[stoney]

Well.... yeah I turn it down because I have way too much paying work to do to install parts the custmer brought themselves...... On top of that I still have to warranty my work. Translation is that I install your part, it goes bad, I still have to warranty the labor, that means your car will be sitting on my rack costing me money while you take the part back to get another....

I have a rule with taking my parts to a shop - I will only bring OEM parts for that specific model. If something needs to be replaced that interacts with a non-stock (I still only use Subaru OEM parts), I will detail out everything that has been done in relation to that needing work.

You sound like the classic I got effed by a mechanic, so they must all be thieves kinda guy, sadly thats our biggest obstacle to overcome with automotive. People that have this mindset that we are just a bunch of thieves. Sadly there are those out there that really do deserve this reputation, it ruins it for the majority of us.

Never got f*ed because I knew enough about the car I was bringing in to laugh in the guy's face and leave. I have watched multiple friends get screwed by independents and dealer alike. Generally I just refer them to specialty shops.

On the note of the race shop..... thats just a naive statement..... Most race shops are were you will find the most hacks doing work. The phrase you are looking for is specialty shop.

You are correct, mis-noted the name.

Dont get me wrong, if you can do it, by all means wrench away. No reason why if your capable you shouldnt be saving for yourself when you can, but make no mistake, the number of people who can do it properly vs those who cause more problems than they fix is very slim.

Can't agree more.

Please take a camera with you so you can capture the look on the guys' faces when you bring a Forester to a race shop. Then kindly share it with us.

I meant specialty shops, and I have always received a positive reaction. Locally, there are a ton of Subaru specialty shops that have converted their shop Forester into an STI Forester after an STI has come in wrecked.

 

[SkaredShtles]

I'm aware... But its a 2002 2.5 phase 2 outback. It was inevitable.

Around here it's not even that horribly expensive to fix. I got the head gaskets, all the seals, and a new clutch all done when our gaskets $hit the bed for $1500.

 

[splat]

while we are diagnosing Subaru Problems
Mine has a couple

it is a 95 legacy L with a 180K

1) has some sort of electrical Drain. if I run the Car daily Battery is fine , let it sit for a few days that Battery is dead. Battery is only 4 moths Old.

2) the rear end drifts all over the place ( the struts are shot )

3) Needs an entire New Exhaust system including CAT

4) brakes are Squeaking like hell.

5) Makes a Funny clicking sound when Making a right turn

6) Right rear wheel has some very strange vibrations .

7) Rear Passenger door about to fall off due to rust.

8) left rear quarter Panel ready to fall off due to rust.

and that is just the main stuff , lots of other things wrong too.

on the plus side teh clutch has less that 15K on it

 

[Mr Jones]

Throttle position sensor
insufficient fuel pressure
insufficient fuel volume
faulty MAF/MAP sensor
user error...

 

[SkaredShtles]

while we are diagnosing Subaru Problems
Mine has a couple <snip>

5) Makes a Funny clicking sound when Making a right turn

CV joint.

6) Right rear wheel has some very strange vibrations .

Wheel bearing... probably.

7) Rear Passenger door about to fall off due to rust.

8) left rear quarter Panel ready to fall off due to rust.

Incorrect decision regarding where to live.

Our '97 outback has not a spot of rust except for one little chip in the driver-side front pillar that has been there and not gotten bigger since 1998.

 

[Greyhound]

I'm calling it...... a fouled injector or bad plugs.

 

[stoney]

while we are diagnosing Subaru Problems
Mine has a couple

it is a 95 legacy L with a 180K

1) has some sort of electrical Drain. if I run the Car daily Battery is fine , let it sit for a few days that Battery is dead. Battery is only 4 moths Old.

Check you alternator

2) the rear end drifts all over the place ( the struts are shot)

3) Needs an entire New Exhaust system including CAT

Pretty self-explanatory there.

4) brakes are Squeaking like hell.

New pads, refaced/new rotor

5) Makes a Funny clicking sound when Making a right turn

6) Right rear wheel has some very strange vibrations .

Probably wheel bearing and/or CV joint

7) Rear Passenger door about to fall off due to rust.

8) left rear quarter Panel ready to fall off due to rust.

Um... Look into cost of a new car vs. repair costs? It might actually be time.

 

[DirtyMike]

while we are diagnosing Subaru Problems
Mine has a couple

it is a 95 legacy L with a 180K

1) has some sort of electrical Drain. if I run the Car daily Battery is fine , let it sit for a few days that Battery is dead. Battery is only 4 moths Old.

re check the batery.... puppies die brand new too..... Dont care how hi quality it is.... recheck it first, if allis good, hook up an amp meter and start pulling fuses till your battery draw goes away... now you know what circuit its on

2) the rear end drifts all over the place ( the struts are shot )

Also check the swaybar links and bushings as well

{quote]3) Needs an entire New Exhaust system including CAT [/quote]
Sorry... exhaust shop it is

4) brakes are Squeaking like hell.

Use better quality parts next time for your brake job, although with the other symptoms you listed, it may be environmental

5) Makes a Funny clicking sound when Making a right turn

can almost guarantee a cv join that is faulty

6) Right rear wheel has some very strange vibrations .

Tire balance, bad strut, really warped rotor, loose suspension parts.... take your pic

7) Rear Passenger door about to fall off due to rust.

8) left rear quarter Panel ready to fall off due to rust.

Like otehrs already said.... were you live

and that is just the main stuff , lots of other things wrong too.

on the plus side teh clutch has less that 15K on it

All in all.... get a new car

 

[DirtyMike]

The downside to bring in your own part is if the part is defective. You'll end up paying labor twice, as they won't warranty the part you brought in. I used to do most of my own work, but now I no longer have the time, plus with all the computer, fuel injection stuff it's to much work to try and diagnose what's going on. I found a great independent mechanic that does great work and is reasonably priced.

On top of that, should I end up in this situation.... I will also be charging you for the time your vehicle is sitting there waiting for you to bring back the good part.... since most of the time when its a warrnaty situation on the part the customer doesnt want to pay the upfront cost for the new one and wait to get the refund when the return the faulty part.... So lets say its a three hour job and it takes you three hours to get me the new part after I remove it..... Your going toget charged for the time the vehicle is taking up my rack as well......


Yes, as technitions we mark up our parts... so does everyone else on the planet, not just automotive EVERY industry does this.... Most mark up higher than we do. Its a large part of how we make a profit. Shops that allow someone to supply their own parts do not turn a profit. The bottom line is I install parts I supply no matter were they are coming from.

You bring me OEM parts.... still wont put them in.... guess what on OEM parts I cant charge you mroe than if you walk in at the dealer for the parts...... If I do the dealer wont sell to me anymore. I get a discount from what you pay, I charge you the same the dealer would.

 

[DirtyMike]

lets compare two industries here to put this more into perspective. First off, I am not offended when someone want sto do their own work, if they have the tools, and ability to do so... more power to them.

Here is the comparision.... you pay what on average for a two egg omlette at denny's... 6.95, 7.95, something like that right, You know damn well that the eggs and the bacon you just got didnt cost more than a buclk fifty to buy for the resturant you just ordered at.... yet noone ever says... hey can I bring my own eggs and bacon in and just pay labor...... Figure labor for that order really quick.... lets say cook gets ten bucks an hour, he is getting about 17 cents a minute to cook for you.... order of eggs and bacon takes roughly five minutes to cook... so his time is worth aprox85 cents to cook your order and put it on a plate. So you want to pay even double the labor, cause in some sick way people think this makes up for it, your looking at spending less than two bucks....... never going to happen


If you guys think automotive marks up parts alot..... look into how much a grocery store marks up dairy product, or first aid supplies, or produce....... For most you will be sick to your stomach to realize alot of those products are quadruple their original price or more. In automotive parts are generally doubled, but not always. As the initial cost goes up we have to take into consideration that I just paid a grand for a part, I just cant sell it if I try to get two for it..... Not gonna happen, So the industry as a whole will ask more like 1400 for it when paying a grand..... were as I pay fifty bucks, Im going to probably easily ask for a hundred.... Remember I am also making sure the part is correct, I am getting in in a proper time frame, I am installing the part, and I am standing behind my work<read if the part breaks I cover it 100%, even if a rental car is needed, towing bills ETC> None of the warranty stuff I just listed applies when customer supplied parts fail.
Think of it like an insurance for the parts you are buying.



Did you guys know it costs Carls Jr less than a dollar to make burger they sell for six bucks? Thats including paying the hairlip making it........




Overall understand that if it came to a world were automotive was competing with what the general public could buy parts for... we sould still have to make money..... just that labor rates instead of being a hundred an hour... are going to be three hundred an hour.





Just to put into perspective... Our parts bill for last month was 224 thousand dollars for a seven bay shop.... So yeah... when dude comes in with his own parts.... I just move on to the next vehicle.... I have plenty of vehicles lined up, and have no reason to want to do the job that is labor only

 

[splat]

r
All in all.... get a new car

Thats the Plan , it is not worth it to sink any money in to it at this point.

 

[DirtyMike]

Thats the Plan , it is not worth it to sink any money in to it at this point.

All problems aside..... its the body damage that gets me... No matter what you put into a car, having that much rust you just cannot get the money back out of it.

 

[DirtyMike]

Check you alternator


.

Wont be the alternator, if driven daily it stays charged.... its a defective battery or a parasitic draw....... Usually a small light staying on in the glove box, or a small hatch light<very possible seeing doors are rusting off in this case>.....

 

[Westy]

while we are diagnosing Subaru Problems
Mine has a couple

it is a 95 legacy L with a 180K

1) has some sort of electrical Drain. if I run the Car daily Battery is fine , let it sit for a few days that Battery is dead. Battery is only 4 moths Old.

2) the rear end drifts all over the place ( the struts are shot )

3) Needs an entire New Exhaust system including CAT

4) brakes are Squeaking like hell.

5) Makes a Funny clicking sound when Making a right turn

6) Right rear wheel has some very strange vibrations .

7) Rear Passenger door about to fall off due to rust.

8) left rear quarter Panel ready to fall off due to rust.

and that is just the main stuff , lots of other things wrong too.

on the plus side teh clutch has less that 15K on it

Just needs a fartcan and some new rims.

 

[splat]

All problems aside..... its the body damage that gets me... No matter what you put into a car, having that much rust you just cannot get the money back out of it.

yup , hey after 16 New England Winters , the road salt takes it s toll, but I'm not complaining, it has been a good car but it is time. the engine it self still runs quite nicely

Wont be the alternator, if driven daily it stays charged.... its a defective battery or a parasitic draw....... Usually a small light staying on in the glove box, or a small hatch light<very possible seeing doors are rusting off in this case>.....

it is most defiantly a Parasitic Draw. this is a 2nd Battery and I did put an Amp meter on it and it is drawing. it has some other electrical issues . like get alod of this one. No one has ever been able to figure this one out.

the Heater/AC blower would only turn on after the car got Hot! ( running for close to an hour in winter , less time in the summer ) , be fore it would turn on. no one could ever figure it out. I finally hard wired the blower to a cigette lighter adapter and when i wanted heat I plugged it in.

 

[DirtyMike]

HA..... What kind of amperage are you pulling with the vehicle not running off the battery? Guessing its probably 3-7 amps with all the electrical problems...... As for the blower motor, I have seen that before..... was a simple connector behind the dashboard... Little stabilant 22 on each contact all was good

 

[splat]

HA..... What kind of amperage are you pulling with the vehicle not running off the battery? Guessing its probably 3-7 amps with all the electrical problems...... As for the blower motor, I have seen that before..... was a simple connector behind the dashboard... Little stabilant 22 on each contact all was good

With nothing going on , it was only pulling .4 amps , Not much really , but with me commuting to work Via bike , and the car could and did sit for weeks with out being touched especially in the summer, that .4 amp was enough to kill the battery.

and no , checked the connector behind the dash that wasn't it and it was a real bitch to get too!

 

[DirtyMike]

.4 is defenetly a draw.... thatll drain it down in a couple days easy

 

[Toshi]

splat, just put it on a battery tender until you replace it.

 

[C.P.]

Splat, just install a battery cut off switch. As you've already stated, dont spend too much more on that rig, time to retire it.

 

[sstalder5]

Good news! Had it looked at yesterday. It's burning antifreeze. Its going to the dealership
panic tomorrow for new head gaskets and that should solve it.

 

[stoney]

Good news! Had it looked at yesterday. It's burning antifreeze. Its going to the dealership
panic tomorrow for new head gaskets and that should solve it.

New head gasket... I would assume that the sparks are gummed up too, no? Possibly an O2 sensor from the burning anti-freeze?

DirtyMike?

 

[johnbryanpeters]

Splat, cut the battery cable with an ax. That will stop the parasitic draw. extra poits for video.

 

[Greyhound]

New head gasket... I would assume that the sparks are gummed up too, no? Possibly an O2 sensor from the burning anti-freeze?

DirtyMike?

Sparks always follow head gasket super-gumminess. I wouldn't always assume the O2 sensor sh*t the bed unless you started seeing loss of gas mileage. Most of the time you would see the #3 or 4 injector start running hot if that were the case.

Splat....please give us video of JBP's axe suggestion if you decide to go that route. Epic.

 

[SkaredShtles]

Good news! Had it looked at yesterday. It's burning antifreeze. Its going to the dealership
panic tomorrow for new head gaskets and that should solve it.

Dude - don't you have a good local shop? You're gonna have to take your vaseline if you take it to the dealer!

 

[DirtyMike]

Splat, just install a battery cut off switch. As you've already stated, dont spend too much more on that rig, time to retire it.

Or take five mintues with the amp meter hooked back up, remove and replace fuses one at a time till you find the one that is on the live circuit and leave that one out.... then you spend zero money and you eliminated the draw

New head gasket... I would assume that the sparks are gummed up too, no? Possibly an O2 sensor from the burning anti-freeze?

DirtyMike?

Yeah Plugs will be part of the repair for a headgasket job, probably a radiator as well along with some coolant flushing.

Sparks always follow head gasket super-gumminess. I wouldn't always assume the O2 sensor sh*t the bed unless you started seeing loss of gas mileage. Most of the time you would see the #3 or 4 injector start running hot if that were the case.

Splat....please give us video of JBP's axe suggestion if you decide to go that route. Epic.

Even with bad o2's your probably not going to see dramatic fuel consumption, if they got to that point the vehicle is going to go into a failsafe mode for fuel strategy.

In this case I do belive it will however be in need of a cat converter. O2's are probably fine if they are still telling the pcm the cat is bad... that means the upstreams are still reading and giving a proper signal, and the downstreams are just now starting to have a switching signal.

 

[DirtyMike]

Dude - don't you have a good local shop? You're gonna have to take your vaseline if you take it to the dealer!

Actually I would wager that for a headgasket job done correctly the cost will be just about the same at a local shop as the dealer would be... specially with subaru. I mean if this were coming into my shop.... without looking its getting the head gaskets, reman heads<valves and all>, spark plugs and wires, cooling flush, radiator, oil change, timing belt, timing components, water pump, thermostat, and a cushin for any incedentals along the way..... Those are all items done <may have missed one or two> that are standard with a proper head gasket job.

 

[sstalder5]

Actually I would wager that for a headgasket job done correctly the cost will be just about the same at a local shop as the dealer would be... specially with subaru. I mean if this were coming into my shop.... without looking its getting the head gaskets, reman heads<valves and all>, spark plugs and wires, cooling flush, radiator, oil change, timing belt, timing components, water pump, thermostat, and a cushin for any incedentals along the way..... Those are all items done <may have missed one or two> that are standard with a proper head gasket job.

This.

The shop I usually take it to wanted $1700 for the full job, some other shops estimated anywhere between $1100 and $1500. The dealership will do it for $1300, with all Subaru parts and warrantied work, plus they'll probably give me a decent loaner car. It seemed like the safest bet to go with the dealership.