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Short Crank Curious…

rideit

Bob the Builder
Aug 24, 2004
19,162
8,599
In the cleavage of the Tetons
Any of you riding the shorties? Impressions beyond what we all know?
165 was an easy transition, thought I would try 160 on the mullet for shits and giggles.
Thing is, I can’t really find any. Canfield made good ones, so I am interested in a used pair of those. Brood (Spawn) makes some, but advertise them as being for kids, so I’m leery on an Enduro sled.
Dev5 and Hope make some, but they are a little pricey to experiment with.
Any tips I am missing?
Suntour makes some that weigh 900 grams without a chainring or BB….
@StiHacka , aren’t you running some stubbies?
 

mykel

closer to Periwinkle
Apr 19, 2013
4,204
2,805
sw ontario canada
Any of you riding the shorties? Impressions beyond what we all know?
165 was an easy transition, thought I would try 160 on the mullet for shits and giggles.
Thing is, I can’t really find any. Canfield made good ones, so I am interested in a used pair of those. Brood (Spawn) makes some, but advertise them as being for kids, so I’m leery on an Enduro sled.
Dev5 and Hope make some, but they are a little pricey to experiment with.
Any tips I am missing?
Suntour makes some that weigh 900 grams without a chainring or BB….
@StiHacka , aren’t you running some stubbies?

Kinda curious about this.
I have 165 on the DH bike, but that does not really count.
On the trailbike, I have 170. Every bike before was 175 cause large guy and tradition.
Did really not feel any glaring difference in the pedalling feel, but I think it has been easier on my knees. Seems to be less owie.

I wonder how you would define and calculate the bio mechanically optimal length crank taking into account upper, lower and total leg lengths, hell possibly even prefered foot placement on the pedals. And if it would make a discernible difference for anybody other than another small point of optimization for absolute elite?
 

StiHacka

Compensating for something
Jan 4, 2013
21,029
12,016
In hell. Welcome!
I have Canfield 155s on the trail bike, they are quality cranks. The only downside is they are GXP so the choice of good BBs is becoming limited. I got the 155s to help with pedaling on my low bike (12.75" BB on a 170/160 monster). They definitely help with knee pains, are easier to ratchet or spin up, I find them better in the air - more nimble to move my bike underneath me; but I also use a smaller chainring than with my usual 165s. I'd buy them again. I switch between my two bikes (155s and 165s) without thinking about the cranks, no adjustment needed.
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
I wonder how you would define and calculate the bio mechanically optimal length crank taking into account upper, lower and total leg lengths, hell possibly even prefered foot placement on the pedals.
I don't think any of the crank length calculators and crank length formulas I've seen online take foot length or cleat placement into account. Making them just as worthless as Ape index is for bar width. But any actual professional bike fitting service worth their title will (should) definitely take that into account. but bike fit biomechanics is not always just about performance but comfort and reducing chance of injury and personal pref also has to come into it .
I'm 5'11" with 33" inseam and definitely get on better with 165s. especially on my roadbike (only bike I clip in on) where 172.5s gave me knee pain. and can also spin them slightly faster.
I don't have any issues with clearance on super low BB even with 170s though. I'm just so used to low BBs my timing is decent and I'll rarely ever drop a pedal at all in low clearance situations.
The stability improvement Hope are pushing for their shorter crank length seems like marketing BS to me as a wider stance is obviously more stable. eg. Next time you're in a fight try keeping your feet close together and see how well you get on. o_O
 

HardtailHack

used an iron once
Jan 20, 2009
4,958
3,028
Had 155mm cranks on my Nicolai Ion in 2010, it had a 13" BB height with an angle set and the shock in the low position.

I raced a pedally track with no big drops so the low BB and short cranks worked for me, other people commented on them feeling weird when they jumped on the bike.

With bigger wheels and more BB drop I don't really see the need for stubby cranks.
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
17,116
15,352
Canaderp
The only downside is they are GXP so the choice of good BBs is becoming limited.
<insert cool story bro> I've had a brand new Sram GXP bottom bracket for sale on PinkBike for almost two years now. Not a single message or low ball offer for it. :rofl:
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Probably because they're still readily available in shops.
WhoTF looks for brand new BBs second hand when they're £25 new?
 

Andeh

Customer Title
Mar 3, 2020
699
699
The stability improvement Hope are pushing for their shorter crank length seems like marketing BS to me as a wider stance is obviously more stable. eg. Next time you're in a fight try keeping your feet close together and see how well you get on. o_O
That was my thought as well. I find 170mm to be a good middle ground for a trail bike, and I like as wide as possible Q-factor on the pedals.

I know most ebikes are running 160mm, but I suspect that's because people do a lot more pedaling through chunk (uphill) on them, plus the motor makes up for any lost efficiency.
 

6thElement

Schrodinger's Immigrant
Jul 29, 2008
12,773
9,679
There's some 155mm Canfield listed in Denver on the bookface GG components group.
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
I know most ebikes are running 160mm, but I suspect that's because people do a lot more pedaling through chunk (uphill) on them, plus the motor makes up for any lost efficiency.
It's. Because they're mostly clueless ans skilleless and suddenly have the ability to rise flat and uphill at pace TBF
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
50,061
15,488
Sleazattle
It's. Because they're mostly clueless ans skilleless and suddenly have the ability to rise flat and uphill at pace TBF

I've recently noticed a trend of e-bikers coming up to me and giving me unsolicited "advice" on what bike to buy and what trails to ride. Innevitably they suggest an e-bike and to ride dumb flow trails. Then they complain about bumps.
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Westy. I've been riding Eebs for 6yrs n still prefer normal bikes, they're fannies?
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
50,061
15,488
Sleazattle
Westy. I've been riding Eebs for 6yrs n still prefer normal bikes, they're fannies?
Not saying all e-bikers are like that but enough that it is becoming a regular occurrence. There are also plenty of people who see someone riding a hardtail and think they are a noob.
 

StiHacka

Compensating for something
Jan 4, 2013
21,029
12,016
In hell. Welcome!
<insert cool story bro> I've had a brand new Sram GXP bottom bracket for sale on PinkBike for almost two years now. Not a single message or low ball offer for it. :rofl:
Sram GXP bottom brackets are a pile of shit, there's a reason they are still in stock everywhere. I was looking for a reasonable aftermarket alternative recently, not many came up, fewer than I remember a couple years ago.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
16,629
7,592
AK
I've recently noticed a trend of e-bikers coming up to me and giving me unsolicited "advice" on what bike to buy and what trails to ride. Innevitably they suggest an e-bike and to ride dumb flow trails. Then they complain about bumps.
Because they don't build trails steep anymore above IMBA-approved grades. You need an e-bike now to get up to speed for a jump on the flat.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
16,629
7,592
AK
Sram GXP bottom brackets are a pile of shit, there's a reason they are still in stock everywhere. I was looking for a reasonable aftermarket alternative recently, not many came up, fewer than I remember a couple years ago.
Giga-external-pipe? You sure you don't mean ISIS gigapipe shit? GXP is simply good-ole-6086 bearings usually and like a screw-in PF.
 
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Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Sram GXP bottom brackets are a pile of shit, there's a reason they are still in stock everywhere. I was looking for a reasonable aftermarket alternative recently, not many came up, fewer than I remember a couple years ago.
It's the wavy washer preload and floating axle design of GXP that's stupid in an aplication which takes side loads and shock forces. The actual BB is just a couple of bearings in threaded cups same as anyone else's.
Move away from gxp altogether rather than look for a better BB
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Dub is no better. Same shit design Just 4.9mm wider diameter. And rebranded as SRAM. Which helped no one.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
16,629
7,592
AK
Dub is no better. Same shit design Just 4.9mm wider diameter. And rebranded as SRAM. Which helped no one.
With bearings in an odd size so you are forced to buy from overpriced and under designed mtb companies.
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Or you could be an absolute hero and have a custom batch of say 10000 made and sell them for no profit to punters.
I'm not sure how you think £25 is overpriced for two precision engineered bearing cups with bearings and seals pre installed. Manufactured in another continent, shipped to distributor and sold by a retailer of close proximity to you. But whatever.
 

Cerberus75

Monkey
Feb 18, 2017
507
190
I have Canfield 155s on the trail bike, they are quality cranks. The only downside is they are GXP so the choice of good BBs is becoming limited. I got the 155s to help with pedaling on my low bike (12.75" BB on a 170/160 monster). They definitely help with knee pains, are easier to ratchet or spin up, I find them better in the air - more nimble to move my bike underneath me; but I also use a smaller chainring than with my usual 165s. I'd buy them again. I switch between my two bikes (155s and 165s) without thinking about the cranks, no adjustment needed.
Their GXP is pretty decent. I'm on 160s. And agree with the above.
 

SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
1,786
580
coloRADo
I saw a sports doctor in Boulder who specializes in bike set up. With my hip and knee issues he actually recommended shorter cranks and wider q factor. And it helped!

He actually had cranks, stems, bars, saddles of varying length/sizes to try right on sight, on your own bike. It was really good experience. Not cheap, but now I'm riding with less pain!
 

SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
1,786
580
coloRADo
How long cranks do you ride with now? I could use a wider Q factor, too.
I went from 175 to 165. That was like 4 years ago. On trail bike. Always been on 165 for DH.

If you are already at 165, and have pain, maybe 155 is the way to go? Or try back to 175? Not sure.

The way the doc described it, it's like we "wear out" our body parts over time doing repetitive movements. If you can change something so the body is wearing out even very slightly different bits of body parts through crank length and q factor, (even your seat, fore/aft length and seat height) you can find relief.

I won't even mention reach/stack, stem and handlebar. I've also got neck issues.

As for q factor, besides buying a bike with a larger BB width. You can try inserting more spacers. Yeah, that could mean not optimal chain line. I also put in spacers/washers on my pedals/cranks to widen my stance. Even that 1.5mm per side helped.
 

rideit

Bob the Builder
Aug 24, 2004
19,162
8,599
In the cleavage of the Tetons
So, still striking out here. Any of you Inter-sleuths able to find a decent 160mm crank arm, direct mount CR of some kind, and possibly a 24mm spindle, I‘LL come to your house and wash your car.
Or just send you an e-beer.
I just think 155 might be a bit too dramatic of a change, but I don’t know.
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
17,116
15,352
Canaderp
These come in 160mm

 

rideit

Bob the Builder
Aug 24, 2004
19,162
8,599
In the cleavage of the Tetons
These come in 160mm

30t is the smallest chainring. (I think?) Wifey will want a 28, at least.
The Hope’s we’re just announced, so basically still vapore-ware.
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Considering Hope have been selling short Eeb cranks for a good while now I can't see the short normal ones taking too long to reach production
 

rideit

Bob the Builder
Aug 24, 2004
19,162
8,599
In the cleavage of the Tetons
Gary, if they hit your local shops soon, could I trouble you to ship a set across?
I think if the $-£ remains as it is, it might be cheaper than me waiting for them to be available here wholesale.
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
5,495
3,603
UK
Gary, if they hit your local shops soon, could I trouble you to ship a set across?
I think if the $-£ remains as it is, it might be cheaper than me waiting for them to be available here wholesale.
Yeah. No problem. Just PM me
 

4xBoy

Turbo Monkey
Jun 20, 2006
6,320
1,647
Minneapolis
So, still striking out here. Any of you Inter-sleuths able to find a decent 160mm crank arm, direct mount CR of some kind, and possibly a 24mm spindle, I‘LL come to your house and wash your car.
Or just send you an e-beer.
I just think 155 might be a bit too dramatic of a change, but I don’t know.
Wrong spindle, probably to expensive.