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Shit that happens with other aircraft, thread

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
18,960
9,630
AK
Those are low-power aircraft to fit into the "light sport" aircraft category, meaning it's underpowered as shit. That combined with the waves and the obviously long takeoff roll meant they didn't have enough altitude and when they got closer to the objects, they obviously pulled up harder to try and clear, which induced the stalling condition, although it didn't enter a spin, more a lazy loss of altitude, but you see erratic behavior prior, which is the airplane wing/surfaces likely stalling. They may have gotten themselves into a spot that they couldn't get out of with a floatplane. That isn't hard to do, you can stop real fast due to the drag of water, but overcoming that for takeoff is the polar opposite, evidenced by the long long takeoff roll. Being in an underpowered type only makes that worse. Should have assessed the available takeoff distance in the air by timing it out, but too late now. Also strange that they didn't dive for the deck and just stay a few feet above the water. There's no real need to climb out right away when you are over water.

The waves seemed to be a pretty big deal, what would be fine in a boat is like the perfect storm in a floatplane and slamming through that stuff is not easy. Long long takeoff run to get to the magical "planing" attitude, which is not out of the ordinary in some situations, but you gotta plan for it. Seems like there's plenty of distance in that area, but they just chose the wrong direction.

I got my seaplane rating last year, did it in two different aircraft, one vastly over-powered and one fairly low power. It was good to get the low-power experience, because the over-power one can basically overcome the effects of water drag all the time.

Yeah, looking at it again, they just didn't have the space, maybe trying to keep it close to shore to avoid the bigger waves, but then the obstacles and shoreline limited them from being able to climb ahead and they ran out of space. Really, the performance didn't seem all that bad, but as soon as they came off the water they were out of space. Crazy because there looks to be a lot of space, but maybe the waves were just too big further out. Things get real interesting in rivers. Do you land upwind (normal) or with/against the current?
 
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Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
18,960
9,630
AK
That's what I said.
There's not a whole lot you can F-up in these types of aircraft, meaning that there's no real cargo space and it doesn't sound like they were carrying cargo. You put heavier people in the seats and it'll be more nose heavy, but more airspeed (like after takeoff) fixes that. It wouldn't be realistic for it to be tail-heavy, it would have never gotten on a plane (like a boat) to begin with. You can overload them with blubber people, but then you have a nose-heavy situation where the main obstacle is getting the thing to start rotating and lifting off. If you can do that, you are usually ok due to the increasing speed which only increases control effectiveness from liftoff. Nose heavy is worst on landing, since as you slow down the nose pitches down and you can't keep it from doing so.

Basically, with a sea/float plane, if you can get the thing to the flying attitude in the water, you've got the control and it's not a balance issue. It could still be a weight issue with performance, but their initial climb is pretty decent and it doesn't "mush" in ground effect, they climb up...just that it seems there are obstacles in their immediate path.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,239
7,687
There's not a whole lot you can F-up in these types of aircraft, meaning that there's no real cargo space and it doesn't sound like they were carrying cargo. You put heavier people in the seats and it'll be more nose heavy, but more airspeed (like after takeoff) fixes that. It wouldn't be realistic for it to be tail-heavy
Nevertheless, they persisted

After the crash, weight and balance calculations revealed the airplane was about 57 pounds over its maximum gross weight and outside the weight and center of gravity limits contained in the pilot's operating handbook, according to the report.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,391
20,183
Sleazattle
I am guessing the problem was that the available lift was less than the necessary lift for a period of time that exceeded a safe envelope considering the operational conditions.