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Sex Offender Registries Going Too Far?

Plummit

Monkey
Mar 12, 2002
233
0
I understand the public outrage over the crime and clamoring of frightened parents and, justifiably angry victims for registries, BUT can they go too far? Is the problem in their implementation or a larger one of trying juveniles as adults to demonstrate a state, county or prosecutor's "toughness on crime."

This is the case of a 16 yr old who had consensual sex w/ a girl he thought was his age. They met in a teen club, but as it turned out, she was only 13. According to the article, there is no dispute that the intercourse was consensual. The boy is now a registered sex offender for life. Kicked out of various high schools, harassed by strangers that peruse the sex offender registries, and is generally screwed for the rest of his life.

This seems so wrong and wasteful to me. Almost preordaining that this child will grow up to be a criminal or suicidal, forced down that path by the social stigma that follows him wherever he goes. A true modern day "Scarlet Letter."

On a broader note, I realize there are those offenders who are just f-ed mentally, chemically or otherwise, who've served their sentence and are out and dangerous, but what about those lesser offenders that are trying to straighten out their lives. Are these registries pushing offenders back to their deviant lifestyle by making them, the offenders, outcasts, and in doing so, actually harming the very communities they are designed to protect?

Being labeled a sex offender has completely changed Ricky’s life, leading him to be kicked out of high school, thrown out of parks, taunted by neighbors, harassed by strangers, and unable to live within 2,000 feet of a school, day-care center or park. He is prohibited from going to the movies or mall with friends because it would require crossing state borders, which he cannot do without permission from his probation officer. One of Ricky’s neighbors called the cops on him, yelled and cursed at him, and videotaped him every time he stepped outside, Ricky said.

“It affects you in every way,” he said. “You’re scared to go out places. You’re on the Internet, so everybody sees your picture.”

His mother, Mary, said the entire family has felt the ramifications of Ricky being labeled a sex offender. His younger brother has been ridiculed at school and cannot have friends over to the house; his stepfather has been harassed; the parents’ marriage has been under tremendous pressure; and strangers used to show up at their door to badger the family. One neighbor came to the house and told Mary he wasn’t going to leave them alone until they took their “child rapist” away, so they moved, she said.
Now California is debating implementing a similar law about lifetime sex offender registries which would include child "offenders" as young as 14. I understand parents and people generally have strong feelings on the issue. What about prosecuting young children and the general trend of prosecuting children when they act up or out at school? Is this going too far? I don't have the answers. I'm not a parent myself, but find the whole thing grisly and shocking. Thoughts?

Link
 

BurlyShirley

Rex Grossman Will Rise Again
Jul 4, 2002
19,180
17
TN
Yeah, personally, I feel it's flawed... even after you have served your debt to society, the punishment of public humiliation trashes your life, you're blackballed from neighborhoods, jobs, etc. I think only violent/pedo/recurrent types should really be on public lists like that, but Im sure somebody has a good reasons for including everyone.
 

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,840
1
Orange County, CA
Seems blatantly unfair. Once you serve your sentence, you should be done with it, not matter what you did.

Or, since I seem to be defending pedophiles again, I guess you can sum up my thoughts with three words: **** the kids.
 

BurlyShirley

Rex Grossman Will Rise Again
Jul 4, 2002
19,180
17
TN
On the other hand Silver, if part of your sentence IS a lifetime on the sex offender watchlist, is it still that much of an issue? I simply think it should be reserved for more serious offenders, not "statutory" rapists, and drunken frat dudes.

Clearly pedo's and violent/recurrent rapists have proven to be a danger upon release as they often commit crimes again... so along with serious counseling, I think Im alright with blackballing/alienating them. I mean they've ruined lives far beyond what appearing on a list like that could do.
 

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,840
1
Orange County, CA
On the other hand Silver, if part of your sentence IS a lifetime on the sex offender watchlist, is it still that much of an issue? I simply think it should be reserved for more serious offenders, not "statutory" rapists, and drunken frat dudes.

Clearly pedo's and violent/recurrent rapists have proven to be a danger upon release as they often commit crimes again... so along with serious counseling, I think Im alright with blackballing/alienating them. I mean they've ruined lives far beyond what appearing on a list like that could do.
I'd be ok with that, if that is explicitly laid out at the time of sentencing. Laws like that that require retroactive punishment are just plain stupid, but they are easy for a politician to get behind, so they get passed.
 

blue

boob hater
Jan 24, 2004
10,160
2
california
Sex offender registries are entertaining...it's funny running across 20-somethings that got arrested for drunken streaking and ended up on it with all the pedos.
 

valve bouncer

Master Dildoist
Feb 11, 2002
7,843
114
Japan
Sex offender registries are entertaining...it's funny running across 20-somethings that got arrested for drunken streaking and ended up on it with all the pedos.
Is that for real?:shocked: Bugger me, I'd love to hear the "but will someone please think of the children" demographic try and back that one up.:disgust:
 

JohnE

filthy rascist
May 13, 2005
13,563
2,210
Front Range, dude...
This is what happens when you apply a single standard to a situation that is almost always different than the last.
Yes, we need registries. No, they dont need to be like this. Case by case basis.
 

valve bouncer

Master Dildoist
Feb 11, 2002
7,843
114
Japan
This is what happens when you apply a single standard to a situation that is almost always different than the last.
Yes, we need registries. No, they dont need to be like this. Case by case basis.
It's the same with these 3 strikes laws you have over there and indeed with all mandatory sentencing laws. As Silver said though, never any votes in appearing to be soft on crime no matter how sensible the proposal is.
 

Plummit

Monkey
Mar 12, 2002
233
0
I'd be ok with that, if that is explicitly laid out at the time of sentencing. Laws like that that require retroactive punishment are just plain stupid, but they are easy for a politician to get behind, so they get passed.
I completely agree w/ you. Sex offenders are obviously a group that won't engender much sympathy in the press or w/ the public, but I thought that retro-active applications of law were unconstitutional? Of course, they'd have to be challenged as such.

Is this where we start the debate on retro-active immunity for the telecoms in the FISA bill?:disgust:
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
It's the same with these 3 strikes laws you have over there and indeed with all mandatory sentencing laws. As Silver said though, never any votes in appearing to be soft on crime no matter how sensible the proposal is.
precisely.
the intent was for 3 violent crimes, but now it's 3 felons, which, iirc, can be elevated to such from a misdemeanor if other conditions apply (e.g., violation of probation).

as for silver's comment about once the dues is paid it should be done: should we then amend our DUI laws? i get your point, but methinks some crimes should be reserved for monitoring/restricting after the sentence is served.
 

valve bouncer

Master Dildoist
Feb 11, 2002
7,843
114
Japan
precisely.
the intent was for 3 violent crimes, but now it's 3 felons, which, iirc, can be elevated to such from a misdemeanor if other conditions apply (e.g., violation of probation).

as for silver's comment about once the dues is paid it should be done: should we then amend our DUI laws? i get your point, but methinks some crimes should be reserved for monitoring/restricting after the sentence is served.
I don't necessarily disagree but again it should be at the discretion of the judge at the time of sentencing and subject to preiodic review after release.
The three strikes law is just retarded even if a variation of it was how my country was started. Better hung for a sheep than a lamb and all that.
 

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,840
1
Orange County, CA
as for silver's comment about once the dues is paid it should be done: should we then amend our DUI laws? i get your point, but methinks some crimes should be reserved for monitoring/restricting after the sentence is served.
Isn't monitoring a part of the sentence, given at the time of sentencing in lieu of time in jail? That's not the same thing. What would be the same is going back and making a list of every person that has ever been convicted of DUI, putting it public with their mugshot online, and then making a law that says they need to have any car they are ever in as a driver or even passenger painted fluorescent pink.

Besides, I've said before that I think DUI laws are stupid and shouldn't even exist...
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,022
3
Denver
Besides, I've said before that I think DUI laws are stupid and shouldn't even exist...
Let me guess... I'll ask why and you'll say cuz it's already covered under felony reckless endangerment or something like that, yeah?

So we can just jump ahead to where I say that it's not just about punishment, but also about publicity. It's a problem and this is a way to draw more attention to it so it can be avoided.

Too many people would still drive intoxicated if it wasn't publicised as much as it is. It does work as a deterrent.
 

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,840
1
Orange County, CA
Let me guess... I'll ask why and you'll say cuz it's already covered under felony reckless endangerment or something like that, yeah?

So we can just jump ahead to where I say that it's not just about punishment, but also about publicity. It's a problem and this is a way to draw more attention to it so it can be avoided.

Too many people would still drive intoxicated if it wasn't publicised as much as it is. It does work as a deterrent.
Actually, I think that we need to amend the laws to make hurting someone in a crash with a drunk driver attempted murder, and killing someone while driving drunk murder. Give the drunk 20 years, and that will solve the problem, especially with the habitual drunks who get caught 8 or 9 times.

It'll never happen, since we're way too lenient about driving dangerously.
 

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
43,647
15,881
Portland, OR
I think a lot of laws should be amended to include way stiffer penalties for habitual/repeat offenders.

There are a small percentage in Oregon (like less than 10%) that get labeled "sex offender" for things like having consensual sex with a high school sweetheart who's parents hate you. For those people, I feel bad because that label stays and can impact you for life.

There are also a small percentage of people who drive when they shouldn't and get a DUI and NEVER even consider driving when impaired again. But the DUI falls off after a while and they can move on after that.

But someone who commits a crime against a child SHOULD be labeled for life. Same goes for someone who drives while impaired and hurts/kills someone.

It would be hard to legislate, though. It's a case by case basis that would take a lot of time to manage.

There was a cyclist killed over the weekend by a drunk driver. Hit and run job at night. The cyclist had lights on, but the road had very little shoulder (as most rural areas do here). But I digress.
 

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,840
1
Orange County, CA
It would be hard to legislate, though. It's a case by case basis that would take a lot of time to manage.
That's why I like my idea. You don't hurt anyone while you're driving drunk, and it's not a crime. You kill someone, and it doesn't matter if you're Jesus Christ who just had a couple beers and it was the first time you'd ever driven drunk, you go down for 20 years...
 

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
43,647
15,881
Portland, OR
That's why I like my idea. You don't hurt anyone while you're driving drunk, and it's not a crime. You kill someone, and it doesn't matter if you're Jesus Christ who just had a couple beers and it was the first time you'd ever driven drunk, you go down for 20 years...
Agreed.

I was talking more of the "sex offender" cases. But you are 100% correct on the DUI front.

I never put much thought into the sex offender cases until I read about the kid that was released a few months back.

Wilson, 21, was convicted in 2005 of having oral sex with a consenting 15-year-old girl when he was 17. Under the now-changed Georgia law, Wilson was convicted of felony aggravated child molestation.
 

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
43,647
15,881
Portland, OR
so much for "you can't legislate morality", which is how i view this conviction involving 2 consenting* minors.



* but wait, they can't consent, right?
The prosecution in that case said she was too drunk to concede. Still f@cked up, no doubt.
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
i just checked my local registry, and among the seemingly endless classifications of sex crimes, it includes "crimes against nature - factual basis: sex offense"

is that the legal term for pitting olives?
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,022
3
Denver
The dumbest has to be the guy in the UK who's on the list for getting it on with his bicycle.

It's not like it was a child's bike.
 

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,840
1
Orange County, CA
The dumbest has to be the guy in the UK who's on the list for getting it on with his bicycle.

It's not like it was a child's bike.
Wow, really? Next time I'm ****ing my big wheel in the UK, I'm going to drag it behind the bushes instead of staying in the middle of the street...
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,022
3
Denver
Wow, really? Next time I'm ****ing my big wheel in the UK, I'm going to drag it behind the bushes instead of staying in the middle of the street...
You didn't hear the story?

He was getting it on with his bike in his own apartment.
 

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
43,647
15,881
Portland, OR
I think penalties in general for driving dangerously, impaired or not, should be jacked up. I hate driving with my kid in my car...frigging people are morons behind the wheel. Seems to me that way too much slack is cut when a car is the weapon.

http://www.deadlyroads.com/sentencecomparison2.html
Unless you've ridden a motorcycle, you will never fully understand the level of others stupidity behind the wheel.
 

BurlyShirley

Rex Grossman Will Rise Again
Jul 4, 2002
19,180
17
TN
ah, let's not forget about bryan hathaway, who was convicted of having liberties with a dead deer. he just lost his appeal.

come to think of it, so do most things once they're dead.
Yes, I remember that one. Didnt the debate denigrate into some conversation like "Isnt it essentially the same act to put on a condom made of sheep intestines?"
Or did I just have that thought myself?
 

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
43,647
15,881
Portland, OR
ah, let's not forget about bryan hathaway, who was convicted of having liberties with a dead deer. he just lost his appeal.

come to think of it, so do most things once they're dead.
Tom Green + dead moose = funny
Bryan Hathaway + dead deer = played out?

I think the key is getting your own show on either MTV or VH1, then you can get away with a lot more.
 

BurlyShirley

Rex Grossman Will Rise Again
Jul 4, 2002
19,180
17
TN
Tom Green + dead moose = funny
Bryan Hathaway + dead deer = played out?

I think the key is getting your own show on either MTV or VH1, then you can get away with a lot more.

That and, anybody whose never masturbated with a pound of ground beef doesnt know what they're missing.