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This is what's wrong with The Industry™

SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
2,656
1,099
coloRADo
oh honey.....

You think the people designing this shit are riding greens creek?
MMmmmmm...Greens...It's been a while. Need some Monarch Pass shuttles stat.

I did read an article on Duncan Riffle when he worked in Chicago for SRAM. SoCal boy trying to a jog in the morning in the snow. Cracks me up.
 

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Cracks me up.
Oh honey......

If you want to be genuinely cracked up:

this is some of the funniest shit on the innernetz


don't knock on that door
dbag.JPG


you might make a trustfunder ask for a manager
 
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Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
20,388
10,855
AK
The advantage of wool is that it maintains insulating capabilities better than other natural fibers when wet. No idea if that is better or worse than synthetics but it is certainly a lot better than cotton. I can say good wool socks keep my feet warmer than anything else and those damn things are always sweating if not ice cold. I can also wear a pair of wool socks for a week without them smelling.
I've seen data on it and it's not significantly better. It's slightly better, but the wool industry likes to make it sound like synthetics don't or they are way way less and that's just BS. Plus, when you dry faster...you get warmer faster. My toes will get cold no matter what, like last night packing a trail and they got wet...with huge wool socks. I'll have to use chem heaters or my winter boot riding setup with vapor barriers...but there's definitely more too it than wool. I don't hate it...I just feel it is way way over played and and the claims are over the top, in some cases, the claims are exactly opposite of what it does and people keep buying it for the wrong purpose.

I'm definitely not throwing out my wool socks...but there's a lot of factors and I have a certain pair of wool socks (several of the same) that seem to work well for my ski boots. They don't work for anything else though. For riding in the cold, it's thin silk sock, then vapor barrier, then lamilite sock, then the boot. Wool don't cut it there, never has. My feet turn into icicles no matter the boot. But around the house, wool socks are nice!
 

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
I've seen data on it and it's not significantly better. It's slightly better, but the wool industry likes to make it sound like synthetics don't or they are way way less and that's just BS. Plus, when you dry faster...you get warmer faster. My toes will get cold no matter what, like last night packing a trail and they got wet...with huge wool socks. I'll have to use chem heaters or my winter boot riding setup with vapor barriers...but there's definitely more too it than wool. I don't hate it...I just feel it is way way over played and and the claims are over the top, in some cases, the claims are exactly opposite of what it does and people keep buying it for the wrong purpose.

I'm definitely not throwing out my wool socks...but there's a lot of factors and I have a certain pair of wool socks (several of the same) that seem to work well for my ski boots. They don't work for anything else though. For riding in the cold, it's thin silk sock, then vapor barrier, then lamilite sock, then the boot. Wool don't cut it there, never has. My feet turn into icicles no matter the boot. But around the house, wool socks are nice!
That's probably just god letting you know that your fatbike looks funny. Go inside and drink whiskey like a normal person. I mean normal alaskan. Which I guess is meth. So go inside and do meth and make your own socks out of whatever fibers you can put together not including but not excluding human hair, yours or others.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
20,388
10,855
AK
That's probably just god letting you know that your fatbike looks funny. Go inside and drink whiskey like a normal person. I mean normal alaskan. Which I guess is meth. So go inside and do meth and make your own socks out of whatever fibers you can put together not including but not excluding human hair, yours or others.
I am drinking whiskey.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
20,388
10,855
AK
The trails were post-holed to hell. But I'm riding a fucking enduro-fatbike, because fock those people.
 

SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
2,656
1,099
coloRADo
Oh honey......

If you want to be genuinely cracked up:

this is some of the funniest shit on the innernetz


don't knock on that door
View attachment 204389

you might make a trustfunder ask for a manager
Well, at least he looks....Ummm...Healthy?

Hopefully he's happy. I'm happy I'm not really on social media. Or wait. What is RM? :D
 

sethimus

neu bizutch
Feb 5, 2006
5,383
2,459
not in Whistler anymore :/
Oh honey......

If you want to be genuinely cracked up:

this is some of the funniest shit on the innernetz


don't knock on that door
View attachment 204389

you might make a trustfunder ask for a manager
does he still ride bikes or too dangerous for the tats?
 

iRider

Turbo Monkey
Apr 5, 2008
5,788
3,242
Objectively. I absolutely can't stand having to use your left hand to shift the rear mech up and your right hand to shift it back down.

I don't think anyone at SRAM even rides a road bike.
I thought you can program the AXS stuff to whatever you want, no?
They did that just so that you have to still buy two electronic shift/brake levers instead having one cheap one for the left w/o electronics.
 

Gary

my pronouns are hag/gis
Aug 27, 2002
8,594
6,495
UK
I thought you can program the AXS stuff to whatever you want, no?
They did that just so that you have to still buy two electronic shift/brake levers instead having one cheap one for the left w/o electronics.
With ONE switch on each lever surely that can only really mean some long press/short press BS! No worse than their shitty mechanical double tap system I suppose. If they weren't forced to ride bikes at lunchtime these nerds could probably have programed it to accept a "secret" code patern for either shift.
Shhhhhhhh...
 

sethimus

neu bizutch
Feb 5, 2006
5,383
2,459
not in Whistler anymore :/
With ONE switch on each lever surely that can only really mean some long press/short press BS! No worse than their shitty mechanical double tap system I suppose. If they weren't forced to ride bikes at lunchtime these nerds could probably have programed it to accept a "secret" code patern for either shift.
Shhhhhhhh...
doubletab is amazing, easy one finger shifting. one of the reasons i stay in the mechanical camp and go srampagnolo 13s for the future
 

Gary

my pronouns are hag/gis
Aug 27, 2002
8,594
6,495
UK
Shimano road Sti levers were ergonomically designed to sit in a vertical plane when viewed from the front. Not some ridiculous angle due to the fashion for "flare" marketed towards gravel wankers.
So I can understand noobs confusion as to how to operate them efficiently.
I suggest you offset your disappointment by purchasing MOAR luggage! Or maybe growing wanky moustache
 

Gary

my pronouns are hag/gis
Aug 27, 2002
8,594
6,495
UK
mtb has possibly become even dorkier these days what with all the massive wobbly earhugging transform-a-helmets, ski eyewear, paint on skinny pants, fanny packs, and the elastomer* fetish

*or whatever this weeks BS over obsession to detail is
 

iRider

Turbo Monkey
Apr 5, 2008
5,788
3,242
No. Its shit.
Save your sales pitch for your clueless punters.
As much as it pains me to say this, I am with Seth on this. Can only speak for mechanical stuff, but I prefer Double Tap. Before you go "did you ever ride them", yes! I currently have 10spd Ultegra, 2 generations of 10spd Dura Ace, 11spd Dura Ace, 10spd Rival and 11spd Force HRD on different bikes. The Rival front shift lever/derailleur are shit (needs too much actuation force, know problem of that generation), but the Force is mint! For shifting smoothness I prefer the 11spd Dura Ace, but for ergonomics I am in the SRAM camp.

Disclaimer: all are run on normal road bars, no swoopy gravel bar BS going on here.
 

Gary

my pronouns are hag/gis
Aug 27, 2002
8,594
6,495
UK
Please tell me you also enjoy gear cable replacement on those things. All will make sense to me then.
 

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Also one for the "Loam Rats"...

what is this exactly?


and equally important, how can I add elastomers to it in order to charge more money than they do?
 

OGRipper

back alley ripper
Feb 3, 2004
10,744
1,255
NORCAL is the hizzle
I am going to be a sweaty wet mess no matter what (regardless of temp, fancy "breathable" materials, etc.), and wool base layers feel better/warmer against the skin than anything else I've tried.
 

mykel

closer to Periwinkle
Apr 19, 2013
5,536
4,252
sw ontario canada
I am going to be a sweaty wet mess no matter what (regardless of temp, fancy "breathable" materials, etc.), and wool base layers feel better/warmer against the skin than anything else I've tried.

I break out in a sweat if I even see a picture of the sun.
Wool sox rock. Period.
Wool anything else is a wet nasty sweat-fest.
I find wool maybe a touch warmer than a good synthetic - maybe, but it does not transport sweat nearly as well. Icebreaker and Smartwool are who I have tried in different fabric weights. So for me, it is a cycle of heat up, sweat profusely, get cold and clammy, repeat until you give up. My summer goto is Fox or TLD mesh shirts.
 

slyfink

Turbo Monkey
Sep 16, 2008
9,833
5,666
Ottawa, Canada
I've found that for high-output activities in the cold (xc skiing, fat biking), there is no doubt that a synthetic base layer pulls the sweat off my skin much better, and much quicker than wool. The problem is it doesn't do much to insulate if I wind up needing to stop for any reason (drop or add air, faff with a frozen dropper, fix wax on skis, etc etc etc). There's pros and cons to both wool and synthetic, neither is perfect. In the end I've accepted the cons of wool and default to it most of the time mostly because it doesn't smell like a well used hockey bag after a a few uses (yes, even if I wash it every fricken time I use it)...
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
20,388
10,855
AK
I've found that for high-output activities in the cold (xc skiing, fat biking), there is no doubt that a synthetic base layer pulls the sweat off my skin much better, and much quicker than wool. The problem is it doesn't do much to insulate if I wind up needing to stop for any reason (drop or add air, faff with a frozen dropper, fix wax on skis, etc etc etc). There's pros and cons to both wool and synthetic, neither is perfect. In the end I've accepted the cons of wool and default to it most of the time mostly because it doesn't smell like a well used hockey bag after a a few uses (yes, even if I wash it every fricken time I use it)...
Synthetic is warmer for the weight.

Neither is perfect, but IME, people have been pulled way too far into the marketing of the wool industry, who is attempting to justify a higher cost material that has some negative qualities at least some of the time.

I find the biggest benefit with wool is on expedition stuff, it won't get nasty. If you bunch your stuff up in fester-piles after riding, wool may also be for that person. It's not so much the washing, it's the prevention of bacteria growing, which if dried immediately, takes a big bite out of. THere are other things too, like adding vinegar to the wash, etc. I don't find a big stink problem, but I don't get drenched in it and it dries so much faster, so those seem to compliment themselves.

I don't find a difference in base layers if I need to stop and do something...that's just the old issue of having enough clothing for your output. It'll never match 100%, you have to adjust. If it's a cold day, first thing to do if you are going to f-around to work on something for a while is throw on the down puffy. Or, if it's really cold, open a few handwarmers and put them in your pocket so body warmth will jump-start em, throw on the mittens, put on the puffy, etc. This will also help to heat you a lot faster when you do start generating heat on the bike again, rather than riding cold for the next hour. But if you have enough stuff to stay warm when standing around, it will drench you when you get warm on the bike.
 

OGRipper

back alley ripper
Feb 3, 2004
10,744
1,255
NORCAL is the hizzle
sweat profusely, get cold and clammy, repeat until you give up.
I resemble this...

For me, a wool base layer top is the best at avoiding the "cold and clammy" feel at lower temps, so that's what I wear probably 6 - 7 months out of a year here in NorCal and the Sierra. That chilling effect doesn't bother me when it's warm out, in fact I welcome it, so I wear synthetic tops in the summer though.
 

sethimus

neu bizutch
Feb 5, 2006
5,383
2,459
not in Whistler anymore :/
I've found that for high-output activities in the cold (xc skiing, fat biking), there is no doubt that a synthetic base layer pulls the sweat off my skin much better, and much quicker than wool. The problem is it doesn't do much to insulate if I wind up needing to stop for any reason (drop or add air, faff with a frozen dropper, fix wax on skis, etc etc etc). There's pros and cons to both wool and synthetic, neither is perfect. In the end I've accepted the cons of wool and default to it most of the time mostly because it doesn't smell like a well used hockey bag after a a few uses (yes, even if I wash it every fricken time I use it)...

that one is amazing for a synthetic one
 

FlipFantasia

Turbo Monkey
Oct 4, 2001
1,699
552
Sea to Sky BC
I'm a merino guy, have done half a dozen rides at night in 0-5C over the pas few weeks wearing a couple of long sleeve top layers and I definitely prefer it to synthetic most of the time.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
20,388
10,855
AK

that one is amazing for a synthetic one
When it comes to the base layer, I find if it's between a thin wool and snythetic, there are properties that are vastly more important than the material.

Like, long enough sleeves to overlap between jacket and glove and not leave exposed skin. I don't usually use those "thumb hole" things, but they can be nice to have every once and a while. Enough length though, critical. Same with torso for the ass and back. But to have that and still be stretchy and form fitting so it'll wick...it needs to be fitted right. Short stuff or long and baggy doesn't work. Baggy seems to leave moisture condensing on the skin and lots of cold spots. Then zipper is critical, like 1/2 zipper, for venting and so on. Turtleneck seems to also make for a much warmer base layer, vs. ones with no collar. Also helps to seal between a balaclava if worn. Stretchy is pretty important for that form-fitting wicking too. And then it's nice to have some different weights of them, again regardless of the material, for using on different days or with different jackets.