I blame the Sumerians. If they had never invented civilization, we would never had gotten organized enough to perpetrate mass destruction and build monster trucks.
So Who Did **** Up the World?
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d-sop
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US, China, Mid East.
i also BLAME CANADA. seoriusly.
i also BLAME CANADA. seoriusly.
No, but they realized that it was generally better for everyone to improve the situation in the countries they invaded rather than **** them up. Pretty simple really.dan-o said:So the Romans woke up one day and decided to singlehandedly improve the world around them with no selfish intentions?
Really though....it is the Media Blamers fault.
So it's ok for one group of people to do that but not another..........yeah whatever..........sounds like a double standard to me.Changleen said:
Oh and before the Romans "took over" Christianity they were not known for the stuff you're alluding to.
A double standard seperated by 2500 years? OK.. I'd have hoped we'd have moved on a bit since then.Andyman_1970 said:
Before the Romans 'took over' Christianity they were not known for building roads, agriculture, schools, sewage, central heating? I think you need to go back and check your history. Before Christianity the Romans were at the peak of their power, and coincidentally once it was embraced the process of decay started. Another good thing ruined by religion?
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enkidu
Guest
jaydee said:
One Sumerian proverb says:
"It's not a city (of civilization), (when and where) wild (ferocious) dogs and foxes (liars) are "nu-bandas" (supervisors / governors / mayors)".
They obviously had predator Sumerians and victim Sumerians already 5000 years ago. And people with pen (well, stylist in their case) lamented.
I blame the predators of all ages.
Yeah they were known for building those things, on the backs of enslaved native people they invaded. They did all those advanced things but also raped, murdered, and exploited the people who were in their Empire. My history is fine, I choose to view all of it in it's wholeness, not just the cool techno aspects.Changleen said:
So you're double standard stands, and not separated by as much as you think, Roman Christianity took up the violence of Pagan Rome not long after it was declared the religion of the Empire by Constantine in 320 AD. It would seem you accept or at least minimize the violence and ruthlessness of the Roman Empire based on it's technological advances - and yet choose to focus on that aspect of Christianity which historically is fairly brief and certainly not a reflection of what it truly represents.
I don't deny the messed up nature of Christianity, either now, nor in the past - but realize it wasn't until Rome Hellenized what was essentially a sect of Judaism that it began to use violence, or at least turn a blind eye to it. Prior to that, early Christianity was non-violent.
It was the takers...
Hey, only Terrance and Phillip can blame Canada!
You got that cunty!
Hey, only Terrance and Phillip can blame Canada!
You got that cunty!
Terrance and Philip ARE canadain. Why would they blame canada? They are the source of the blame.steelewheels said:
Raider Fans.
Dodger Fans.
Dodger Fans.
The scorched earth campaigns of Antoninus Pius hardly "improved" things.Changleen said:
Oh but they built aquaducts so that makes it acceptable.......................Damn True said:
Then forced conscription into the Roman armies then killed the families of the new soldiers and burned their farms so they would have nowhere to go should they decide to desert.Andyman_1970 said:Oh but they built aquaducts so that makes it acceptable.......................
The whole colusseum thing is classy too.
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d-sop
Guest
i DO blame canada.MMike said:
how nice for youd-sop said:
People are pretty much responsible.
People in every culture have pretty much acted the same. Wiccans and the like can argue for a return to 'pre-bronze-age matriarchical societies' (I'm not kidding on this, scarily enough; people believe in this kind of pseudo-history) in which 'things were in harmony and all decisions were made by consensus' (still not kidding; apparently there was no free will and no one was a bastard before the Greek men and their metal), but hey...SOMEONE kicked those wiccan-proto-hippie-matriarchists' asses and set the world in a spin...
Seriously, there's a tendency to think of the world as a place where harmony can reign, and the world is only ****ed because we keep screwing up the formula. But what's kept 'harmony' in lots of places (thinking of, say, Native American or New Zealand Maori) has been 1) there weren't enough people to really screw up/pollute the place and 2) they didn't have the technological means.
Introduce guns to these 'balanced' cultures and watch for someone to decide to get ahead, take advantage, and dominate, typically by violence, often by/for control of resources. Happens every single time. That's how humans are.
So I know why this thread started...I talked about Europeans ****ing up the world...but that comment was meant in a limited scope, post-colonially, in which the European's re-drawing/creation of fairly artificial borders and states were both destabilizing and destructive. But that wasn't meant as a broad-brush implication that it was only the Europeans...hell, when they '****ed up' the Middle East and Africa, those places were still open to the same kinds of problems and conflicts that plague people and civilizations the world over.
Marxists may cringe at the thought, but I don't see there ever being a "one-philosophy" political answer to the world's problems. We fix each according to how we can at the time in which we do it, with an ear to history for potential solutions and an adaptive, creative eye to the future. Conflict will always be here and people will, by and large, be at least tolerable as individuals if not wonderful, and idiotic if not downright evil in groups.
MD
People in every culture have pretty much acted the same. Wiccans and the like can argue for a return to 'pre-bronze-age matriarchical societies' (I'm not kidding on this, scarily enough; people believe in this kind of pseudo-history) in which 'things were in harmony and all decisions were made by consensus' (still not kidding; apparently there was no free will and no one was a bastard before the Greek men and their metal), but hey...SOMEONE kicked those wiccan-proto-hippie-matriarchists' asses and set the world in a spin...
Seriously, there's a tendency to think of the world as a place where harmony can reign, and the world is only ****ed because we keep screwing up the formula. But what's kept 'harmony' in lots of places (thinking of, say, Native American or New Zealand Maori) has been 1) there weren't enough people to really screw up/pollute the place and 2) they didn't have the technological means.
Introduce guns to these 'balanced' cultures and watch for someone to decide to get ahead, take advantage, and dominate, typically by violence, often by/for control of resources. Happens every single time. That's how humans are.
So I know why this thread started...I talked about Europeans ****ing up the world...but that comment was meant in a limited scope, post-colonially, in which the European's re-drawing/creation of fairly artificial borders and states were both destabilizing and destructive. But that wasn't meant as a broad-brush implication that it was only the Europeans...hell, when they '****ed up' the Middle East and Africa, those places were still open to the same kinds of problems and conflicts that plague people and civilizations the world over.
Marxists may cringe at the thought, but I don't see there ever being a "one-philosophy" political answer to the world's problems. We fix each according to how we can at the time in which we do it, with an ear to history for potential solutions and an adaptive, creative eye to the future. Conflict will always be here and people will, by and large, be at least tolerable as individuals if not wonderful, and idiotic if not downright evil in groups.
MD
That's how pretty much every single living thing is. We're just arrogant enough to believe that we are special and different by nature.MikeD said:
Well, we are the only animals with technology and industry beyond our mouths, hooves, and the occasional piece of termite-laden grass...but we're also the only animal capable of recognizing the large-scale consequences of our actions. Ironically, we don't seem to much care about that as we forage for leafy green dollars.Silver said:
MD
So you think a lion roaming the Savannah sees a gazelle and then ponders the sustainability of the species before killing it? "Moderating consumption" to animals equates to "can't find any food right now", not some greater good philosophy.Changleen said: