sinister 'passion'
- Thread starter xy9ine
- Start date
I like the look but....
it looks like a 4bar
just some bolts are in different places
it looks like a 4bar
just some bolts are in different places
http://bustedspoke.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=26274
Read that, verticult is Frank the Welder. It will explain everything.
xy9ine (and hungryleprican), it's got an extra pivot there.
I'm not sure I completely buy the explanation in that thread, at least not at complete face value. I see what they're trying to accomplish, I just can't buy that it accomplishes a real area suspension.
I'm not sure I completely buy the explanation in that thread, at least not at complete face value. I see what they're trying to accomplish, I just can't buy that it accomplishes a real area suspension.
So, why did the splinter disappear so quickly?
-r
-r
it does, FTW sent me the CAD layout...took my brain a bit to get around the idea since as far as i know 5 bars have never been done, pretty clever. I woulda had the chance to test ride it but injuries and other life things got in the way...xy9ine (and hungryleprican), it's got an extra pivot there.
I'm not sure I completely buy the explanation in that thread, at least not at complete face value. I see what they're trying to accomplish, I just can't buy that it accomplishes a real area suspension.
Oh, it really does have a wheelpath zone and not an arc. Very eerie sensation plowing through things that should slow you down (logs, curbs, 6" diameter rock fields) and not slowing down. It is like the feeling you get when you pull on a brake lever that is not attached to the caliper, and you expect to slow down, so it feels like you are accelerating. After the show I will post up a little illustrated blurb that explains how the VST system works, but boyee, it sure does! There is a mechanical stop that the lower rocker engages that you can't see in the picture among other things....xy9ine (and hungryleprican), it's got an extra pivot there.
I'm not sure I completely buy the explanation in that thread, at least not at complete face value. I see what they're trying to accomplish, I just can't buy that it accomplishes a real area suspension.
Sinister R+D folks have been riding various incarnations of the VST design since January, and Frank keeps tweaking and modifying things to get the bikes working even better. The bike in the picutre is still a proto and it will have a front end hammered out over an irish wheel by the time it reaches production. It will be real pretty, real light and will slay any trail it sees. We are also preparing the Poision for spring release, which is a heavier-duty freeride oriented bike.
The R9 is just getting geometry tweaks for '07 (it was the most winning frame on the eastcoast in '06, so it obviously doesn't need much), but we have already begun work on something to supercede the R9 on top of the podium in 2008.
K, i love it, I want it, and I love east coasty buddies.
BUT
Lockout on pedaling and braking? This is why cannondale ditched their gemini. How does it affect the FrankTheWinister design? They mention superb pedalling, but a rearward arc will be cancelled out by pedal force, making it bob. Braking will have some effect I'm sure, but I can't say what. I trust FTW design, he had a hand in the original lawill bikes, which I loved, but just because a bike pedals well or absorbs bumps well doesn't mean it will pedal and absorb bumbs at the same time well.
anybody?
BUT
Lockout on pedaling and braking? This is why cannondale ditched their gemini. How does it affect the FrankTheWinister design? They mention superb pedalling, but a rearward arc will be cancelled out by pedal force, making it bob. Braking will have some effect I'm sure, but I can't say what. I trust FTW design, he had a hand in the original lawill bikes, which I loved, but just because a bike pedals well or absorbs bumps well doesn't mean it will pedal and absorb bumbs at the same time well.
anybody?
Oh yeah, and did i mention that it is the best pedaling, most active suspension design ever? Mass transfer or whatever you want to call it can still make it bob, but you can wail away on the pedals all you want and the suspension keeps abosrbing bumps without being influenced by the suspension, no lockout. And under braking the wheelpath aligns with the direction of travel, meaning the thing slows down scary fast and the wheel stays stuck to the ground!
man i really feel like a dolt for not taking FTWs offer
Plattekill -
Sunday (Nobman): 2 wins
Sunday (Karen Eagen): 4 wins (won every race she entered)
R9 (Ford): 1 win
R9 (Stoddard): 1 win
Diablo -
Sunday (Nobman): 1 win
Sunday (Wruble): 1 win
R9 (Ford): 1 win
Mt Snow -
Sunday (Nobman): 2 wins
Sunday (Eagen): 3 wins
Sunday (Wruble): 1 win
Sugar Mtn Nationals -
Sunday (Sam): 1 win
Mt Snow Nationals -
Sunday (Sabrina): 1 win
edit - appologies to any Sinister or Sunday racers that I may have missed.
$1million for a lost weekend?man i really feel like a dolt for not taking FTWs offer
You left out Snowshoe and Sugar and Whiteface. That might boost up the "Sinister to Iron Horse' ratio? Also, a lot of expert win comparison might boost the ratio as well?
posted by mistake before finishing. just listed pro wins, although you're right, Whiteface was won by Ford. Added Mt Snow and Sugar to the list. :biggrin:
Let's have a bike industry insider pissing match! Subtract the girls and the mutants, and add , Whiteface and the Snowshoe races and re-calculate... I think IH can let me claim this, fer chrissakes you guys won worlds, and what, 4 nationals and 4 world cups! Not to mention nearly selling more DH oriented bikes than the rest of the industry combined!Plattekill -
Sunday (Nobman): 2 wins
Sunday (Karen Eagen): 4 wins (won every race she entered)
R9 (Ford): 1 win
R9 (Stoddard): 1 win
Diablo -
Sunday (Nobman): 1 win
Sunday (Wruble): 1 win
R9 (Ford): 1 win
Mt Snow -
Sunday (Nobman): 2 wins
Sunday (Eagen): 3 wins
Sunday (Wruble): 1 win
Sugar Mtn Nationals -
Sunday (Sam): 1 win
Mt Snow Nationals -
Sunday (Sabrina): 1 win
And Knobman, Hill or Ford could be winning most of these races on '97 proflex beasts anyway.
Crap, I have one of those in my Mom's garage. I'm gonna bust it out this weekend.
hell, I'm just happy that there's a resurgence in DH'ing and racing here in the Northeast, that makes both of us happy. just don't let out that these guys can win on anything, that destroys the "our bikes are better b/c sam hill is fast" marketing ploy. :biggrin: you forgot US national champion... wink
Looks neat. I'd love to hear the physical qualification of this statement, becuase if "mass transfer can still make it bob" AND "the suspension keeps absorbing bumps without being influenced" then we have a major quandary regarding the laws of physics here. Maybe gravity works differently at your house, I dont know that, but I do know that those 2 statements are contradictory.
Marketing stuff and hype is cool and all, I understand the plan here. Just saying lets keep it real. As Todd says "Lets call a spade a spade".
Keep up the good work, its nice to see new things being tried.
Dave
specialized?
it was too complicated and the frame broke at the seat-tube.
that new bike does look very nice though.
DW:
Somewhere outside his house is a place that even Einstein dare not tread...
Random Fact About Sam Hill:
- If Sam Hill races on anything but an I.H. Sunday he will loose all of his magical powers.
Lol...:biggrin:
Somewhere outside his house is a place that even Einstein dare not tread...
Random Fact About Sam Hill:
- If Sam Hill races on anything but an I.H. Sunday he will loose all of his magical powers.
No, there just wasn't any time with developing VST. There were 2 cracked ER triangles, but the rest of that statement is fallacious. Nothing too complicated about a linkage actuated single pivot!
looks great and everything, but if there's one thing i cant stand it's overhyping something and cramming it down people's throats. let the bike speak for itself when it makes it to the masses.
Since when has that ever happened? Besides, people are asking questions and so people who know something about the bike are trying to answer them.
since when has what ever happened? there are plenty of bikes that are far less hyped up by advertising/the company and perform just as well. turner bikes come to mind. all i was saying was lets not compare a bike that has not even made it to production yet to other bikes are are race-proven to be great bikes.
that being said, i have ridden the sinister prototypes, and they are great bikes. however, i will leave it at that and not make them seem to be god's gift to the biking world.
Wait wait wait....a near normal seattube angle? That can't be right...why would you actually want to be able to adjust your seat on a bike? Surely you can mess up that nice looking design at least a little...it's too-- "useful" or "smart"
oh snapxy9ine (and hungryleprican), it's got an extra pivot there.
I'm not sure I completely buy the explanation in that thread, at least not at complete face value. I see what they're trying to accomplish, I just can't buy that it accomplishes a real area suspension.
romano is alive and well on rm
too complicated???? broken frames????
Please explain, I've been on a MX since last November and haven't had one issue.
I'm thinking of selling my r9 and splinter and getting the FR VST incarnation when it comes out.
Email me, dude, I haven't talked to you in forever.
I see what they're trying to accomplish, but wouldn't the amount of rearward travel be pretty negledgable? Seems like you're going to hit the limit of that lower link pretty quickly.it does, FTW sent me the CAD layout...took my brain a bit to get around the idea since as far as i know 5 bars have never been done, pretty clever. I woulda had the chance to test ride it but injuries and other life things got in the way...
I heard about that... sorry to be off topic but are there any plans for K2 to come back out with a Downhill or freeride bike?Iron Horse wins then as we are also K2 Bike now
-ska todd
Alot of the hyping is not being done by the company. Mostly friends of the company and sponsored riders. And, turners are hyped by people (just not the company).
edit - nevermind, this is the best bike ever! if you dont buy one you will never win a race! EVER!
2step dh