[Toshi]

Man they sure laid into that wagon with an ugly stick beating!

this is undeniable, but 135 cu ft of room behind the front seats is impressive in a vehicle that will get at least 20/24 city/hwy mpg in 4 cyl automatic gasoline form. i figure if it's going to be a practical vehicle it might as well have the high roof, etc... think of it as a miniature Sprinter van.

 

[Toshi]

a well-produced video by electricaid.org highlighting their experience in a Th!nk City. 3 days, 180 km, some sliding around on ice, and good production quality gives you the below:

 

[Toshi]

BEV and PHEV provisions in the stimulus bill as passed by the senate today:

- Number of vehicles eligible for up to $7,500 passenger vehicle, $15,000 larger vehicle credit doubled from 250,000 to 500,000.
- Credits for conversions up to 10% of the cost with a cap of $40,000 (i.e. a $10,000 conversion gets $1,000, a $40,000 conversion gets $4,000--important stake in the ground for what we hope will be a higher-credit program).
- Conversions must be "qualified," which includes approval by the National HIghways Transportation Safety Administration and conversion by mechanics meeting training standards established in cooperation with battery makers)
Eligibility of vehicles that use batteries leased to the vehicle owner.
- Two- and three-wheeled highway capable vehicles eligible (with some complex provisions that may enable credits for some of Chrysler GEM neighborhood vehicles)
- Incentives start January 1, 2009 or upon the enactment date (unclear); termination date is end of 2012.
- "Scrappage" provisions dropped (we are making the case that in many cases it's better to use that $4,500/vehicle to convert clunkers to PHEV or EV).

if this makes it through to being signed into law it'll be interesting if we see an increase in the number of conversion shops, a la AC Propulsion with their eBox. i'm also glad to see that 2 and 3 wheel vehicles made the cut. this is good for the Brammo Enertia and Aptera 2e alike.

 

[DaveW]

Hooray.... About time!
The first baby steps to electric cars for the masses in NZ

New generation electric car trial launched

Hyundai Motors NZ executive director Philip Eustace said three Electrons had been sold before yesterday's official introduction

 

[DaveW]

Now this is seriously tempting me.......Converted to Run on Vegetable Oil

Cheap at only $3k and it's just down the road from me.
I shouldn't spend money right now as work is making people redundant right now (I look to be pretty safe but will wait till they finish the slashing and burning of the staff roster before I spend on anything).

 

[Toshi]

heh, that's ugly! but WVO is a good fuel if you can get it. i'm envious of your wide availability of diesels. here we have old mercedes which are heavy, incredibly slow, and which carry a stigma of being a wannabe hippie. we also have VW TDIs which are nice but are wrapped in a VW, are overpriced especially on the used market, and which carry the stigma of being a yuppie. finally, we have modern mercedes diesels, which are stupidly expensive, end of story.

 

[Toshi]

a teaser of the Tesla Model S. the Model S is their forthcoming 4-door sedan companion to the Tesla Roadster, and is to be substantially cheaper. think more like BMW 5-series money rather than 760iL money.

http://www.motorauthority.com/tesla-promises-profits-by-mid-year-model-s-coming-march-26.html

one thing that i missed that actually is really significant:

Tesla has announced that the DOE will has approved the loan and distribution of the loan funds will begin within 4-5 months. The company credits the quick approval to the Obama administration's prioritizing the Advanced Technology Vehicles Manufacturing loan program. Production of the Model S will then be on track for the planned 2011 debut.

that's really big news.

 

[Toshi]

japan-market-only electric bicycles from Yamaha:

Yamaha PAS Lithium S / PAS CITY-S / PAS CITY-F. all $1200: they vary by wheel size. 25.2V 4Ah lithium battery. range of 21 km - 39 km - 67 km depending on power/standard/eco modes. i find these figures very optimistic, but then again they probably assume a speed of 12 mph or something equally low, where air resistance is low and pedaling contributions greater as a relative percentage of energy.

 

[Toshi]

(VW up! concept)

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2009/02/12/volkswagen-and-toshiba-to-collaborate-on-electric-drive-systems/

It's been a busy day in Wolfsburg as VW followed up the release of a sketch of its upcoming mid-sized sedan with an announcement about new electric drive systems. VW and Toshiba have signed a letter of intent to collaborate on electric drive systems and power electronics. These electric drive systems will be used in battery-powered versions of the New Small Family (NSF) cars. The NSF lineup is made up of the production versions of the up! series of concepts first seen in 2007. VW is planning to build small cars based on this new platform under a number of its different brands around the world. In the press release, CEO Dr. Martin Winterkorn, indicated that VW wants to be the first to mass produce affordable electric vehicles on a large scale. In order to get there, VW is working with a number of partners in addition to Toshiba on elements such as lithium ion batteries. VW has not given an indication of when these electric cars may debut, but if they intend to be first, they will have to move fast.

 

[Toshi]

a DIY Honda S2000 EV conversion. wouldn't have been my first choice for a car to convert, but you work with what you have, i guess, even if it's a small, expensive car with a great gas powertrain.

http://s2kev.blogspot.com/

he estimates his costs at $6k but he must have had discounts via work or some such, as it looks $15k+ from this perspective.. 144V 9.58Ah lead-acid. apparently he retained the transmission. motor specs: "At 144 VDC, 28.5 HP continuous, 30.4 HP for one hour, 48.8 HP for five min., 100 HP peak ". most definitely not a plug and play installation if you look at his blog.

 

[jimmydean]

There is a new EV at work, Porsche 914. Saw it plugged in by the loading dock. Not sure who owns it, but I will try and check it out tomorrow.

 

[CBJ]

Obama administration's prioritizing the Advanced Technology Vehicles Manufacturing loan program. Production of the Model S will then be on track for the planned 2011 debut.

This is what I have been telling people America should have done long time ago. Sort of the same thing happened in Denmark where the government helped the windmill industry and Denmark now has one of the leading companies in the world.

I American could put men on the moon American should be able to build good fuel efficient cars but sometimes a little help and support for the government is good.

 

[C.P.]

There is a new EV at work, Porsche 914. Saw it plugged in by the loading dock. Not sure who owns it, but I will try and check it out tomorrow.

I was looking for electric car kits recently and found a company that has a porsche 914 EC conversion kit, here...

 

[Toshi]

another seattle-area conversion, a kick scooter with an outrunner RC motor:

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=7638&p=132211#p132211

http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/6296/dscn5790dv6.jpg
http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/3354/dscn5788ua8.jpg

he's using a HXT 63-74 motor. he's driving it with 48V 10Ah of cheap "duct tape"/Ping LiFePO4. (Ping is the name of a guy in china who sells comparatively cheap LiFePO4 packs wrapped in duct tape as their packaging rather than fiberglass + shrinkwrap.) top speed is reported to be close to 20 mph at 48V 10A.

 

[Toshi]

the aptera makes it into the NYTimes! along with other future vehicles.

http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2009/02/15/automobiles/0215-altcars_2.html

note that the above is a Aptera Typ-1e. the Aptera 2e that will go into production has mirrors and front driveshafts, among other changes.

 

[Toshi]

aptera must be on a media kick. another mention, this one in road and track. largely a fluff piece but has some new photos.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=10&article_id=7651

showing off roof strength.

this is the first shot i've seen of the front wheel drive layout. note the nice long double A-arms.

interior design shots. i used to love "car styling" magazine (a japanese rag) as a kid. these are reminiscent of that.

the Aptera Typ-1e prototype (rear wheel drive) in the foreground, with a Aptera 2e (fwd) in the background

 

[Toshi]

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2009/02/15/hybrid-motorcycles-come-to-america/

two chinese companies, Advanced Battery Technologies (ABAT) and Wuxi Angell Autocycle Co, have developed a hybrid gasoline-electric scooter and supposedly plan to sell it in the USA this year. i'll believe it when i see it.

all specs and pricing are still hazy, but the following is known: 48V 15Ah "lithium-ion" battery pack, pure-electric drive at low speeds, and a "35% pollution reduction and a 20% increase in fuel efficiency, compared to comparable gasoline motorcycle engines" fwiw. supposedly they're showing their models off at the indianapolis motorcycle show this week.

 

[pain]

Im about to put a plate on my bike. it doesn't really pollute the air and its pretty fast

 

[buildyourown]

Im about to put a plate on my bike. it doesn't really pollute the air

How do you figure?
I didn't think you could get plates for a 2-stroke.

 

[pain]

ive got a title. i bought the bike used and its been plated before. So it should hopefully be plated for me to. The title doesn't specify offroad only it only says MC

 

[4xBoy]

I had a 2007 YZ250 that was street legal.

It was to much fun.

 

[Toshi]

Im about to put a plate on my bike. it doesn't really pollute the air

uh, think again. depending on what year your bike is it puts out 100x+ the amount of smog forming emissions, not to mention unburnt fuel, than even a Hummer.


Better Place and their network of recharging stations has been mentioned several times in this thread. here's a nice video from worldfocus.org in Israel that sums up what they're trying to do. good production values. not embedded since it isn't youtube...

http://worldfocus.org/blog/2009/02/09/israeli-company-builds-infrastructure-for-worlds-electric-cars/3977/

 

[jimmydean]

Im about to put a plate on my bike. it doesn't really pollute the air and its pretty fast

Yes, 2 stroke engines with no smog equipment are almost as green as a Prius.

I know you can't plate 2 strokes in Oregon unless it was a factory street legal bike (like the old 70's 250's).

 

[Toshi]

i posted up a prior version of this in the thread but i thought this deserved another look as it is very, very cool.

Stealth Electric Bikes (AUS) The Bomber. http://www.stealthelectricbikes.com.au/stealth_bomber.html

$7550 + 700 shipping AUD for the 3 kW long range version. basically is my bike in basic layout (if you squint) but taken to the logical extreme:
- Nexus 7 (mine) with a clean chainline vs. G-boxx with an even cleaner chainline
- no suspension vs. cheap-dh-bike class suspension
- 800W front hub vs. 3000W rear hub, but with even more unsprung weight now
- batteries in pannier for convenience vs. batteries within main triangle for weight distribution
- range of 25-50 km for mine vs. 35-50 km for it, highly dependent on speed

$8250 AUD is $5371 USD at today's rates, however. while "cheap" for a well-done electric it's right in the range of street-legal gas motorbikes capable of much more than even this cool-looking beast.

 

[kozzach]

the original green transport choice!

 

[pain]

uh, think again. depending on what year your bike is it puts out 100x+ the amount of smog forming emissions, not to mention unburnt fuel, than even a Hummer.


Better Place and their network of recharging stations has been mentioned several times in this thread. here's a nice video from worldfocus.org in Israel that sums up what they're trying to do. good production values. not embedded since it isn't youtube...

http://worldfocus.org/blog/2009/02/09/israeli-company-builds-infrastructure-for-worlds-electric-cars/3977/

smog-fog who cares! 2 strokes smell great

 

[pain]

Oh sorry guys i didnt mean for you to see the dirtbike. There a Toyota highlander hybrid behind it.

 

[Toshi]

as of february 2009 nissan america has promised an electric car for sale in 17 months.

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2009/02/17/nissan-electric-car-for-sale-in-america-in-17-months/

100 mile range. 5 seats. "fast-charge" in 26 minutes. "fast enough to get you a ticket."

wake me up when it arrives.

 

[jimmydean]

Here's the 914 I promised.

 

[Bicyclist]

That's cool! If I ever got around to fixing up my 914 I might consider it...

 

[jimmydean]

I don't know who's it is, but it's nice. I will figure it out eventually, but there are a couple EV's at work.

 

[jimmydean]

The guy who had the VW kit sold it and bought the Porsche. Actually runs on 140V AC using 10 batteries.

Notice the hair dryer defrosters mounted near the firewall (blue).

Built by a guy in NE Portland.

 

[Toshi]

that's a cool build, jimmydean. AC, you say? nice. you know what battery chemistry it's running by any chance?

in line with the original thread topic, americans are choosing the alternative of... not driving: U.S. Cumulative Travel for 2008 changed by -3.6% (-107.9 billion vehicle miles).

that's kind of a big deal!

Estimated Vehicle-Miles of Travel by Region - December 2008 - (in Billions)
Change in Traffic as compared to same month last year.


in efficient and clean-scooter news: ABG reports that the Piaggio MP3 Hybrid will be released in Europe "later this summer", whatever that means.

 

[jimmydean]

He said it was AC, I thought that was strange as well. 18V(I think, not 12v and not 24v) deep cycle lead acid. He says he gets about 25 miles out of a charge but the batteries are about half dead. His commute is only 10 miles.

He also said that it handled awesome with great acceleration.

 

[buildyourown]

Saw this on TV last night.
11.5 sec 1/4 mile
0-60 2.9sec

http://www.plasmaboyracing.com/whitezombie.php

 

[Toshi]

that drag car is sweet. 374V of lithium and a 2000A controller... yikes.

on a similar kick of old car + modern powertrain, Top Gear US has decided to build a project car. their goals: 70 mpg, 0-60 < 7 sec, $7000.

So if 45 mpg doesn't change the equation, how about 70? Suck on that for a second. Forty-five is probably a lot better than whatever you're driving, but it's still within the realm of the imaginable. But 70? It's absurd. Perfect, then.

On top of unlikely mileage, we need it from something with a little soul. We don't need supercar performance, but we should at least be able to outrun a minivan. Naught to 60 in 7 seconds is about as slow as we can stand before our minds wander. Come to think of it, breaking the 7-second barrier will also roast a Ferrari 308, which will help keep that Magnum P.I. fantasy alive.

And then there's the price. If trees and puppies and little green frogs make your heart go pitter-patter, the Insight's $20,000 price tag is downright reasonable. Lovers of the other kind of green will always do the math, though, and inevitably determine that it will take 18 years of fuel savings to pay off their investment, so they might as well keep driving that Hummer. Price, then, is key if we really want to save the world.

For absolutely no other reason than the fact that a good theme seems to be developing entirely on its own, $7,000 seems like the kind of irresistibly low price that would make even Arnold give up his monster truck.

So there it is, the top 10 cars that get 70 mpg, do 0-60 in less than 7 seconds and cost $7,000 (and have sexy Italian styling):

1:
2:
3:
4:
5:
6:
7:
8:
9:
10:

No? Well, then, it's official. TopGear.com America has a new project.

http://www.topgear.com/us/features/more/we-build-a-70-mpg-car/

their plan: 1981 VW Rabbit Diesel + modern VW TDI powertrain + aero mods.

 

[jimmydean]

Extreme 4x4 built a Suzuki Samurai using a newer TDI and a greasecar conversion that got pretty good mileage for a serious rock crawler. The newer TDI was cheap, I was looking at that an an option for a Toyota truck.

 

[Toshi]

Brammo TTXGP contender (isle of man electric race)

Quantya (electric) supermoto

KTM electric enduro bike

 

[Toshi]

an explanation of how tesla comes up with its range estimates:

http://www.teslamotors.com/blog4/

in graphs alone:

 

[?????]

in efficient and clean-scooter news: ABG reports that the Piaggio MP3 Hybrid will be released in Europe "later this summer", whatever that means.

I saw one of those in upstate New York last summer. Maybe it wasn't a hybrid, but it was a real goofy looking dual front wheel scooter. How do you lean into a corner with one of those?