i recently got a new pair of wheels, 721/hadley/dt combo. the problem is that the spokes used were too long (261mm) and while tentioning the wheels, the spokes ran out of tread and the mechanic said its ok, he said the nipples would tread the spoke its self and its no problem. so now i have a wheel which has about 5mm of spoke sticking out the other side of the nipples. i am guessing this isn't really good coz i saw the boss building another wheel the other day and the spokes were too long, so he brought out this spoke treading tool and then cut the spokes to the legth needed. its not like my wheels are getting out of true all the time, they have standed up to some abuse already. but thay aren't really staying dead straight and the spokes aren't staying tight like how other monkeys say good wheels should be built. also they didn't pre strech the spokes, so should i just keep riding and wait till they fail(which i think is pretty likely) or get them rebuild by a proper wheel builder with new spokes and nipples?
screwed up wheel build
- Thread starter dhkid
- Start date
Not true, too long a spoke gives you no adjustment, and if it were true about the nipple adding threads to the spoke when tightening, you'll round out the nipple, then it's worthless.
That's too bad. I hate to say this, but the knucklehead who built your rims did a terrible job. I would go back and call him out on it. While your rim is probably straight right now, at some point you'll have to work on them, and you won't have anyway to tighten the spokes...dhkid said:well, it ran out of tread and the mechanic just forced it.
If you've got threads sticking out past the end of the nipple you'll get lots of flats from the spoke rubbing through the rim strips and then the tube. I'd say take the wheel back to the shop or if you avoid confrontation just have it rebuilt.
i think i would prefer i get it buit at a different bike shop.
I fully agree here with zahgurim....that no-good "wheelbuilder" should be slapped around. First by you, then by his boss.zahgurim said:
You say the boss built one of the wheels for you and did a good job? Take the other wheel back in and show it to the boss and tell him which employee did the deed.
You can play dumb and say something like, "I was looking at my wheels the other day, and this ones the spokes stick out 5mm past the top of the nipples, while this one, the one you built, doesn't show any threads. Why is that? And I can't seem to true my other wheel. Any idea why?"
If the boss is worth anything he'll say, "leave the wheel with me. Come back tomorrow." And all should be good come the next day.
If they are a stand-up business it should happen this way.
If not, head out and find yourself a better mechanic! One who knows how to build wheels!
Bring it back. No one should pay for dangerous work.
Yeah I was thinking the same thing, minus the salmon.Dirtbike said:
I figured he didn't seem to have a real strong grasp on wheel building stuff so I wasn't going to call him out on 221's being to long.
Maybe they're laced radial....even then 221 is short!
The nips are brass and they just got ruined by the stainless spoke eating the brass threads.Sad,so sad.
I'm guessing they were not 221"s unless you have 24"s and some really high flange hubs.Even then XT or hadleys with trail pims only use 224"s.
Did this fool go 2 cross on your wheels or something?
I'm guessing they were not 221"s unless you have 24"s and some really high flange hubs.Even then XT or hadleys with trail pims only use 224"s.
Did this fool go 2 cross on your wheels or something?
Someone should invent a nipple that acts as a threader. No need ever again for the correct lenght spokes ever again....
wow the same problems in two diferent posting...
I will say re-lace the wheels with a tighter spoke pattern, (from 2 to 3 cross or from 3 to 4cross is possible) if not delace the wheel and cut the spoke treads to acomodate the nipples.
in short i can not beleive that a "Mecanic" will let a wheel build go with 5MM of spoke showing,, in fact the minute the spoke even shows as the top of the nipple you already know the spokes are far to long so i will stop right away and solve the problem with out wasting any more time, trying to build a wheel that is destine to fail sonner or later...
the spoke showing is not the problem since most rims this days are doudle wall,, but the tread on the spokes is what really matters since they require to adjust and keep spoke tension on the wheel...
in respect to "the nipple making treads on the spoke " coment ask the guy that give you that answer if he kisses his girlfriend with those same lips.. that is So super mega lamme
I will say re-lace the wheels with a tighter spoke pattern, (from 2 to 3 cross or from 3 to 4cross is possible) if not delace the wheel and cut the spoke treads to acomodate the nipples.
in short i can not beleive that a "Mecanic" will let a wheel build go with 5MM of spoke showing,, in fact the minute the spoke even shows as the top of the nipple you already know the spokes are far to long so i will stop right away and solve the problem with out wasting any more time, trying to build a wheel that is destine to fail sonner or later...
the spoke showing is not the problem since most rims this days are doudle wall,, but the tread on the spokes is what really matters since they require to adjust and keep spoke tension on the wheel...
in respect to "the nipple making treads on the spoke " coment ask the guy that give you that answer if he kisses his girlfriend with those same lips.. that is So super mega lamme
krispy built the wheels for my downhill bike 3 years ago, and they just now could use a mild truing. many a whistler trip and 3 seasons of racing...... best hand built set of wheels i ever had. props to you man! send your wheel work to go-ride, you won't be disapointed, and thanks to Chris Canfield for hooking me up w/ the best wheelbuilders in the biz. if my fat ass cant tweak their wheels (230) you probably can't either!leprechaun said:
i have built quite a few wheels myself.... when iam done and spokes stick out i start over....
It is not correct for a wheel to have Any spoke poking through at all
If your wheel has the proper length spokes then the wheel will be nearly Tight After your dne using Your Goofy little spoke screwdriver <I forget what its actually called> the ont that sets all your spokes to an Even place so you can start your tensioning......When you find a good wheel guy stick with him..... this guy that built yours sounds like a retard... good luck
________
Sunset Boulevard Residence Pattaya
It is not correct for a wheel to have Any spoke poking through at all
If your wheel has the proper length spokes then the wheel will be nearly Tight After your dne using Your Goofy little spoke screwdriver <I forget what its actually called> the ont that sets all your spokes to an Even place so you can start your tensioning......When you find a good wheel guy stick with him..... this guy that built yours sounds like a retard... good luck
________
Sunset Boulevard Residence Pattaya
Last edited:
:they aren't any good wheel builders around here, closest one is in singapore i think. and it costs too much to get it done in the us then shipped here. the boss was doing a wheel for some roady, not me. even then he doesn't pre tention the spokes, he belives in a "break in period" after that you have to bring in your wheels to be trued again...
A break in period is fine as long as you don't beat your rims during that time. Ride like a roadie! ha
Best advice i can give you, I see your in Milasia, is go online and buy a book on wheel building. It's not that hard. Bicycle institute has online spoke a calculator you can use with some basic rim and hub info. Plus you can true your wheels, I can't tell you how many times I've trued my wheels on trail. I was getting ready to hit mushroom rock, 14-16 foot drop and my spokes where noodles! Bust out the wrench and in 10 minutes I was hucking again.
don't be scared - do it. Oh yeh don't be drunk either! ha
Best advice i can give you, I see your in Milasia, is go online and buy a book on wheel building. It's not that hard. Bicycle institute has online spoke a calculator you can use with some basic rim and hub info. Plus you can true your wheels, I can't tell you how many times I've trued my wheels on trail. I was getting ready to hit mushroom rock, 14-16 foot drop and my spokes where noodles! Bust out the wrench and in 10 minutes I was hucking again.
don't be scared - do it. Oh yeh don't be drunk either! ha
Thats true but if you start with a crappy build it doesn't help. Get the right length spokes and rebuilt your wheel. A break in period is basically truing your wheel after a couple rides to insure it isn't loose. It's preventive maintanence and very necessary on a new wheel if you expect it to last.dhkid said:
You need to start over with your wheel before you bend the **** out of it!
Just for fun, I used the spoke calc on QBP. While this is not 100% accurate, I got spoke lengths of 259 and 260.dhkid said:
One thing bad wheelbuilders love to do is not to order the correct length spokes. They have a box of spokes of an odd length which has been sitting around for 2 years. Instead of getting the right length, they insist a mm off won't be a problem.
The next thing you know, some asshat thinks a brass nipple is a Phil Wood spoke thread cutter and ruins your wheel.
Sound like you should bitchslap your mechanic.
No Such thing as a break in period... if the wheel is Built right your Ready to hammer right out of the gate.....No retruing none of that crap... watch me build a wheel and it will scare you how much i twist Pull squeeze sitck wrenches through and Mangle before i Put my final touches on...... Built up FoesJunky's Front Wheel <SUn SIngle trakc on Hope bulb> the day before Sea otter.... he did one of his Biggest drops ever there and wheel had no problems.... now a year later still hasnt been trued after quite a bit of abuse..... Jensons built his rear.... Well lets just say its been retensioned after about the fourth time the spokes kept unthreading... not coming loose .... Unthreading..... Also rember your Spoke freeze when your all done that or spoke prep something like that....dhkid said:they aren't any good wheel builders around here, closest one is in singapore i think. and it costs too much to get it done in the us then shipped here. the boss was doing a wheel for some roady, not me. even then he doesn't pre tention the spokes, he belives in a "break in period" after that you have to bring in your wheels to be trued again...
________
Unique glass pipes
Last edited:
Also for a clac i use the DTswiss site... never had any come up wrong yet
________
Mercedes_VoyeurCam cam
________
Mercedes_VoyeurCam cam
Last edited:
thats to pretention the spokes right? ie twisting the spokes between where they cross and the hub? gimmie some tips..coz i got a feeling i am going to end up re building my wheel myself. i already know how to lase, tention and true a wheel... so i am not that bad.DirtyMike said:
what i know to do now is:
get the right spoke length, use oil and grease,bring up the spokes to tention, pre tention/ strech them, check spoke tention and make sure its true... will that do?
edit: is this a bad idea and am i likely to screw up my wheel even more?
First of all, I use Bike-A-Log spoke calculator, but I usually confirm at least the hole-to-hole measurement just to be safe (or to at least know I have the right hub).dhkid said:
But frankly, if you can go ahead and do it, you won't be beholden to a bunch of jerks...
Your wheel builder should be ashamed for trying to convince you that his hack job is ok. It is not. Not sure if you were paying him or what, but even if you were not there is no excuse.
As for tips, this always sparks debate but I will recommend using spoke prep on the threads and a drop of tri flow on the outside of each nipple. That way the threads hold firm but you can easily bring up the tension without a lot of friction between the nipple and rim/eyelet. Some people think prep is a waste of time but I disagree. Some people also suggest lubing the spoke threads but I also disagree, in my experience the spokes will loosen much more quickly if you do it that way.
But I do agree that if you build the wheels properly (including bending the spokes to mate with the flange and stressing the wheels to release wound-up tension) you shouldn't need a break-in period.
As for tips, this always sparks debate but I will recommend using spoke prep on the threads and a drop of tri flow on the outside of each nipple. That way the threads hold firm but you can easily bring up the tension without a lot of friction between the nipple and rim/eyelet. Some people think prep is a waste of time but I disagree. Some people also suggest lubing the spoke threads but I also disagree, in my experience the spokes will loosen much more quickly if you do it that way.
But I do agree that if you build the wheels properly (including bending the spokes to mate with the flange and stressing the wheels to release wound-up tension) you shouldn't need a break-in period.
Either way, no lube on the spoke threads. Use spoke prep, it has two advantages: it somewhat lubricates the threads during the build, then holds firmly enough that the spokes won't loosen.dhkid said:
check out the thread here in DH about DT pro-lock nipples, has good advice on spoke prep and other wheel building stuff.