[Da Peach]

I've got my trusty '06 Iron Horse MKIII Expert, which I love, and I've started putting more miles on it this season. What I've decided is that it would be even better-er if it was a little slacker. I've read that the frame with the stock build has a 70 HA(!). I've been riding around Vancouver where a lot of the riding is a long up on gravel or forest service roads, then a steep techy descent.

So, I'm thinking of maybe upgrading the fork from my 140mm Pike 454 U-turn to something a little bigger. Say maybe a Marz 44 Ti, or a Lyrik. I'm not entirely sure what that will do to the geo and BB height. I'm not entirely sure that more travel is what I need or want.

The other option is to slap one of these in:
2 0 Degree EC44 - EC44 - Angle Headset

This may be just the ticket.

So? What say you? Fork? Headset? Both?

 

[Polandspring88]

I say slap in the headset and call it a day. If it truly was 70* stock bringing it to 68* should turn it into a ripper without sacrificing any handling prowess or climbing capability.

 

[golgiaparatus]

Didn't know the MK3 was a 44 ID headtube. Go figure.

Edit:

LOL! I just clicked on your link... Why the hell would a company name a HS the EC44 when its not for a 44mm HT.

 

[slimshady]

Funny, I was just thinking about making the same mod to my '07 MKIII, but I got all puzzled with the new headset naming standards. This thread made it clear.

 

[Da Peach]

Funny, I was just thinking about making the same mod to my '07 MKIII, but I got all puzzled with the new headset naming standards. This thread made it clear.

Well, I've only just started looking into this. Thanks to Acadian...

SRAM kitted 2006 Iron Horse MkIII Team: Ultimate All-Mountain Bike - Pinkbike.com

Yeah, I don't want to mess with the height of the bike. And to be honest, a lack to travel has never been my complain. Plus, I gotta think that a bigger for would add a fair amount of weight to the bike. Not to mention more $$$.

Shorter stem and a new headset. I think I may be sold...

 

[slimshady]

Well, I've only just started looking into this. Thanks to Acadian...

SRAM kitted 2006 Iron Horse MkIII Team: Ultimate All-Mountain Bike - Pinkbike.com

Yeah, I don't want to mess with the height of the bike. And to be honest, a lack to travel has never been my complain. Plus, I gotta think that a bigger for would add a fair amount of weight to the bike. Not to mention more $$$.

Shorter stem and a new headset. I think I may be sold...

Then you might take a look at my babe...

I'm trying to get my hands on a Pike 454 right now, but they are stupidly expensive here in Argentina. However, I could make a good use of a -1.5° headset...

 

[captainspauldin]

Offset bushes are the solution.. I have an '08 MkIII, I had them made up, it lowers the bb height by .4-.5" and slackens out the HA by 1 degree. Cost me $80 shipped mainly b/c I needed adapters from ironhorses dumb 10mm hardware to normal 8mm hardware. The bike feels dialed after getting the offset bushes, some might say the offset bushes would alter the suspension geometry making it feel like "crap" but I didn't experience that one bit. I run a Pike 454 140mm for reference.

 

[slimshady]

Offset bushes are the solution.. I have an '08 MkIII, I had them made up, it lowers the bb height by .4-.5" and slackens out the HA by 1 degree. Cost me $80 shipped mainly b/c I needed adapters from ironhorses dumb 10mm hardware to normal 8mm hardware. The bike feels dialed after getting the offset bushes, some might say the offset bushes would alter the suspension geometry making it feel like "crap" but I didn't experience that one bit. I run a Pike 454 140mm for reference.

I remember DW himself mentioning some of the guys in the IH team were running shorter shocks to better adapt the MKIII to 4X-DS races back in the day, somewhere in an old thread here in the Monkey. He said this didn't alter the suspension feeling.

I tried to make the Float shock more progressive by adding some oil in the air chamber, and ended up shortening the travel when it migrated from the main air chamber to the negative one due to the shock's orientation in the frame. The bike rode more consistently and didn't bottom out as easily as before (I'm a big guy), but I ended up taking the oil out since Darren from PUSH mentioned it would shorten the seals life, because of the extra pressure the oil put over them. Then I got the oil replaced by a set of Fox's air chamber spacers.

 

[Da Peach]

Then you might take a look at my babe...

I'm trying to get my hands on a Pike 454 right now, but they are stupidly expensive here in Argentina. However, I could make a good use of a -1.5° headset...

Hmm... no front deraileur, eh? I like the idea of having a guide, but I need a granny ring. Not sure I could accommodate a guide on my rig.

As for these bushings, what locations are they for? The shock mount on the rocker? I'm having a hard time visualizing it on my office...

 

[Polandspring88]

You could go with a dual ring guide, I ran a DRS for a while and it seemed to perform flawlessly in both gears and I never dropped a chain.

As to the offset bushings, I believe he is talking about the top hat reducers that press into the shock eyelets. They drill the holes off center to allow for minor changes in geometry.

 

[Westy]

Super Monster up front. 24" rear wheel with 3" Gazzaloddis. Paint it rootbeer. Huck stairs.

 

[Da Peach]

You could go with a dual ring guide, I ran a DRS for a while and it seemed to perform flawlessly in both gears and I never dropped a chain.

As to the offset bushings, I believe he is talking about the top hat reducers that press into the shock eyelets. They drill the holes off center to allow for minor changes in geometry.

I've got some buddies that have the ability to manufacture some of these offset voodoo bits. This might be the ticket.

 

[slimshady]

I've got some buddies that have the ability to manufacture some of these offset voodoo bits. This might be the ticket.

Here you are, a couple of examples:

Southerndownhill | Offset shock bushings | Components

Burgtec Titanium Offset Shock Hardware | Burgtec

 

[Da Peach]

Here you are, a couple of examples:

Southerndownhill | Offset shock bushings | Components

Burgtec Titanium Offset Shock Hardware | Burgtec

Riiiiiggght. Now I get it. Forgot about those... I'm a wizard in the shop... Worth trying out for sure.

 

[Da Peach]

Well, turns out there isn't enough "beef" to my shock mount hardware to bother trying to offset it. It's 10mm hardware, and I'd only be able to offset the hole in the pin about 1mm. I doubt it would have a detectable effect.

I've ordered one of those Works Components 2 degree angle sets. Hopefully it doesn't take an eternity to ship.

Now I need to find a shorter stem...

 

[dump]

I've ordered one of those Works Components 2 degree angle sets. Hopefully it doesn't take an eternity to ship.

Let us know how it goes. Those headsets looks good.

 

[Da Peach]

Let us know how it goes. Those headsets looks good.

Roger that.

 

[Da Peach]

Super Monster up front. 24" rear wheel with 3" Gazzaloddis. Paint it rootbeer. Huck stairs.

That's what the TR450 is for.. Doy.

 

[ride]

6.5" x 1.5" shock and be done with it. You won't miss the inch of travel with what you gain in adjusted numbers. Trust me.

Lars

 

[Da Peach]

6.5" x 1.5" shock and be done with it. You won't miss the inch of travel with what you gain in adjusted numbers. Trust me.

Lars

A trick from ride like a pro? I'll reduce the rear travel to 4ish inches...you don't think I'd miss it?

I've already got the headset coming... Having just perused pinkbike for a used 6.5x1.5, I'd be in another $250 ish on a pretty old bike. I'll ask around and see if anyone in my "posse" has a spare shock lying around to try.

 

[slimshady]

Offset bushes are the solution.. I have an '08 MkIII, I had them made up, it lowers the bb height by .4-.5" and slackens out the HA by 1 degree. Cost me $80 shipped mainly b/c I needed adapters from ironhorses dumb 10mm hardware to normal 8mm hardware. The bike feels dialed after getting the offset bushes, some might say the offset bushes would alter the suspension geometry making it feel like "crap" but I didn't experience that one bit. I run a Pike 454 140mm for reference.

Hey Captain, who made your offset bushings?

 

[captainspauldin]

Hey Captain, who made your offset bushings?

Dude in the UK, here's the details: Another way to slacken your head angle.

 

[Da Peach]

Offset headset installed. First test ride tomorrow.

 

[Da Peach]

So thanks to some advice from Acadian, and some installation help from big-ted, I believe I've now got myself a pretty kickass trail machine. I took a back seat on the installation... But it went quite well. Likely due to my minimal involvement.

After some coaxing, it was installed:

(i'm no photog)

with a nifty top cap that says stuff on it!

My highly reliable head angle measuring app (calibrated against the wall, and measured against the fork stancion), yielded this measurement:

According to Acadian's article from the wayback machine, the bike originally had a 69.5 (but actually 70) degree head angle. I figure I'm somewhere around 67.5 to 68 now...go figure.

On top of this change, I also went from a long stem (about 100mm), down to the short DH stem off my old Blindside. This made for some huge changes to the cockpit, all geared toward making me a downhill hero.

So I took it out for a ride yesterday. The ride started with a pretty long climb. Now, this climb has always been difficult. With the new and improved descending characteristics of my bike, it wasn't any easier. As to be expected, I had a tendency to wander back and forth noticeably more, and popped the front wheel up off the ground from time to time. Not ideal. I blame this on the uber short stem. You know why? It's way easier to change.

Then the descent. I was able to descend and corner waaaaaaaay more confidently with the slacker angles. Steep sections of trail that were previously near death experiences became a lot more manageable. I'd describe it as more forgiving.

I also spruced up the machine with a new set of supertacky minions. Gotta love 'em. Of course, a guy I was riding with questioned the tire choice for climbing. I'm more tempted to blame my cardio, and the fact I ride flats.

If the climbing weren't so damned steep and technical, I doubt I would have said anything... But it just is around here. Climbing Fromme would have been fine. Climbing Seymour was a different story.

In the end, I got the desired result, a way better descending machine. Well worth the $120 bucks.

 

[Polandspring88]

Yea, get a longer stem for sure. I'd try a 70 or so, it'll be short enough to ward off the sketchy going down but weight the front enough for the climbs. Maybe some wider bars too if you don't already have them. Glad to hear the new headset worked out.

 

[Da Peach]

Went for a really good ride today on some pretty steep terrain. Neither I nor the bike are fantastic going up, but this thing now rips going down.

And I chicken out of riding clipless, but decided to test out my new flats. These things are awesome:

 

[Da Peach]

Was pretty sloppy. Fresh supertacky high rollers are such grippy goodness...