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Toshi

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,667
7,931




http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/suvs/1008_2011_nissan_juke_sv_test/index.html

Not bad, Nissan, not bad: 6.8 sec 0-60, 27/33 mpg (FWD CVT version), 2932 (!) lb curb weight, 1.8L and 188 hp of DI turbo fury. It has a g-meter, like the sad relative of the GTR that it is! :rofl:

On the other hand it's not really useful off-road at all, has less internal storage capacity (by a factor of 2!) than a Honda Fit, and its styling inside and out is a bit, uh, "polarizing." We probably won't replace our Fit with one, but for some people it might be a great, fuel efficient option.
 
ALEXIS_DH

ALEXIS_DH

Tirelessly Awesome
Jan 30, 2003
6,148
796
Lima, Peru, Peru
Toshi said:




http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/suvs/1008_2011_nissan_juke_sv_test/index.html

Not bad, Nissan, not bad: 6.8 sec 0-60, 27/33 mpg (FWD CVT version), 2932 (!) lb curb weight, 1.8L and 188 hp of DI turbo fury. It has a g-meter, like the sad relative of the GTR that it is! :rofl:

On the other hand it's not really useful off-road at all, has less internal storage capacity (by a factor of 2!) than a Honda Fit, and its styling inside and out is a bit, uh, "polarizing." We probably won't replace our Fit with one, but for some people it might be a great, fuel efficient option.
Click to expand...
i drive a nissan cvt (x-trail) and the cvt is a bit strange.
i get ridiculous mpg in the highway (30mpg), specially with the cruise control on. its pretty cool to watch the cruise control set, and then the engine rpm drop to the bare minimum power to sustain speed, while the cvt lowers the transmission ratio.

but in average city driving, i get (according to the onboard computer) 11.9km per liter (like 20mpg) per tank. the cvt is a bit laggy for stop and go traffic... and i still havent figured out how to enable the "sport" mode.
 
jimmydean

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
41,547
13,672
Portland, OR
Toshi said:
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/suvs/1008_2011_nissan_juke_sv_test/index.html

Not bad, Nissan, not bad: 6.8 sec 0-60, 27/33 mpg (FWD CVT version), 2932 (!) lb curb weight, 1.8L and 188 hp of DI turbo fury. It has a g-meter, like the sad relative of the GTR that it is! :rofl:

On the other hand it's not really useful off-road at all, has less internal storage capacity (by a factor of 2!) than a Honda Fit, and its styling inside and out is a bit, uh, "polarizing." We probably won't replace our Fit with one, but for some people it might be a great, fuel efficient option.
Click to expand...
Should have made it a Versa Sport to compete with the Mazda Speed 3.
 
Toshi

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,667
7,931
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/08/100830120945.htm

Recall CNW's flawed yet widely publicized "Dust to dust" studies that claimed that a Hummer H2 used less energy over its lifetime when accounting for manufacture and disposal. Insert lithium ion batteries instead of NiMH, perform a study with proper methodology and you get this:

The study shows that the electric car's Li-ion battery drive is in fact only a moderate environmental burden. At most only 15 per cent of the total burden can be ascribed to the battery (including its manufacture, maintenance and disposal). Half of this figure, that is about 7.5 per cent of the total environmental burden, occurs during the refining and manufacture of the battery's raw materials, copper and aluminium. The production of the lithium, in the other hand, is responsible for only 2.3 per cent of the total. "Lithium-ion rechargeable batteries are not as bad as previously assumed," according to Dominic Notter, coauthor of the study which has just been published in the scientific journal "Environmental Science & Technology."
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Furthermore, this <15% doesn't mean that gas vehicles are more efficient. Behold:

The conclusion drawn by the Empa team: a petrol-engined car must consume between three and four liters per 100 kilometers (or about 70 mpg) in order to be as environmentally friendly as the e-car studied, powered with Li-ion batteries and charged with a typical European electricity mix.
Click to expand...
 
jimmydean

jimmydean

The Official Meat of Ridemonkey
Sep 10, 2001
41,547
13,672
Portland, OR
Toshi said:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/08/100830120945.htm

Recall CNW's flawed yet widely publicized "Dust to dust" studies that claimed that a Hummer H2 used less energy over its lifetime when accounting for manufacture and disposal. Insert lithium ion batteries instead of NiMH, perform a study with proper methodology and you get this:



Furthermore, this <15% doesn't mean that gas vehicles are more efficient. Behold:
Click to expand...
So you are saying GM is building an H4 that gets 70mpg to man up to the challenge? Awesome. :rofl:
 
Toshi

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,667
7,931
SkaredShtles said:
I hear $hitty old Jeeps are pretty alternative... :homer:
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[rationalization]
The Civics around here (and everywhere) are riced out to hell, swapped, beat up, and are owned by unreliable young people who abuse their cars. As much as I like hybrids, I'd rather not buy one that has 100k+ miles on it and risk a battery replacement on my own dime.[/]

:D

The real reason I'm looking at this one is because of the history: 1 owner since new who bought the top of the line back in the day, low miles given its age, address in a nice neighborhood in NYC-commuter-town CT. The specifics of the car matter less to me at this price point.

Update: idealism crisis averted, as the Jeep turned out to be, well, like other Jeeps.
 
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C.P.

C.P.

Monkey
Jan 18, 2004
547
8
SouthEastern Massachusetts
Toshi said:
300+ Leaf orders from Hawaii, which is pretty damn good when viewed in the context of the islands only having 1.3M people. The article notes that Hawaii has a $4500 state incentive on top of the $7500 Federal tax incentive, not bad, not bad.
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I haven't run the math, but Hawaii has the highest electricity rates in the country - nearly 2 to almost 4X most of the rest of our nation's residential rates. What I wonder, is how well the leaf compares to an efficient petro-car with good mileage on Hawaii (my bet is it's still a good buy). On the island, gas right now is running between 3.25 & 3.75 gal, while residential electricity is running roughly 21 to 32 cents per KWH, mostly b/c the electric generating plants on the island are primarily powered with fueloil.
If I had the means, and lived there, there's no doubt I would install enough photovoltaics to net-meter an electric car's consumption...
 
Toshi

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,667
7,931
Time to run the math for EVs in Hawaii. Assumptions: 32 cents/kWh electricity, 250 Wh/mile efficiency, $3/gallon gas, 25 mpg combined average gasoline car.

100 miles in the electric car:

250 Wh/mile x 100 miles = 25,000 Wh * 1 kWh / 1000 Wh = 25 kWh
25 kWh * 32 cents / kWh * $1 / 100 cents = $8 to drive 100 miles.

100 miles in the gasoline car:

100 miles / 25 mpg = 4 gallons
4 gallons * $3 / gallon = $12 to drive 100 miles.

Conclusion: even with really expensive electricity and a pretty efficient gasoline car it's cheaper to drive an electric car. Make the gas car more inefficient or electricity cheaper and the balance sways even more towards the electric.

How low can electric rates go? Here are Seattle's general residential rates, unfortunately raised since I left town: 4.59 cents/kWh for the first 10 kWh per day, 9.55 cents/kWh thereafter. Assuming the 9.55 cent/kWh marginal rate then the Leaf would cost $2.39 to drive those 100 miles!
 
Toshi

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,667
7,931
Progressive Automotive X Prize winners announced:

Alternative Side-by-side Class:


Li-Ion Motors Wave II, from North Carolina, US. Electric propulsion, 187 MPGe in testing.

Alternative Tandem Seating Class:


X-Tracer E-Tracer, from Switzerland. Electric propulsion, 205.3 MPGe in testing.

Mainstream category (ie, 4 passengers):


Edison2 Very Light Car, from Virginia, US. E85 ICE propulsion, and barely squeaked by the 100 MPGe threshold, logging 102.5 MPGe on the dyno.

Congratulations to all the teams, who took home $2.5M, $2.5M, and $5M for their efforts, respectively!

:thumb:
 
DaveW

DaveW

Space Monkey
Jul 2, 2001
11,305
2,842
The bunker at parliament
Well ok it's not exactly alternative, but it's a great ad anyway.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/QQvsPmTwU-A&rel=0&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xd0d0d0&hl=en_US&feature=player_embedded&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/QQvsPmTwU-A&rel=0&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xd0d0d0&hl=en_US&feature=player_embedded&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>
 
Toshi

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,667
7,931
In other, directly relevant news, I logged 6.5h of seat time in a current-gen Honda Insight on Thursday (rescuing my wife from being stranded close to the city when all transit shut down after the tornado/tornado-like event that hit NYC).

I hate that car.

Why? First and foremost, it's a really difficult car to see out of. The front passenger side glass is of a decent height, fine. The cowl, however, is several inches higher than the beltline of the side glass, the windshield is absurdly far from you (like on the Dustbuster-shaped early GM minivans), the windshield is sloped steeply, and the top of the windshield is low. Oh, the A-, B-, and C- pillars are huge, and the split in the split rear window is exactly at following-car-headlight height.

All these things transpire to make it difficult to see out the front (high cowl, low top of windshield), into the next lane over (big pillars blocking front view as well as head check view), what's directly behind oneself (split rear window blocking headlights).

Additionally the driving performance remains underwhelming. Throttle tip in with the Eco mode on is ridiculously slow and laggardly, and in either mode the auto stop/start of the engine only would kick in occasionally and only for about 30 seconds before springing to life again with a shudder.

Overally my Fit is a much, much better car: infinitely better outward visibility, consistent, linear throttle response and more pep, feels lighter on its feet, more interior room, cheaper, and within 5-10 mpg of the Insight's mpg ratings.
 
valve bouncer

valve bouncer

Master Dildoist
Feb 11, 2002
7,843
114
Japan
I haven't driven one but I was surprised how big the Insight is. Be a bastard to park. Student has also taken the CRZ for a test drive and came away distinctly underwhelmed. Wait and see if the hydrid Fit is a bit of a better package.
 
Toshi

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,667
7,931
I'm just not sold on Honda's "mild hybrid" Integrated Motor Assist technology. Unless you look at the ASST/CHRG (assist/charge) indicator it's hard to tell that you're not simply in an underpowered gas car that decides to shut itself off every once in a while.

In the Prius, on the other hand, slow speed or stop and go driving feels smoother and indeed can be electric-only with sufficiently slow throttle tip-in, and the action/inaction of the gas engine is much more removed from the driver's consciousness. I prefer that experience, not to mention that the fuel economy savings are much greater with the Hybrid Synergy Drive vs. Honda's IMA.
 
valve bouncer

valve bouncer

Master Dildoist
Feb 11, 2002
7,843
114
Japan
Yeah it certainly sounds like Toyota system is far better. I believe too (perhaps already mentioned here) that Toyota has a hybrid only small car for release next year. It'll sell like hot ckaes no doubt. Prius has been the bigest seller in Japan since the new version came out.
 
Toshi

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,667
7,931
I finally put my money where my mouth is:



Mileage on the first trip home from the dealer is promising:



This leaves us with a motorcycle (Kawasaki Versys, Euro 3 compliant, catalyzed, 45-50 mpg), a Honda Fit (~30 mpg combined), and a Gen 2 Prius (~45-50 mpg combined). In 2014 or so we hope to add a Nissan Leaf to the mix, possibly trading in the Fit at that time, and consider swapping my motorcycle for, say, a Brammo Empulse. If the Prius's battery is giving up the goose at that time we'd also go with a 3rd party replacement to turn it into a PHEV, too.

That'd work, yes, that'd work.

:rockout:
 
Toshi

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,667
7,931
Damn straight. I'll be smug indeed, driving solo legally in the HOV lane with the Clean Pass sticker... (of course we prefer to take the rail into the city for less headaches with traffic and parking)
 
Toshi

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,667
7,931
Mini Scooter E (for electric) concepts.

http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsArticle/AllCars/252923/

Mini has revealed a trio of retro-styled scooter concepts ahead of their official debuts at next week&#8217;s Paris motor show.

Dubbed the Mini Scooter E Concept, the all-electric concepts will be displayed in three liveries: Mini E, British Racing Green and a look inspired by the Mod era.

A lithium-ion battery powers an electric motor mounted in the rear wheel. No range or performance figures have been quoted by Mini for the zero-emissions concepts, but the scooter can be recharged at a power socket using an on-board retractable charging cable stored in the rear fairing.
Mini claims the design of its scooters is carried over from its car range and the concepts and their looks can help widen the appeal of Mini and bring the brand to a younger audience.


Mini design features carried over include the central speedometer and the front light designs.
To operate the concepts, the rider locks in their smartphone to the central speedo and this acts as a vehicle key, display and central control element.

The smartphone can be operated on the move to act as a sat-nav, music player or as a phone itself and can be connected via Bluetooth to the rider&#8217;s helmet. Mini claims this creates a network between rider, scooter and smartphone that &#8220;paves the way for numerous new interactive functions&#8221;.

This includes a tie-up with Google Maps where the rider can view the position of other scooters in the vicinity; they can then connect to each other and be invited to ride together.

The concepts will be presented at a Mini design evening in London tomorrow night; full tech details will be revealed at Paris on 30 September.
Click to expand...




 
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IH8Rice

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
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