The reason that I stated it that way is because I couldn't think of a past tense word for "erosion." (i.e. "We were just talking about how erosed Headley had become"). See, it just doesn't work.

In particular, however a root did pop up at a very inopportune
place.

 

[bizutch]

That's probably a good idea. I know I'd be down for doing some maintainence up there as I'm sure the other guys would be. In fact we were just having a conversation a few weeks ago about roots, etc popping thru on Headley.

I hope you're kidding about cutting out roots?

 

[drkenan]

Look dammit, I never said anything about cutting roots - just trail maintainence...wtf did I say that got everybodys panties in a bunch?

I changed the original post so don't get all pissy about me having good intentions of working on Headley. Goddamn - I guess I can't even offer to help with trail maintainence.

 

[missiongravity]

not cutting out..covering them back up....replacing the dirt the has been removed

Maintaining not destroying as is already being done.

Just some general repair work to help the trail stay in decent shape and flow a little better.

Only with the proper clearances from the proper people of course.

 

[missiongravity]

I think some people buy their panties already wadded up kenan. Nothing you did. I never heard anything about saw meeting root anywhere on any trail that we ride. Call me.

 

[FCLinder]

Look dammit, I never said anything about cutting roots - just trail maintainence...wtf did I say that got everybodys panties in a bunch?

It’s alright man!!! I have seen a few people that are on the thread want to cut out roots or move rocks. They will not omit to it, but they have. I can’t say I have ether. It just seems there are few on here that want to make themselves look better than the other guy and will take every chance to do so..... You know the Hero!!!

I am for adopting a trail for us to keep up and maintain. Whether it’s in Wilson’s or where ever. We just all need to understand how to work together to gain the same goal.

 

[bizutch]

Look dammit, I never said anything about cutting roots - just trail maintainence...wtf did I say that got everybodys panties in a bunch?

I changed the original post so don't get all pissy about me having good intentions of working on Headley. Goddamn - I guess I can't even offer to help with trail maintainence.

speaking of panties in a wad...yours should be pulled out in 3,2,1...
there....

I was joking. See the goofy little "twitch" smilie. It's the internet and I'm a joker.

And Cecil, don't get your panties in a wad....they should be on your head where they normally are.

 

[FCLinder]

speaking of panties in a wad...yours should be pulled out in 3,2,1...
there....

I was joking. See the goofy little "twitch" smilie. It's the internet and I'm a joker.

And Cecil, don't get your panties in a wad....they should be on your head where they normally are.

Sorry man, I just can't get past what you said about me man. That was not called for!!!! It seems to me every time you get a chance to bad mouth me you do. There were others at fault this past weekend, but yet I don't see you naming anyone else's name but mine. I don't like to bad mouth anyone "not even you", but sometimes you make me want too. I just like to get a long with everyone and hang to ride. I really don't know why you have it in for me man? I am not the same guy you knew 4 years ago, but I do have to stand up for myself when someone is making me look bad on public forums. Ones that my friends and some of my sponsors read. It's not cool.

Think twice and then think again about the way you say things on here before you do. I am not the first to tell you this. This whole deal could of been handled over the phone very easy and never seen by public eyes. I let the past time you bashed me on here for no reason go and you doing it again really makes me mad!!!!

I just don't understand you man!!!!!

 

[bizutch]

Sorry man, I just can't get past what you said about me man. That was not called for!!!! It seems to me every time you get a chance to bad mouth me you do. There were others at fault this past weekend, but yet I don't see you naming anyone else's name but mine. I don't like to bad mouth anyone "not even you", but sometimes you make me want too. I just like to get a long with everyone and hang to ride. I really don't know why you have it in for me man? I am not the same guy you knew 4 years ago, but I do have to stand up for myself when someone is making me look bad on public forums. Ones that my friends and some of my sponsors read. It's not cool.

Think twice and then think again about the way you say things on here before you do. I am not the first to tell you this. This whole deal could of been handled over the phone very easy and never seen by public eyes. I let the past time you bashed me on here for no reason go and you doing it again really makes me mad!!!!

I just don't understand you man!!!!!

Come on now. Be realistic and don't go pouting. You pulled a blatant stunt and damn near got arrested for it.

I didn't BASH you. You pull stunts like that all the time. nothing wrong with me telling the truth.

Everybody on that ride was a friend of mine and all of my riding buddies were put on the line b/c of you talking them into going there instead of where they were heading. You yourself were all about being down on those guys that illegally did Perry and got us all a hard time years back. You knew better.

Yet you didn't just ride that trail once...you went two separate weekends and didn't bother to check with the FS either time. Feigning ignorance doesn't cut it with them the first time and feigning ignorance the second time AND taking an unknowing group along is worse. That's all.

i'll ride with you anytime if all our buds ride together anymore. I'm over all that old crap. I'm not gonna skip a ride.
PEACE

 

[BillT]

Just an observation...while I realize you don't want to go an piss off the FS as they weild a ton of power and can get things shut down (or opened up) to bikes quickly, BUT shouldn't they have some responsibility for ensuring that all trails are properly marked as to their usage ESPECIALLY considering all the confusion as to what is legal, illegal, sometimes legal, etc...I really don't think it is up to Joe bike rider to call the FS everytime they want to ride to discuss where it is legal to ride.

 

[T-Pirate]

........sagelike wisdom.......

YES YES YES....this was not meant to be a personal attack on anyone, just a warning comparing this to something that already happened close to home. I know there is already illegal work on those trails (stepdowns and berms don't build themselves), so I just think it would be easy to give ourselves a bad rap with the rangers. If anyone can get permission to do work out there, I will definitely be there doing my part, and I think that would make our group as a whole look better. Impact is inevitable, but careless impact is preventable, and if the rangers know we'll do our part, then my points above won't matter.

 

[FCLinder]

Come on now. Be realistic and don't go pouting. You pulled a blatant stunt and damn near got arrested for it.

I didn't BASH you. You pull stunts like that all the time. nothing wrong with me telling the truth.

Everybody on that ride was a friend of mine and all of my riding buddies were put on the line b/c of you talking them into going there instead of where they were heading. You yourself were all about being down on those guys that illegally did Perry and got us all a hard time years back. You knew better.

Yet you didn't just ride that trail once...you went two separate weekends and didn't bother to check with the FS either time. Feigning ignorance doesn't cut it with them the first time and feigning ignorance the second time AND taking an unknowing group along is worse. That's all.

i'll ride with you anytime if all our buds ride together anymore. I'm over all that old crap. I'm not gonna skip a ride.
PEACE

One: Once again I had no idea it was Illegal when we got there.
Two: I didn't talk anyone into doing that ride. You are just saying this on your thoughts. I asked everyone if the wanted to go ride somewhere else. They said lets ride it. I didn't hold a gun to their heads Butch.
Three: There were two other riders there that knew the area just as good as me and wanted to do that ride. I don't see you pointing fingers at them, but only me. Thats what pisses me off.

You need to know the truth about things before you go running you mouth. No wonder people want to start fights with you. They are sick of you mouth!!!!

 

[FCLinder]

Just an observation...while I realize you don't want to go an piss off the FS as they weild a ton of power and can get things shut down (or opened up) to bikes quickly, BUT shouldn't they have some responsibility for ensuring that all trails are properly marked as to their usage ESPECIALLY considering all the confusion as to what is legal, illegal, sometimes legal, etc...I really don't think it is up to Joe bike rider to call the FS everytime they want to ride to discuss where it is legal to ride.

Thank you!!!! We can just give a bag to Butch and let him be everyone’s Hero. That’s what he wants.

 

[MTB_Rob_NC]

You need to know the truth about things before you go running you mouth. No wonder people want to start fights with you. They are sick of you mouth!!!!

You woulda thought he would of learned after the whole MonkeyFest debacle where he called out everyone and their brother for shuttling illegal trails, when in fact we were all having a jolly time on the legal ones.

Its hard to talk with your foot in your mouth, but typing is another story. irate2:


So who is shuttling this weekend?