[fluff]

In an attempt to start an intelligent debate...

Has anyone hear read (or heard of) 'Israel's Fateful Decisions' by Yehoshafat Harkabi?

If so please feel free to participate.








Wind blows... tumbleweed blow by.

 

[Silver]

I have not. Care to give a quick overview? I can put it on my list if you think it's worth it.

 

[fluff]

Well, I'm about 2/3rds of the way through it. The author is ex-chief of Israeli military intelligence and had previously held fairly harsh anti-arab viewpoints. In fact he could hardly be described as pro-arab now but postulates that unless Israel makes peace with the Arab states (especially Palestine) then they will effectively commit national suicide.

He urges withdrawal from Gaza and the West Bank lest the Jews become a minority in their own state by approx 2010 (iiirc), due to the higher Arab birth rate, at present Arabs make up around 40-45% of the population of Israel plus occupied territorries.

He is also scathing about the idealogical differences between the Zionist visions of the Labour Party and Likud and moreover their methods of achieving their aims. (Likud being reminiscent of the Bush administration.)

First published in the 1980's it is a very interesting (if dense) read and quite prophetic.

 

[roee]

I live in that mudpit (Israel).

Unfortunately, this is true. Israel will be eaten demographically, unless something drastic happens. I'm not worried about the occupied territories, as most of these will be abandoned by Israel at one stage or another. It's the Israeli-Arabs who, on one hand, have astronomic birth rates (and are being "encouraged" to do so by bloated welfare money which is given on the basis of children, a legacy of extreme Orthodox jews who don't work and live on welfare money), and on the other hand are becoming more and more hostile towards Israel, to the point of kidnapping and murdering jews, riotting, setting national property on fire - In their own villages, which is kind of counterproductive, but go explain it to them - and so on.

Unless they really go berserk, thus giving Israel the right to send them off its premises, things look rather bleak. It's not racism, it's not fascism, it's merely the acknowledgment of the fact that NO ONE will want to live here under Arab majority.
Look at the Arab countries around Israel and see how bad they look - economically, socially, even military. This is a bad, violent, primitive culture, with bad mentallity. If someone wants to call me a racist, go ahead - I know these folks, I know the facts. See how they treat one another...

So how this is going to be solved? Its not.
Either Israel sends them off outside its border, causing itself to be crucified internationally, or losses the jewish majority, causing its jewish citizens to flee to other places and Israel to disintegrate.

Either way, someone is ought to become a refugee...

My sad, sad 2 cents...

 

[LordOpie]

roee, thanks for that internal perspective. Keep us updated.

 

[roee]

Sure

 

[fluff]

roee, have you read Harkabi's book? If not I urge you to read it.

 

[genpowell71]

It's your country, do what you want....

 

[roee]

fluff,

Haven't read it, but I'm familiar with the perspective.
Anyone who claims Israel is on the verge of a demographical doom is
right on the money.
I'll look into it anyway, sounds like a fun, morbid read for the late hours