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This is what's wrong with The Industry™

Bikael Molton

Bikael Molton

goofy for life
Jun 9, 2003
4,088
1,235
El Lay
I gave up trying to wear elbow pads like 12 years ago because of those issues.
But on the flip side I don’t care very much because for whatever reason I never hit my elbows when I fall.
Now falling on and breaking shoulders is something that happens to me a lot.


Andeh said:
So I'm not rad enough and don't ride park enough to warrant a chest & neck protector, but I think the industry needs to find a better way to do elbow pads. Every time I've worn them, they either are so loose there's no way they'd do anything more than a jersey in a crash, or so tight that I would start to get arm pump within 30 seconds or so. So, even though I know intuitively that I'm almost as likely to hit my elbows as my knees in a crash (hell, more likely than my face, and I wear a full face sometimes), I never wear elbow pads.
Click to expand...
 
Electric_City

Electric_City

Torture wrench
Apr 14, 2007
2,049
783
Unfortunately it's all about style. Around the time when neck braces first came out (to the best of my knowledge) is right around the time that Tara Llanes had her accident. No exaggeration, within 2 weeks at the bike park, 60-70% of the riders were wearing Leatt, Atlas or A-stars neck braces.

I guess it's not cool anymore though since myself and about 5 other people in a line of several hundred people wear them.
 
Electric_City

Electric_City

Torture wrench
Apr 14, 2007
2,049
783
Speaking of which, I'm finding it hard to find a wide selection knee/shin guards anymore. Knee pads? All over the place. Thin guards made with 5mm rubber "protection" are all over too. But the ol' Lizard Skins/661/IXS with plastic protection on the outside seem to have a lot less selection than in the days past. I'm struggling to find a pair that will fit and stay in place.
 
slimshady

slimshady

¡Mira, una ardilla!
Dec 20, 2007
5,724
3,576
A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away...
Electric_City said:
Speaking of which, I'm finding it hard to find a wide selection knee/shin guards anymore. Knee pads? All over the place. Thin guards made with 5mm rubber "protection" are all over too. But the ol' Lizard Skins/661/IXS with plastic protection on the outside seem to have a lot less selection than in the days past. I'm struggling to find a pair that will fit and stay in place.
Click to expand...
This. And what's the deal with making the outer surface of the knee pads out of some texturized rubber sheet/kevlar/whatever fabric? I thought the pads were supposed to slide over the rocks, not to work as an emergency braking device!

The current crop of knee warmers doesn't cut it for me. I'm still wearing old style 661s. It's one of the advantages of living in a third world country, the old NOS stuff pops out every now and then at competitive prices.
 
Loki87

Loki87

Monkey
Aug 24, 2008
181
146
Salzburg, Austria
Andeh said:
So I'm not rad enough and don't ride park enough to warrant a chest & neck protector, but I think the industry needs to find a better way to do elbow pads. Every time I've worn them, they either are so loose there's no way they'd do anything more than a jersey in a crash, or so tight that I would start to get arm pump within 30 seconds or so. So, even though I know intuitively that I'm almost as likely to hit my elbows as my knees in a crash (hell, more likely than my face, and I wear a full face sometimes), I never wear elbow pads.
Click to expand...
7idP Sam Hill
Gamechanger. If they fit your arm, they´re stupid comfy, have an actual Level 2 rating, are very light and they do not slip at all during riding. I always used to laugh at reviews that claimed a protector was "barely noticeable", but in this case i´ll say it myself. Feels like nothing more than a jersey and they seem to stay in place very well. No crashes so far on them though, but very promising and i´m sure they´ll do their job.
Same goes for the knee pads.
They´re also rather inexpensive.
 
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A

Andeh

Customer Title
Mar 3, 2020
1,192
1,160
Loki87 said:
7idP Sam Hill
Gamechanger. If they fit your arm, they´re stupid comfy, have an actual Level 2 rating, are very light and they do not slip at all during riding. I always used to laugh at reviews that claimed a protector was "barely noticeable", but in this case i´ll say it myself. Feels like nothing more than a jersey and they seem to stay in place very well. No crashes so far on them though, but very promising and i´m sure they´ll do their job.
Same goes for the knee pads.
They´re also rather inexpensive.
Click to expand...
Tried them, they were way too tight on the forearm, even after sizing up. I talked to an 7iDP rep, and he said he had the same problem and couldn't wear their elbow pads either. My forearms aren't huge, but they're not noodles either since I used to rock climb a bunch 5 years ago.
 
FlipSide

FlipSide

Turbo Monkey
Sep 24, 2001
1,436
890
For elbow pads, I am currently using the POC Air Sleeve elbow pad (or whatever they call it) and it is great. Its somewhat thin and I wouldn't say it really qualifies as a full-on DH pad, but it is super comfortable and never moves when riding.

On the other hand, the regular POC Air elbow pads are the worst I've ever tried.
 
Loki87

Loki87

Monkey
Aug 24, 2008
181
146
Salzburg, Austria
I tried a bunch of different elbow pads recently and the tight forearms seems to be a common occurence for me as well. There´s something off about how they design those things...
 
Jm_

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
20,124
10,681
AK
Loki87 said:
I tried a bunch of different elbow pads recently and the tight forearms seems to be a common occurence for me as well. There´s something off about how they design those things...
Click to expand...
I have some evoc hard ones, not the supposed to harden on impact, but yeah, I don't have massive forearms, I do climb, but tendons don't make one "big". They just barely fit and I had to sew an extender on one. I don't get it.
 
canadmos

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
21,953
21,472
Canaderp
Electric_City said:
Speaking of which, I'm finding it hard to find a wide selection knee/shin guards anymore. Knee pads? All over the place. Thin guards made with 5mm rubber "protection" are all over too. But the ol' Lizard Skins/661/IXS with plastic protection on the outside seem to have a lot less selection than in the days past. I'm struggling to find a pair that will fit and stay in place.
Click to expand...
I think Fox makes a knee pad that has d3o and a hard cap on the outside. They look a little longer too, so should cover the bottom of the knee.

They look hot though...
 
mykel

mykel

closer to Periwinkle
Apr 19, 2013
5,484
4,212
sw ontario canada
Electric_City said:
Speaking of which, I'm finding it hard to find a wide selection knee/shin guards anymore. Knee pads? All over the place. Thin guards made with 5mm rubber "protection" are all over too. But the ol' Lizard Skins/661/IXS with plastic protection on the outside seem to have a lot less selection than in the days past. I'm struggling to find a pair that will fit and stay in place.
Click to expand...
I have a pair of the Leatt 3DF Hybrid EXT.
Impact foam with a hard shin, but fabric covered knee.
Fit runs a bit small. I had to size up from the recommended and I was dead nuts in the middle of the recommended size range. I have hit the ground a couple of times with them on and so far they have stayed in place and I have gotten up unmarked.

I find them comfortable and pedalling transfers from the lift are good, no problems with hot spots, rubbing or chaffing.
 
ChrisRobin

ChrisRobin

Turbo Monkey
Jan 30, 2002
3,403
212
Vancouver
I think the best elbow pads I've ever worn were the G-form ELITE elbows. I'm not sure why they don't make them anymore. Thick foam/rubber that covered around the elbow really well and the sleeve sat up high on the arm above the bicep. The pads that cinch down just above the elbow or on the bicep are stupid. I'm currently wearing the 7idp Sam Hill elbows but the sleeves have stretched out to the point where I need to go find a new set and size down. I haven't crashed on them but I don't expect to walk away uninjured.

As for spine and chest protectors, I recently go the POC VPD chest and spine. Pretty comfortable. I figured I was due for a catastrophic crash one day since all I like to do is technical stuff.
 
djjohnr

djjohnr

Turbo Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
3,111
1,799
Northern California
For elbow pads with wider forearms try the Alpinestars stuff. I'm using the Paragon Lite for trail riding and they're super comfortable. Pads aren't thick enough for DH, but if the fit on the non-lite Paragon is the same they should be mint.
 
MrBaker87

MrBaker87

Monkey
Mar 30, 2014
167
116
neverlandranch
Broke a derailleur this weekend. Come to find out that there are absolutely zero 12 speed shimano derailleurs available for purchase outside of the insanely expensive XTR ($280 USD). I can’t afford that shit.

What’s up with the industry not being able to keep up on production a little?
 
jstuhlman

jstuhlman

bagpipe wanker
Dec 3, 2009
17,334
14,164
Cackalacka du Nord
MrBaker87 said:
Broke a derailleur this weekend. Come to find out that there are absolutely zero 12 speed shimano derailleurs available for purchase outside of the insanely expensive XTR ($280 USD). I can’t afford that shit.

What’s up with the industry not being able to keep up on production a little?
Click to expand...
amazon? (if you don't mind long cage)

Amazon.com : SHIMANO XT RD-M8120-SGS Rear Derailleur - 12-Speed, Long Cage, Black, for 2X : Sports & Outdoors

Amazon.com : SHIMANO XT RD-M8120-SGS Rear Derailleur - 12-Speed, Long Cage, Black, for 2X : Sports & Outdoors
www.amazon.com
 
Sandwich

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,823
7,070
borcester rhymes
I always wear knee/shin and elbow pads...couldn't afford a neck brace and found body armor to be extremely hot and restrictive. I found that with more freedom to move, I was a bit less likely to crash. I think that if you are pushing 10/10 then you had better wear it, especially a neck brace, but I'm never going that fast as I'm an old fart at this point. I too remember the time that every kyle at the bike park had no pads but a full face and neck brace on.

Regardless, I'm actually of the attitude that the fewer restrictions on top level racing, the better. Sort of like Steve Peat's visor brigade and the skinsuit mafia. If they feel faster in a spandex Gstring, then go for it. If the top level riders want universal protective gear so they don't explode, then they should push for it.
 
bullcrew

bullcrew

3 Dude Approved
Dec 8, 2004
9,452
3,180
I'm dude playing dude pretending to b another dude
Kyle strait knee , gloves and either a hucker lid if it's nasty or fullface if it's really nasty...and five tens ....

Was pumped got back into it, my gear bag was stolen all my old parts for 18 years, gear helmets etc gone...
Stopped making the strait knee pads...found 2 brand new sets bought em..
 
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iRider

iRider

Turbo Monkey
Apr 5, 2008
5,701
3,163
bullcrew said:
Stopped making the strait knee pads...found 2 brand new sets bought em..
Click to expand...
I loved those pads but then discovered the Scott Grenade Pro 2. Better than the Straits but now also discontinued. Scott's new offerings look good as well, I have no experience with those though.
 
bullcrew

bullcrew

3 Dude Approved
Dec 8, 2004
9,452
3,180
I'm dude playing dude pretending to b another dude
iRider said:
I loved those pads but then discovered the Scott Grenade Pro 2. Better than the Straits but now also discontinued. Scott's new offerings look good as well, I have no experience with those though.
Click to expand...
I went to bike bling tried race face, troy Lee and a couple others...walked around and they chaffed the crease in the knee...


Tried to find ones with similar cut...nada...thank God for classifieds lol....I'll have to see if some grenades pop up..good to know they fit similar...always looking for a set that's like em.
 
Loki87

Loki87

Monkey
Aug 24, 2008
181
146
Salzburg, Austria
bullcrew said:
I went to bike bling tried race face, troy Lee and a couple others...walked around and they chaffed the crease in the knee...


Tried to find ones with similar cut...nada...thank God for classifieds lol....I'll have to see if some grenades pop up..good to know they fit similar...always looking for a set that's like em.
Click to expand...
Second vote for Grenades. Scott also offer a shin pad extension for them. Pretty happy with mine. New ones seem to be even better.
 
rideit

rideit

Bob the Builder
Aug 24, 2004
24,658
12,461
In the cleavage of the Tetons
MrBaker87 said:
What’s up with the industry not being able to keep up on production a little?
Click to expand...
JT from Giant bicycles sent out an email today with what I consider the most informative, helpful and detailed response/reason for all of the delays, cost increases and the frustration we are all experiencing.



Telling customers…”Covid has caused delays” does no good!
“They do not understand.



For everyone asking….”how could Covid be causing issues”.



Dear Giant Retailer,
Please note the following supply update.

The headwinds are many and massive; we are working every angle to navigate solutions, however in some cases we simply have to be patient.

Situation 1
Headwind: Shimano Malaysia is still closed due to a government solution to a severe COVID-19 breakout. We have no choice but to wait. This impacts all component groups below SLX and 105.

Situation 2
Headwind: Container shortage is very real: a recent fire in the port of Shanghai has shut down the transport of hazardous containers (E-bike), we have thousands of E-bikes completed with challenge to book containers. We are working on solutions now, but this has not been solved. Standard containers are in short supply, space on container ships is overbooked, and labor from origin to our warehouse is experiencing a severe shortage due to the volume of all kinds of freight. We are paying premium fees (above and beyond) to secure containers: overpaying is the only path to secure what standard containers can be reserved at this time.

Situation 3
Headwind: All sub suppliers are reducing production lines as a result of raw material shortages and labor challenges: this is the result of COVID-19. In this country we have the world’s best vaccine circumstance. The Southeast Asia area, the capital of bike supplier production, does not. This is an issue we need to remain patient with as governments manage the spread of COVID-19 and vaccine disbursement. Some markets are in an unhealthy way with little access to vaccine.

Situation 4
Headwind: Ability to sub specification parts is very difficult because all sub suppliers have tremendous lead times (and less output) as result of the prior 3 notations.

Solution
No brand is more aggressive (or positioned) to procure your backorders. Be very clear: every brand and every retailer is experiencing this challenge.

Thank you for your understanding and patience, please note we continue to work late into the evening with far-reaching solutions to improve. We will keep you informed to our best ability. It is important to note that this information is dynamic and will change week to week; we will be posting updates weekly on G-Store.

All the best,
JT
 
bullcrew

bullcrew

3 Dude Approved
Dec 8, 2004
9,452
3,180
I'm dude playing dude pretending to b another dude
rideit said:
JT from Giant bicycles sent out an email today with what I consider the most informative, helpful and detailed response/reason for all of the delays, cost increases and the frustration we are all experiencing.



Telling customers…”Covid has caused delays” does no good!
“They do not understand.



For everyone asking….”how could Covid be causing issues”.



Dear Giant Retailer,
Please note the following supply update.

The headwinds are many and massive; we are working every angle to navigate solutions, however in some cases we simply have to be patient.

Situation 1
Headwind: Shimano Malaysia is still closed due to a government solution to a severe COVID-19 breakout. We have no choice but to wait. This impacts all component groups below SLX and 105.

Situation 2
Headwind: Container shortage is very real: a recent fire in the port of Shanghai has shut down the transport of hazardous containers (E-bike), we have thousands of E-bikes completed with challenge to book containers. We are working on solutions now, but this has not been solved. Standard containers are in short supply, space on container ships is overbooked, and labor from origin to our warehouse is experiencing a severe shortage due to the volume of all kinds of freight. We are paying premium fees (above and beyond) to secure containers: overpaying is the only path to secure what standard containers can be reserved at this time.

Situation 3
Headwind: All sub suppliers are reducing production lines as a result of raw material shortages and labor challenges: this is the result of COVID-19. In this country we have the world’s best vaccine circumstance. The Southeast Asia area, the capital of bike supplier production, does not. This is an issue we need to remain patient with as governments manage the spread of COVID-19 and vaccine disbursement. Some markets are in an unhealthy way with little access to vaccine.

Situation 4
Headwind: Ability to sub specification parts is very difficult because all sub suppliers have tremendous lead times (and less output) as result of the prior 3 notations.

Solution
No brand is more aggressive (or positioned) to procure your backorders. Be very clear: every brand and every retailer is experiencing this challenge.

Thank you for your understanding and patience, please note we continue to work late into the evening with far-reaching solutions to improve. We will keep you informed to our best ability. It is important to note that this information is dynamic and will change week to week; we will be posting updates weekly on G-Store.

All the best,
JT
Click to expand...
But Why????

Kidding , wouldn't it be easier to say "because of covid"...lol
 
sethimus

sethimus

neu bizutch
Feb 5, 2006
5,326
2,422
not in Whistler anymore :/
telling that the customers for a long time already. next year is gonna be aweful if giant really is only shipping most bikes from march onwards. thankfully we took in orbea too, will help when our giant stock finally dries up.
 
maxyedor

maxyedor

<b>TOOL PRO</b>
Oct 20, 2005
5,496
3,141
In the bathroom, fighting a battle
Lelandjt

Lelandjt

adorbs
Apr 4, 2008
2,639
998
Breckenridge, CO/Lahaina,HI
Here's a fresh gripe: Companies only making their top frame available with an over-the-top build kit or choice of two very expensive builds. I see this with Santa Cruz only selling their CC frames with XO and up and Scott is even worse. Apparently they don't bring many framesets to the USA and the one I want isn't listed on their site. To get the new Spark in their lightest carbon I have to buy the $12,999 model with Trickstuff brakes, 1-piece carbon wheels, and XX AXS. To get the second level carbon that's probably 80g heavier I must buy the $9,499 model with XO AXS, XTR, and carbon rims. Only their 3rd tier frame is available in a few builds.
This basically makes their top frame unavailable. I've got all the parts here to build it, but I don't want to lay out $13k, then have to try to sell the very expensive parts. I might settle for the 2nd tier frame but that's still a lot of money to lay out for parts I'm just gonna turn around and sell. Well yeah, I'll pay EP, but still.... I'm waiting to hear how much more the 2nd and 3rd tier frames weigh compared to the quoted 1870g for the top tier.
 
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