[DirtyMike]

Not to knock the do iut your selfer making a timing system..... BUT.......


http://www.freelap-usa.com/store/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=2

389 for a freelap system....

 

[toodles]

What happens if a rider crashes or passes another rider with your system?

On the pump track this is a non issue, but in a DH race what you'd do is use the system to give you a number of different start time, and a number of different stop times. These could then be allocated to individual riders manually by an operator, or if you had the money to be fancy - you could put an indentifying chip on the bikes or riders that would register who passed the finish line at any time and automatically allocate the finish time to that rider.

Money is the only limit to how fancy a timing system you could make, and how you chose to display the results. Using DDE/OPC software you can update times automatically into an Microsoft Excel spreadsheet if you wanted to. The MicroLogix 1100 has built-in Ethernet so it can communicate directly to LCD screens etc for time display purposes.

Building a timing system from scratch might not be cheaper than buying an off-the-shelf package from a timing company though. I've got no idea how much the fancy Tissot systems cost.

What timing/start systems do they normally use for races in the US?

 

[toodles]

Not to knock the do iut your selfer making a timing system..... BUT.......


http://www.freelap-usa.com/store/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=2

389 for a freelap system....

Yeah I wanted a freelap system but in Australia they're like $700. I had all the parts for my system sitting around so it cost nothing and was good practise for my uni stuff.

 

[WillCollins]

American mtb racing is on the wrong hands for some time now,isn't it?

Some people are putting in the effort to make that all change... Take a look at the results from this coming weekend's race at the first stop of the Pro GRT in Washington and see for yourself if racing in the US of A is dead. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised...

 

[Pslide]

On the pump track this is a non issue, but in a DH race what you'd do is use the system to give you a number of different start time, and a number of different stop times. These could then be allocated to individual riders manually by an operator, or if you had the money to be fancy - you could put an indentifying chip on the bikes or riders that would register who passed the finish line at any time and automatically allocate the finish time to that rider.

Money is the only limit to how fancy a timing system you could make, and how you chose to display the results. Using DDE/OPC software you can update times automatically into an Microsoft Excel spreadsheet if you wanted to. The MicroLogix 1100 has built-in Ethernet so it can communicate directly to LCD screens etc for time display purposes.

Building a timing system from scratch might not be cheaper than buying an off-the-shelf package from a timing company though. I've got no idea how much the fancy Tissot systems cost.

What timing/start systems do they normally use for races in the US?

Well, I'm impessed that you put this system together - shows a good level of expertise. You don't happen to know how to write iphone apps do you? Because everything you would need for a timing system is contained in two iphones..........

(Sorry for derailling this thread.)

 

[toodles]

Well, I'm impessed that you put this system together - shows a good level of expertise. You don't happen to know how to write iphone apps do you? Because everything you would need for a timing system is contained in two iphones..........

(Sorry for derailling this thread.)

Nah don't know much about iPhones mate. How would you trigger that start and stop on an iPhone system? Remembering the point is to go away from using manual start-stop.

 

[SylentK]

A lot of cool $hit

[/end nerdtalk]

Dude that's awesome

 

[IH8Rice]

How would you trigger that start and stop on an iPhone system? Remembering the point is to go away from using manual start-stop.

there is no peripheral to attach to it to do that. it would have to be a manual start/stop

 

[dhrace507]

I'm stoked a lot of people are responding to this, and that's because I just wanted to give this a bit more publicity than the complaints have gotten in the past, hopefully.

Just to clear a few things up...

I didn't expect any different for the regular entry fee, and that is just sad. Nobody expected any different, that's worse. Sea Otter, please change that. I have so little faith in them that I don't expect them to change after this, but I'm usually positive, so there is still a shred of hope.

The entry fee went up for me by $15 this year, and for that 15, we got worse timing. That sucks.

The course could be better. I know this because I make the trails at SolVista with a few of my best friends, and that is like working in a sand box. Some people like it, some people don't, which is fine, but we try to put in effort. Sea Otter has it easy with their dirt, they just don't give a ****.

Sea Otter paid thousands of dollars for a 'pro pump track' that 20 people rode, and neglected a downhill that thousands of people rode. I know the limitations with timing with the gun range, water, weather, dirt and machinery, and I know it can be done, so none of it is an excuse.

Keep ranting everyone, it might make a difference if people see this.

 

[DirtyMike]

I think a big thing about SO is that the actual racing has always been a sideline of the event, its truly another tradeshow like IB, just a little smaller.

 

[dhmike]

looks to me like c.k. doesn't mind the sea otter .

 

[Mike Buell]

The fact that they use a $100 hand time system just shows that they don't give two craps about the DH and that it is a total side show to the rest of the event. Its basically demonstrates the total lack of respect they have for everyone who races the DH.

"Just get a cheap thumb timer this year, that'll be good enough, not like the DH race matters anyway, these guys can't even ride up hill"

 

[bizutch]

I'm stoked a lot of people are responding to this, and that's because I just wanted to give this a bit more publicity than the complaints have gotten in the past, hopefully.

Just to clear a few things up...

I didn't expect any different for the regular entry fee, and that is just sad. Nobody expected any different, that's worse. Sea Otter, please change that. I have so little faith in them that I don't expect them to change after this, but I'm usually positive, so there is still a shred of hope.

The entry fee went up for me by $15 this year, and for that 15, we got worse timing. That sucks.

The course could be better. I know this because I make the trails at SolVista with a few of my best friends, and that is like working in a sand box. Some people like it, some people don't, which is fine, but we try to put in effort. Sea Otter has it easy with their dirt, they just don't give a ****.

Sea Otter paid thousands of dollars for a 'pro pump track' that 20 people rode, and neglected a downhill that thousands of people rode. I know the limitations with timing with the gun range, water, weather, dirt and machinery, and I know it can be done, so none of it is an excuse.

Keep ranting everyone, it might make a difference if people see this.

Just realized who you are again. Dur! Come to NC and ride shady singletrack this summer brother.

 

[BMADED]

looks to me like c.k. doesn't mind the sea otter .

Who is the handsome kid with the shirt around his head?

This was my first year and I had alot of fun, besides my race run.

 

[Pslide]

there is no peripheral to attach to it to do that. it would have to be a manual start/stop

Not really. There is a camera which with a bit of image detection could be a photo eye / motion sensor.

 

[John Jameson]

"Just get a cheap thumb timer this year, that'll be good enough, not like the DH race matters anyway, these guys can't even ride up hill"


also my first year there, though only as a spectator. I had a great f*cking time, but it definitely seemed as though most of the racing was just a side show to all the shenanigans that were going down in the festival area. The dh track was underwhelming but I didn't pay to race it, I can definitely understand being upset at the $100 fees...But, the camaraderie of the scene seems way cool, even though the dh track is sub par. I saw tons of people that were stoked just to be racing, albeit on a sh!tty track, maybe their only race of the year. Next year I am going back, to race (ds), and it will probably be my only race of the year. I plan on getting just as drunk, then cheering you motherfuc]{ers down that sandy slope. I feel that the coolness of the scene outweighs the lameness of the course. 2 cents deposited.

 

[AwesomeLand]

dhrace507 is right to bring this up. While Sea Otter is about so many things, people do have a right to expect it to rock for them. And in so many ways Sea Otter did rock for me.

I had a great time running a Booth for Women Of Dirt. I had a great time covering the event for Sea Otter and our own project (look for a really funny video coming out soon on Awesome Land.) I had a great time meeting up with everyone. Generally, the people the run and make Sea Otter happen rock.

But, that being said, people have a right to have a good practice and race run experience and if they are not getting they should bring it up. This gives people a chance to make it better. If Sea Otter thinks only a few people are unhappy they may not be motivated to change. If they feel that the number drop offs - my class had a 1/3 less people, are due to people being unhappy, they may be motivated to fix it.

If people stop going, because they are unhappy then vendors may find it unnecessary to be there. The DS is so awesome. The downhill could be as well. Imagine jumps where the chuck holes were toward the bottom. After the road. Would of really helped with the flow. Just my 2 cents worth. Actually, it was probably 12 cents, but who's counting. Cheers!!!

 

[davep]

...
That probably didn't make any sense to anyone,...
[/end nerdtalk]

Not particularly familar with the exact parts, but it all makes sense to me.....

Big thumbs up for doing more than just thinking that this would be user buildable...

There are numerous sensor systems out there that could be used for triggering, from mechanical, to optical, to RFID. That part is pretty simple. The time sync from two ends of a one-way track becomes the more complicated and critical issue IMO (wireless/RF/GSM transmission of data packet including rider ID and start time....).

 

[toodles]

Not particularly familar with the exact parts, but it all makes sense to me.....

Big thumbs up for doing more than just thinking that this would be user buildable...

There are numerous sensor systems out there that could be used for triggering, from mechanical, to optical, to RFID. That part is pretty simple. The time sync from two ends of a one-way track becomes the more complicated and critical issue IMO (wireless/RF/GSM transmission of data packet including rider ID and start time....).

Yeah a single communication cable/signal cable simplifies the whole thing a helluva lot. Using wireless LAN transmitters is one option, but there's now RF units and whatnot as well.

How many people enter a race like Sea Otter? When you multiply their entry fees, surely there'd be enough dough left over to at least attempt something more accurate. They may as well have used hourglasses and sundials.

 

[Pslide]

I don't think you need a time sync. You just need a time stamp. The atomic clock time is broadcast everywhere on a radio signal. At the top of the hill you enter the rider number, stamp the atomic time when he clears the gate, and send his number and time stamp to the bottom. This could be done through the existing cellular network like a text (if you've got signal). The bottom unit picks it up, the operator enters the number as he crosses the line and gets another atomic time stamp.

Or you just sync two clocks at the start of the race and use time stamps from those.

That's why I say this could all be done with iphones or any open source smart phone (using the camera and image detection as a photo eye / motion detector).

 

[IH8Rice]

I don't think you need a time sync. You just need a time stamp. The atomic clock time is broadcast everywhere on a radio signal. At the top of the hill you enter the rider number, stamp the atomic time when he clears the gate, and send his number and time stamp to the bottom. This could be done through the existing cellular network like a text (if you've got signal). The bottom unit picks it up, the operator enters the number as he crosses the line and gets another atomic time stamp.

Or you just sync two clocks at the start of the race and use time stamps from those.

That's why I say this could all be done with iphones or any open source smart phone (using the camera and image detection as a photo eye / motion detector).

transmission of cell signals is not instant and therefore would not be accurate enough for race timing....though still probably better than a chick with a push button at the finish

plus the time it takes you to enter the time from the atomic clock would take way too long

 

[time-bomb]

I think they should determine the winner of the race based on the loudness of the cheering from the crowd. Which ever racer generated the loudest cheering on the course wins first place. Simple enough.

 

[IH8Rice]

I think they should determine the winner of the race based on the loudness of the cheering from the crowd. Which ever racer generated the loudest cheering on the course wins first place. Simple enough.

that would be more accurate i think

 

[nanhar]

I happened to overhear they guy who was hired to work on the DH course during practice. All he did was whine and complain about getting no help from both 1) The guy who hired him and 2) The guys they hired to help him. He said he gave up after the first day.

As a side note, yes the course is old and tired and not really DH but I raced Cat 1 Open Women and there were 15 of us. I have never attended a DH race with that many participants since 2002!!!!!