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Sram GX vs X9 - 10 Speed

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,190
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Canaderp
Has anyone used the Sram GX 10 speed rear derailleur? Any input on it?

Currently I'm running a Sram X9 type 2 derailleur, but the pivots on it are shot. The thing ghost shifts over big hits.

Did GX replace X9? The picture slots it in above and below X9?


Don't really feel like replacing everything for 11 speed at the moment...
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,190
19,156
Canaderp
Get another X9 or a X0 if you find It cheap. The GX is way inferior, the pivots will develop play much faster than with the X9.
Hmm that's a little disappointing. X9 seems hard to find and XO is still pretty pricey.....at least up here it is.

Can get a GX derailleur for about $89 up here (retail price).
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,190
19,156
Canaderp
Kind of leaning that way, the more I think about it. There is a guy selling a new X9 clutch derailleur on PB, which if I can snag it would be about $75.

OR.......just did a quick wishlist thing on CRC and for 11 speed XT derailleur, SLX shifter, SLX chain, XT cassette and a narrow wide ring (lots to choose from for around $50), it would be about $300 to make the move. Which is probably the smarter move, considering my current chain ring and cassette are probably at the end of their life anyways.
 

slimshady

¡Mira, una ardilla!
Kind of leaning that way, the more I think about it. There is a guy selling a new X9 clutch derailleur on PB, which if I can snag it would be about $75.

OR.......just did a quick wishlist thing on CRC and for 11 speed XT derailleur, SLX shifter, SLX chain, XT cassette and a narrow wide ring (lots to choose from for around $50), it would be about $300 to make the move. Which is probably the smarter move, considering my current chain ring and cassette are probably at the end of their life anyways.
If inclined that way, why won't you go straight to 11s? SLX der/cassette/shifter/chain should be less than that, and a nice SRAM NX/X1 combo could be easily put together for a similar amount shopping online. That way you shouldn't need to go hacking cassettes n' shit. Take a look at Jenson or CRC for reference values.
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,190
19,156
Canaderp
If inclined that way, why won't you go straight to 11s? SLX der/cassette/shifter/chain should be less than that, and a nice SRAM NX/X1 combo could be easily put together for a similar amount shopping online. That way you shouldn't need to go hacking cassettes n' shit. Take a look at Jenson or CRC for reference values.
I'm in Canada, so the $300 was in our crappy Canadia moneys. $300 for Shimano 11 speed stuff plus a new chain ring.

If I went Sram, wouldn't I get dicked into replacing my freehub as well?
 

slimshady

¡Mira, una ardilla!
I'm in Canada, so the $300 was in our crappy Canadia moneys. $300 for Shimano 11 speed stuff plus a new chain ring.

If I went Sram, wouldn't I get dicked into replacing my freehub as well?
Nah, I went 11sp by putting together a Shimano M8000 11-42 11sp cassette, a SRAM X1 rear derailleur, X1 chain and GX shifter. I already had a Race Face N/W 32t chainring. I have more than enough range for my riding skills/fitness level/terrain combo.

If you wait a bit longer you could even get the new 11-46 cassette: http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ca/en/shimano-xt-m8000-11-speed-11-46t-cassette/rp-prod149701 . As far as I can tell, it should work with most of the SRAM 11sp stuff.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,031
7,550
Won't there be XD vs non-XD driver/free hub issues then?
 

slimshady

¡Mira, una ardilla!
Won't there be XD vs non-XD driver/free hub issues then?
Nah, you would just loose the 10t cog when going with a Shimano (freehub) compatible cassette. SRAM has the NX, a 11sp riveted-together 10-42 cassette.

If I was the one jumping to 11sp again, I'd go with a Sunrace MX8 11sp 11-46 cassette, a SRAM X1 derailleur, PC-X1 chain and GX shifter. Best bang for the buck if you like SRAM. If Shimano gets you going, a SLX chain/shifter/cassette with a XT derailleur would be my go-to.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,005
Seattle
Shimano shifters and derailleurs last way better in my experience, especially on the less swanky stuff. As mentioned, if you currently have a standard Shimano hub driver and don't want to switch to xD you can always run a Shimano 11 speed cassette with an otherwise Sram setup, but I'd just go full Shimano and be done with it.
 

kickstand

Turbo Monkey
Sep 18, 2009
3,441
392
Fenton, MI
Running 11 speed GX on trail bikes, quite a few miles in and they are working rather flawlessly and have no play in the pivots what so ever. Also running a GX or X0 on the DH bike and after 3 weekends it hasn't broken any derailuer cables, unlike my Zee's.......
 

kickstand

Turbo Monkey
Sep 18, 2009
3,441
392
Fenton, MI
Shimano shifters and derailleurs last way better in my experience, especially on the less swanky stuff. As mentioned, if you currently have a standard Shimano hub driver and don't want to switch to xD you can always run a Shimano 11 speed cassette with an otherwise Sram setup, but I'd just go full Shimano and be done with it.
in my experience, I have come to the conclusion that those who think shimano is superior are fanboys. I have a pretty good mix of both in the stable and through out the last couple years, both have good stuff and crappy stuff and sometimes its also hit or miss.

the GX stuff is solid in my opinion.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,005
Seattle
in my experience, I have come to the conclusion that those who think shimano is superior are fanboys. I have a pretty good mix of both in the stable and through out the last couple years, both have good stuff and crappy stuff and sometimes its also hit or miss.

the GX stuff is solid in my opinion.
I'm not saying Sram stuff is useless, but I definitely think that their clutches wear out and shifters get a little sloppy feeling more quickly than Shimano. YMMV.
 

kickstand

Turbo Monkey
Sep 18, 2009
3,441
392
Fenton, MI
I'm not saying Sram stuff is useless, but I definitely think that their clutches wear out and shifters get a little sloppy feeling more quickly than Shimano. YMMV.
That's kinda the point of my post, my mileage has varied. Shimano vs SRAM is currently no different than the Ford vs Chevy argument. Everyone's personal experience has been different, you either hate Sram, or hate Shimano and love the other, or like me, you sit directly on the fence and realize that it can be hit or miss.

Example, my Zee brakes sucked, my SLX brakes are 100% acceptable. I love my Guides, never had the old "avid" problems, but i do hate bleeding and dealing with dot fluid.

I hate SRAM cranks, prefer shimano interface, because I've broken sram set ups.

I like my pike, love my 40, don't care for boxxers.

My GX components have been great, no complaints. My zee derailuers ate up cables, my xt or whatever derailuer it was I had last year on my trail bike was great.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,005
Seattle
That's kinda the point of my post, my mileage has varied. Shimano vs SRAM is currently no different than the Ford vs Chevy argument. Everyone's personal experience has been different, you either hate Sram, or hate Shimano and love the other, or like me, you sit directly on the fence and realize that it can be hit or miss.

Example, my Zee brakes sucked, my SLX brakes are 100% acceptable. I love my Guides, never had the old "avid" problems, but i do hate bleeding and dealing with dot fluid.

I hate SRAM cranks, prefer shimano interface, because I've broken sram set ups.

I like my pike, love my 40, don't care for boxxers.

My GX components have been great, no complaints. My zee derailuers ate up cables, my xt or whatever derailuer it was I had last year on my trail bike was great.
Sure. I was stating my opinion as, you know, my opinion. Other people have different ones, that's fine.

I also agree that Shimano isn't infallible. Their brakes do have well documented issues with inconsistent feel, did have an old Saint derailleur that ate cables, etc.
 

kickstand

Turbo Monkey
Sep 18, 2009
3,441
392
Fenton, MI
Sure. I was stating my opinion as, you know, my opinion. Other people have different ones, that's fine.

I also agree that Shimano isn't infallible. Their brakes do have well documented issues with inconsistent feel, did have an old Saint derailleur that ate cables, etc.
I get it....the point of my post was that I was agreeing with you and the YMMV part, mine has varied, certain shimano stuff outlasts certain sram stuff, for sure, but that's a two way street. I really think it comes down to certain levels of either being decent, and certain levels having issues....

ie, we can all agree sram x5 sucks, wears out fast, etc. But it's also about on par with some of the cheap shimano stuff that wears out super fast.

most xt level stuff is good.
GX is also pretty good.

Here, have this beer as a token of my "let's be friends" - ness.

Any day spent debating and discussing bike parts is far better than a day on the other side of the grass.
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,190
19,156
Canaderp
Ooops, my finger seems to have slipped on the buy button, again.



Problem solved?

I'm thinking of ditching the e-thirteen chain guide now. Do these narrow-wide chain rings really make that big of a difference? It'd be awesome to get away from that noisy lower roller...
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
18,852
9,557
AK
I have to hand it to sram, I've been trying to kill these two X9 derailleurs for over 3 years now...
 

kickstand

Turbo Monkey
Sep 18, 2009
3,441
392
Fenton, MI
Ooops, my finger seems to have slipped on the buy button, again.

Problem solved?

I'm thinking of ditching the e-thirteen chain guide now. Do these narrow-wide chain rings really make that big of a difference? It'd be awesome to get away from that noisy lower roller...
In my experience the narrow wide seems to do pretty good on my rigid fatbike (zee derailuer), but on my stumpjumper FSR with x9 derailuer I still had drops, my wife has had zero drops on her 5010 with gram GX, I put a small upper guide (direct mount gamut unit with out lower roller) on my 5010 with GX and of course no drops with the guide and n/w in place.

I think my buddy has had a drop or two on his transition scout (ironically with horst link-ish set up like stumpjumper) but nothing major, he's running the 1x11 sram that's a step nicer than my GX.

So, my conclusion is that narrow wide is pretty good, but not perfect. For a FS I still run the guide for peace of mind, for a hardtail I think you could skip the guide....I think the chain length changes through the suspension travel is enough to give teh NW fits on occasion.
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,190
19,156
Canaderp
In my experience the narrow wide seems to do pretty good on my rigid fatbike (zee derailuer), but on my stumpjumper FSR with x9 derailuer I still had drops, my wife has had zero drops on her 5010 with gram GX, I put a small upper guide (direct mount gamut unit with out lower roller) on my 5010 with GX and of course no drops with the guide and n/w in place.

I think my buddy has had a drop or two on his transition scout (ironically with horst link-ish set up like stumpjumper) but nothing major, he's running the 1x11 sram that's a step nicer than my GX.

So, my conclusion is that narrow wide is pretty good, but not perfect. For a FS I still run the guide for peace of mind, for a hardtail I think you could skip the guide....I think the chain length changes through the suspension travel is enough to give teh NW fits on occasion.
Good points, thanks. Nothing kills the momentum of a ride faster than a dropped chain. Well, perhaps a broken chain does... I've somehow dropped the chain a few times even with this chain guide, don't ask me how, but its happened.

Realistically I'll probably just remove the lower pulley and put in a few good rides. If that seems good then I'll cut off the excess where the pulley mounts to.
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,190
19,156
Canaderp
I have to hand it to sram, I've been trying to kill these two X9 derailleurs for over 3 years now...
They do seem fairly resilient to me. My previous X9 9 speed derailleur ended up in my spokes at one point, which bent the pulley cage plates and cracked one of the pulleys in half. I just bent it back trailside and rode it for another year.

Had another XO 9 speed derailleur on my old DH bike. That thing slid on some rocks and had one of the rivet heads on a pivot lopped right off. Just kept riding it and sold it with the bike.

I've had this 10 speed X9 with clutch for 2-3 seasons now. I did take a few spills on it this year, so not sure if that is why the pivots are wobbly, but it has been sloppy all summer. Still keeps chugging on though.

Not sure if you can hear it, but I took this short video last weekend. All the creaking is coming from the derailleur. I'm sure it'll just keep working, but that noise has GOT TO GO. :busted:
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,005
Seattle
Yeah, I'd at least run a top guide. Narrow wide rings help, but they aren't magic.

I haven't run a lower guide on anything except my DH bike in ages though, between clutch derailleurs and narrow wide rings that seems to be plenty for a trail bike.
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
85,565
24,183
media blackout
Yeah, I'd at least run a top guide. Narrow wide rings help, but they aren't magic.

I haven't run a lower guide on anything except my DH bike in ages though, between clutch derailleurs and narrow wide rings that seems to be plenty for a trail bike.
you can also get small standalone bash guards that mount to your iscg's, which are a nice complement to a top only bash. there's a few companies making "guides" that are just this - a bash and a top guide.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,580
2,005
Seattle
you can also get small standalone bash guards that mount to your iscg's, which are a nice complement to a top only bash. there's a few companies making "guides" that are just this - a bash and a top guide.
I have this pretty cool flexible nickel plated steel bash guard with an aluminum support that's built right in to my bikes, but YMMV.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,031
7,550
The chain is the joke.

No dropped chains without a guide on my 5010. X01 in back, Absolute Black narrow-wide oval ring up front.
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,190
19,156
Canaderp
How it goes...

Went to put the cassette on and.....apparently I've been riding around with a broken axle in the back..:rolleyes:

 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,031
7,550
New hotness: two part through axle design.

I did that once, to a poorly named Nuke Proof Ti hub back from the days in which freewheels (rather than freehubs) were still a thing.
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,190
19,156
Canaderp
New hotness: two part through axle design.

I did that once, to a poorly named Nuke Proof Ti hub back from the days in which freewheels (rather than freehubs) were still a thing.
Its all the beer's fault, man.

If I had just procrastinated, like usual, this wouldn't be an issue and I'd ride it like nothing happened.

Now I've got to overnight parts from japan for that 10 second quarter mile time.

DANGER TO MANIFOLD
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,031
7,550
Bolt it back up and ride it anyway. Ignore odd creaking noises. :D Post the aftermath.
 

StiHacka

Compensating for something
Jan 4, 2013
21,560
12,504
In hell. Welcome!
Thou shalt not ride Hope Pro 2 hubs with the Maxle Lite skinny-in-the-middle axle. There is a bearing without any support in the hub.

Also, IMHO, N/W + clutch RD == no need for any guide, until the N/W gets worn. You'll be dropping chains before experiencing chain suck.
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,190
19,156
Canaderp
Thou shalt not ride Hope Pro 2 hubs with the Maxle Lite skinny-in-the-middle axle. There is a bearing without any support in the hub.
Had a feeling it would eventually break. The axle itself is thin as hell, which is why I think the EVO hub came out?

Plan is to get another axle as a stop gap and eventually get a new hub and have the shop relace the wheel. Only tricky part is that my LBS (and shop owner I ride with) has limited picking of hub stuff, he doesn't do a ton of custom stuff and apparently the distributors are pretty bad here for Hope stuff. Sooooo, buy hub online and bring it to him...awkward.
 

StiHacka

Compensating for something
Jan 4, 2013
21,560
12,504
In hell. Welcome!
Had a feeling it would eventually break. The axle itself is thin as hell, which is why I think the EVO hub came out?

Plan is to get another axle as a stop gap and eventually get a new hub and have the shop relace the wheel. Only tricky part is that my LBS (and shop owner I ride with) has limited picking of hub stuff, he doesn't do a ton of custom stuff and apparently the distributors are pretty bad here for Hope stuff. Sooooo, buy hub online and bring it to him...awkward.
keep the hub, replace the axle
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
20,190
19,156
Canaderp
keep the hub, replace the axle
How many times should I let it brake before getting a new hub? A quick googling shows this as a when not if scenario.

It does sound like there are steel axles floating around out there. I've sent email to Hope asking. I'm hoping that have some.
 

StiHacka

Compensating for something
Jan 4, 2013
21,560
12,504
In hell. Welcome!
How many times should I let it brake before getting a new hub? A quick googling shows this as a when not if scenario.

It does sound like there are steel axles floating around out there. I've sent email to Hope asking. I'm hoping that have some.
You need a new beefier Maxle that is not tapered.

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