[mandown]

Definitely a few things I’m there that resonate. A few that didn’t, but most of it sounded reasonable or understood based on conversations I’ve had with friends.


Also...
My forehead is exhausted from just watching her. It’ll be noticeable if she ever decides to start using Botox.

And, I was fascinated by how the crease in her right sleeve by the shoulder/chest lined up with the gap in the background panels when they’d cut to camera 2.

 

[jonKranked]

You can't put a price on happiness. You can put a weight and time on it, however.

Plus it's hard to collect taxes from a corpse full of blow

 

[Pesqueeb]

Lets hope.

 

[mandown]

Lets hope.

The thing I can’t get away from is the “this sucks, so I’m leaving” theme but the fuzzy direction of where people are going. I get that people hate working at Chipotle, but I’m curious what the plan is after they quit, and how that achieves the goal of sustainable income and work/life balance. Has anyone considered the fact that being a human is just generally a shitty-to-meh experience for most people? I guess chasing the dream of better-than-meh is what keeps the world turning (but it doesn’t make it not a dream).

 

[Jm_]

The thing I can’t get away from is the “this sucks, so I’m leaving” theme but the fuzzy direction of where people are going. I get that people hate working at Chipotle, but I’m curious what the plan is after they quit, and how that achieves the goal of sustainable income and work/life balance. Has anyone considered the fact that being a human is just generally a shitty-to-meh experience for most people? I guess chasing the dream of better-than-meh is what keeps the world turning (but it doesn’t make it not a dream).

But you can do anything!

 

[mandown]

But you can do anything!

 

[kidwoo]

The thing I can’t get away from is the “this sucks, so I’m leaving” theme but the fuzzy direction of where people are going. I get that people hate working at Chipotle, but I’m curious what the plan is after they quit, and how that achieves the goal of sustainable income and work/life balance. Has anyone considered the fact that being a human is just generally a shitty-to-meh experience for most people? I guess chasing the dream of better-than-meh is what keeps the world turning (but it doesn’t make it not a dream).

Well as history has shown again and again: The first step to meaningful change is putting your head down, keeping silent, and going along with a crappy system with no protest, or speaking out.

 

[Jm_]

Well as history has shown again and again: The first step to meaningful change is putting your head down, keeping silent, and going along with a crappy system with no protest, or speaking out.

I feel the same way about horses shitting on trails.

 

[kidwoo]

I feel the same way about horses shitting on trails.

Someone I know who lives in boulder used to pick it up and throw it at the rider if they were in sight.



funniest god damn thing I've ever seen in my life

 

[mandown]

Well as history has shown again and again: The first step to meaningful change is putting your head down, keeping silent, and going along with a crappy system with no protest, or speaking out.

I suppose history has shown us again and again that new shitty conditions are more desirable than old shitty conditions.

I’m just curious what new world people think is beyond the horizon. I’m not saying better things don’t exist, and I know things aren’t great for everyone. However the media is filled with stories about “everyone wants to leave” without any stories about what it is they want to go to, other than the idea that something better exists.

 

[SkaredShtles]

I suppose history has shown us again and again that new shitty conditions are more desirable than old shitty conditions.

I’m just curious what new world people think is beyond the horizon. I’m not saying better things don’t exist, and I know things aren’t great for everyone. However the media is filled with stories about “everyone wants to leave” without any stories about what it is they want to go to, other than the idea that something better exists.

I'd like to go to Italy...

 

[kidwoo]

I suppose history has shown us again and again that new shitty conditions are more desirable than old shitty conditions.

I’m just curious what new world people think is beyond the horizon. I’m not saying better things don’t exist, and I know things aren’t great for everyone. However the media is filled with stories about “everyone wants to leave” without any stories about what it is they want to go to, other than the idea that something better exists.

doesn't seem that difficult to me


Other countries have figured this out. The richest one in the history of humanity shouldn't have a problem implementing some pretty basic labor standards. We already did it once. Now we're living in loopholes where 1 business owner is valued more than 20 of their employees, where UPS (makin BANK via covid) still hires people on at 39hrs a week specifically to avoid treating them like complete human beings.

"it's shit and it will always be shit" seems far more pessimistic than should be reasonable in this joint. And coming from me that should really say something

 

[mandown]

I'd like to go to Italy...

Stay on the northern side of town. Enjoy the espresso.

 

[SkaredShtles]

doesn't seem that difficult to me

Other countries have figured this out.

This. It's embarrassing the shit that other countries have figured out that we throw our hands up and say bullshit like, "That would be way too expensive" or other fucking nonsense.

I mean - the goddam *Italians* have a very nice, functional, high speed rail system to serve a lot of the country... here? "Ahhh... we can't do that because <fill in the blank with some bullshit>."

 

[mandown]

doesn't seem that difficult to me


Other countries have figured this out. The richest one in the history of humanity shouldn't have a problem implementing some pretty basic labor standards. We already did it once. Now we're living in loopholes where 1 business owner is valued more than 20 of their employees, where UPS (makin BANK via covid) still hires people on at 39hrs a week specifically to avoid treating them like complete human beings.

"it's shit and it will always be shit" seems far more pessimistic than should be reasonable in this joint. And coming from me that should really say something

“Doesn’t seem that difficult” may be an easy thing to say, but
a) It isn’t being done, so one could argue that it is that difficult because clearly something is opposing it.
b) It isn’t a place that exists here in the US, so US workers leaving their jobs is jumping from a frying pan into what? An abyss of “maybe I’ll find something better?”

100 years ago if enough people left the market, large employers would need to do something to bring them back. But we live in a post-then world where technology enables some of these giants to engineer non-human and/or non-American solution.

So is the answer to just head over to insta to monetize my daily activity, or craft artisanal small-batch IPA? If so, I hope I pass gently in my sleep, or get abducted by aliens to go to a “better place.”

I think my position is closer to "it shouldn't be that difficult."

 

[kidwoo]

a) It's primarily because we listen to/prioritize the wrong people. We can stop doing that. Striking down dumb shit like the citizens united decision would go a long way in this regard. Shit conditions existed long before that decision obviously but that's a tangible thing causing it to stay the way it is
b) There are good jobs out there, you seem stuck on a place, I see it more as defining or finding a different condition.


google the term "general strike" if you're not familiar

What we're seeing is a very small scale version of that. If it a real one happens, this country shuts the fuck down. If CEO's don't show up to work, things proceed normally. Labor in this country has WAY more power than it realizes as a unified entity.

 

[mandown]

Im sure there are good jobs out there, because I’ve got one and we’re hiring.

People today would undermine a general strike by finding online gigs and side hustles.

I’m not saying that folks shouldn’t jump from the frying pan. I’d just like to read a few stories about where they’re landing (or think they’re going to land). Or, is this a lot of “taking my hall and going home” puffery and media fluff.

 

[Jm_]

Im sure there are good jobs out there, because I’ve got one

Wow.

So the idea is that we have a permanent slave class to work the low-end jobs? Or that there are infinite "high end jobs"? When the little lady is replaced by the automated check-out, she's supposed to go back to school to get an engineering degree? It's just not realistic. Most places I've found don't want to hire and train someone. They want the someone to just magically have a bunch of experience already doing "it". You are just supposed to pull that crap out of your ass.

 

[mandown]

So the idea is that we have a permanent slave class to work the low-end jobs? Or that there are infinite "high end jobs"?

My certainty is of the existence of these jobs, not the quantity of them. I’m certainly not proposing the status quo is how things should remain. My questions have been an attempt to understand what jobs people are seeing as “better” than their current jobs. Is there an industry that’s drawing them? Are they finding self-employment gigs? My point is that the news stories are about people leaving jobs, but they doing include the part about where they are going, only why they feel compelled to leave where they are. I’d like to close the loop to some degree.

Also, to clarify, by “good” I wasn’t simply describing the economic part of my job. I changed jobs a few years ago for similar pay (some increase) but the company and environment is what makes it a good job. My old job was not good and the change has been significant for me. I’m still in the same industry doing the same function. This is why I’m curious about what others are seeing as reasons to leave and where they think “better” can be found.

 

[mandown]

 

[kidwoo]

^what that creep said

 

[kidwoo]

People today would undermine a general strike by finding online gigs and side hustles.

That's not actually undermining a general strike


50% of the american workforce is still fucking hUdge

 

[mandown]

That's not actually undermining a general strike


50% of the american workforce is still fucking hUdge

It sure can be. If 50% of the workforce at Sit-at-Desk Corp. all leave but a bunch of them start working for Click-from-Home Co. “on the side” then they just shifted which corporation they are working for and doesn’t really create a strike in the first place.

 

[kidwoo]

and the other 50% who actually get the point and arent endless contrarians for a theoretical discussion on the internet?

 

[rideit]

Oooh, burn

 

[mandown]

and the other 50% who actually get the point and arent endless contrarians for a theoretical discussion on the internet?

kidwoo Playbook:
When a person in the discussion points out an obvious flaw in your narrative, just type an insulting “mic drop” instead of responding on topic. It’ll make you seem superior. Bonus points if you can work in the angle that they were wrong for even engaging in the discussion to begin with, because what do they know.

 

[kidwoo]

"obvious flaw" is not obvious

Not sharing your assumptions is neither failing to address the issue nor running from it. My apologies if you keep missing the point but Ill say it now a third time: completely dismissing the concept because you can picture an unknown percentage of chipotle peeps signing up for door dash does not negate the concept, if executed well.

Do you really not understand what a general strike means?

Im not running from anything, Im literally trying to address a question you asked, despite your best efforts to dismiss the answer you refuse to hear.

 

[Nick]

kidwoo Playbook:

Whatever you do, don't bring up cops....

 

[Westy]

Whatever you do, don't bring up cops....

Cops with second homes who ride 29ers while wearing Pit Vipers and fanny packs.

 

[kidwoo]

Cops with second homes who ride 29ers while wearing Pit Vipers and fanny packs.

I.......I dont even.........

 

[jonKranked]

Doesn’t seem that difficult” may be an easy thing to say, but
a) It isn’t being done, so one could argue that it is that difficult because clearly something is opposing it.

on this specific item, "it can't be done" is a much different problem than "i don't know how to do it". i'm dealing with this exact scenario with a manufacturing site right now.

 

[mykel]

I.......I dont even.........

I think, perhaps, you may have just broke him.

 

[mandown]

on this specific item, "it can't be done" is a much different problem than "i don't know how to do it". i'm dealing with this exact scenario with a manufacturing site right now.

Agreed. An “improvement” could be a simple solution on paper, but implementing it by overcoming some resisting inertia (say laziness or corruption) is still a difficulty.

I once had to deal with a problematic employee who was barely doing their job, which required escalation to HR. HR asked if the problem was the employee’s skills or motivation, because those were two very different problems. HR added that in their experience a motivation issue with an apathetic employee was generally more difficult to modify. Motivation is definitely a big part of the difficulty with corporate and government behavior.

 

[jonKranked]

Agreed. An “improvement” could be a simple solution on paper, but implementing it by overcoming some resisting inertia (say laziness or corruption) is still a difficulty.

I once had to deal with a problematic employee who was barely doing their job, which required escalation to HR. HR asked if the problem was the employee’s skills or motivation, because those were two very different problems. HR added that in their experience a motivation issue with an apathetic employee was generally more difficult to modify. Motivation is definitely a big part of the difficulty with corporate and government behavior.

yea. the issue i'm dealing with is someone that is saying it can't be done, when the reality is that they don't know how to do it because they haven't before, and instead of just figuring it out, they're telling me it can't be done. which is bullshit, because i know for a fact that another site not only can do it, but does it often enough they have a work instruction for it.

 

[mandown]

yea. the issue i'm dealing with is someone that is saying it can't be done, when the reality is that they don't know how to do it because they haven't before, and instead of just figuring it out, they're telling me it can't be done. which is bullshit, because i know for a fact that another site not only can do it, but does it often enough they have a work instruction for it.

I’m currently dealing with some legacy IT issues. If we could start from scratch, and bring in an experienced consultant, we could probably have a better system design. However, we have a system that was built by people knowing what they know and being comfortable with it.The legacy isn’t bad but it could be better, and scaling it up could be problematic. The issue on the table is - will improvements generate enough benefits to offset the disruption caused by revising the system? Existing experienced employees have conditioned workflows (and aren’t complaining about them) but these workflows aren’t transferable or scaleable as we grow and add new employees. It’s an “ain’t broke don’t fix” mentality.

 

[kidwoo]

 

[johnbryanpeters]

I once had to deal with a problematic employee who was barely doing their job, which required escalation to HR. HR asked if the problem was the employee’s skills or motivation, because those were two very different problems. HR added that in their experience a motivation issue with an apathetic employee was generally more difficult to modify. Motivation is definitely a big part of the difficulty with corporate and government behavior.

Digital Equipment Corporation was awful in terms of keeping on people who simply didn't do squat or made a profession of being in the way. Ken Olsen, the founder, sent out a wonderful rant once, proposing a division of the company to which those folks could be transferred just to get them out of the way.

 

[rideit]

Here is an indicator of upcoming inflation. The local subway starts at $22.00 an hour. Peanuts. The best local pizza joint said "oh yeah? Watch this!"
They are paying $40 an hour with a $500 housing stipend per month, and a bonus if you stay through October. And possibility of a group health insurance plan for full time employees.
They haven't raised prices yet, but it's gotta be coming. The owner is a great guy, once I found his stolen bicycle and got it back to him, Pizzas were on the house for about a year after that...

 

[Toshi]

$500 housing stipend and $40/hr in Jackson still isn't enough to afford housing, no?

 

[rideit]

an Average bedroom in a shared house is about $1200-$1500 now, and about $1k in outlying communities.
so if...IF...you are lucky enough to find a place, it is possible, there are a few hundred new apartments coming online this year in town, so that should help a little.
lots and lots of people sharing rooms, etc.
But no, you will never be able to buy on just that.