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Those sneaky chinese bastiids

ridetoofast

scarred, broken and drunk
Mar 31, 2002
2,093
0
crashing at a trail near you...
http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/12/12/051212224756.jwmkvntb.html

Hacker attacks in US linked to Chinese military: researchers


Dec 12 5:56 PM US/Eastern

A systematic effort by hackers to penetrate US government and industry computer networks stems most likely from the Chinese military, the head of a leading security institute said. The attacks have been traced to the Chinese province of Guangdong, and the techniques used make it appear unlikely to come from any other source than the military, said Alan Paller, the director of the SANS Institute, an education and research organization focusing on cybersecurity.


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"These attacks come from someone with intense discipline. No other organization could do this if they were not a military organization," Paller said in a conference call to announced a new cybersecurity education program.

In the attacks, Paller said, the perpetrators "were in and out with no keystroke errors and left no fingerprints, and created a backdoor in less than 30 minutes. How can this be done by anyone other than a military organization?"

Paller said that despite what appears to be a systematic effort to target government agencies and defense contractors, defenses have remained weak in many areas.

"We know about major penetrations of defense contractors," he said.

Security among private-sector Pentagon contractors may not be as robust, said Paller, because "they are less willing to make it hard for mobile people to get their work done."

Paller said the US government strategy appears to be to downplay the attacks, which has not helped the situation.

"We have a problem that our computer networks have been terribly and deeply penetrated throughout the United States ... and we've been keeping it secret," he said.

"The people who benefit from keeping it secret are the attackers."

Although Paller said the hackers probably have not obtained classified documents from the Pentagon, which uses a more secure network, it is possible they stole "extremely sensitive" information.

He said it has been documented that US military flight planning software from its Redstone Arsenal was stolen.

Pentagon officials confirmed earlier this year that US Defense Department websites are probed hundreds of times a day by hackers, but maintained that no classified site is known to have been penetrated by hackers.

The US military has code-named the recent hacker effort "Titan Rain" and has made some strides in counter-hacking to identify the attackers, Paller said. This was first reported by Time magazine.

Paller said a series of attacks on British computer networks reported earlier this year may have similar goals, but seems to use different techniques.

In the United States, he said there are some areas of improvement such as the case of the Air Force, which has been insisting on better security from its IT vendors. But he argued that "the fundamental error is that America's security strategy relies on writing reports rather than hardening systems."
 

ALEXIS_DH

Tirelessly Awesome
Jan 30, 2003
5,343
150
Lima, Peru, Peru
"were in and out with no keystroke errors and left no fingerprints, and created a backdoor in less than 30 minutes. How can this be done by anyone other than a military organization?" of course that is enough proof to grant an invasion!!!

now its the turn of the chinese to get liberated!!!!!....
 

valve bouncer

Master Dildoist
Feb 11, 2002
7,791
36
Japan
I'm sure the Americans are trying just as hard to get Chinese secrets. Used to be called spying if I remember correctly.
 

zahgurim

Underwater monkey
Mar 9, 2005
1,101
12
lolAsia
skatetokil said:
They can have taiwan. I'm not going to go over there and kill people for that stupid rock.
If Taiwan got annexed, prices on bike parts would skyrocket.
Start stocking up!
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,033
0
Denver
valve bouncer said:
I'm sure the Americans are trying just as hard to get Chinese secrets. Used to be called spying if I remember correctly.
Funny how people forget that little fact.
 

ohio

The Fresno Kid
Nov 26, 2001
6,640
4
SF, CA
LordOpie said:
Funny how people forget that little fact.
It's not really worth remembering... we spy on them to see how close they're getting to us. The spy on us to cheat their way to catching up. It's the difference between keeping tabs and stealing.
 

Changleen

Paranoid Member
Jan 9, 2004
9,890
4
Hypernormality
ohio said:
we spy on them to see how close they're getting to us. The spy on us to cheat their way to catching up.
Other way round I think these days? The Japanese are the ones pushing the limits at the moment.
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,033
0
Denver
besides, the chinese don't need to spy, they just need to be the lowest bidder on the outsourced contract.
 

The Amish

Dumber than N8
Feb 22, 2005
645
0
Its unquetionably the next major war, and I'm not talking this Iraq, Afghanistan nonsense. Its gonna be serious business. Both sides have been lining up their peices for years, its really a matter of when not if. I doubt the world will survive.
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,033
0
Denver
The Amish said:
Its unquetionably the next major war, and I'm not talking this Iraq, Afghanistan nonsense. Its gonna be serious business. Both sides have been lining up their peices for years, its really a matter of when not if. I doubt the world will survive.
I might have misunderstood you... are you saying that China/USA are going to go to war someday soon?
 

ALEXIS_DH

Tirelessly Awesome
Jan 30, 2003
5,343
150
Lima, Peru, Peru
LordOpie said:
I might have misunderstood you... are you saying that China/USA are going to go to war someday soon?
with guys with attitudes like the amish north of the border i wonder how can some people be questioning why the world dislikes the US that much.....:p
 

The Amish

Dumber than N8
Feb 22, 2005
645
0
LordOpie said:
I might have misunderstood you... are you saying that China/USA are going to go to war someday soon?
I dont know if I would say soon, but I think Its an extremely real possibilty. I dont think its gonna be a cold war like with the soviets either. We're not starving them out, they already are. But you know were not turning our back on tawain, nor do I believe we'll ultimately turn our backs on the ever growing number of people within China demanding democracy that the commies keep squashing. Thats just not how America does it. Unless of course its in Africa, which is just plain fuct. In the end of days its either gonna be a democratic world or a communist world. The two cant coexist side by side
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,033
0
Denver
The Amish said:
The two cant coexist side by side
We're not talking Jews and Palestinians ;) I think they can.

But more to the point... how can a war between the two biggest superpowers NOT lead to nukes?
 

The Amish

Dumber than N8
Feb 22, 2005
645
0
Changleen said:
You should kill yourself now them, save yourself a horrible slow radioactive death.
How'd that saying go. I want to be around to see the whole sh#thouse go up in flames. Atleast I'll die a horribly slow death knowing that your coming with me. I find comfort in that
 

valve bouncer

Master Dildoist
Feb 11, 2002
7,791
36
Japan
The Amish said:
In the end of days its either gonna be a democratic world or a communist world. The two cant coexist side by side
Right on man, 'cos those Chinese are real hard-core commies, aren't they?:rolleyes: I see N8 has some real competition for board idiot.
 

Changleen

Paranoid Member
Jan 9, 2004
9,890
4
Hypernormality
The Amish said:
I dont know if I would say soon, but I think Its an extremely real possibilty. I dont think its gonna be a cold war like with the soviets either. We're not starving them out, they already are. But you know were not turning our back on tawain, nor do I believe we'll ultimately turn our backs on the ever growing number of people within China demanding democracy that the commies keep squashing. Thats just not how America does it. Unless of course its in Africa, which is just plain fuct. In the end of days its either gonna be a democratic world or a communist world. The two cant coexist side by side
Wow, the more times I try to make sense of this, the more I think this may well be the most ignorant, poorly thought through statement ever to appear on the internet, ever. Truly the work of some sort of idiot mastermind.
 

The Amish

Dumber than N8
Feb 22, 2005
645
0
Changleen said:
Wow, the more times I try to make sense of this, the more I think this may well be the most ignorant, poorly thought through statement ever to appear on the internet, ever. Truly the work of some sort of idiot mastermind.

Wait for it............................
 

The Amish

Dumber than N8
Feb 22, 2005
645
0
ALEXIS_DH said:
with guys with attitudes like the amish north of the border i wonder how can some people be questioning why the world dislikes the US that much.....:p

I almost let this one slide, but then I realised i wouldnt be able to get any sleep tonight if I did. You want to know why all the other countries hate us, I can break it down real simple for you. Its because we're a country made up entirely of people from all those other countries who realised that there homelands were a pathetic joke, and that they'd never amount to anything if they stayed. So they came here on a rumour of the American dream, busted there ass's and actualy found it. Now the people from there homelands are pissed cause they stayed behind in there joke of a country and wound up with nothing

Its called Penis envy. Im sure you, opie, and change are familiar with it
 

valve bouncer

Master Dildoist
Feb 11, 2002
7,791
36
Japan
Changleen said:
Wow, you did it.
I propose an eliminator cage match. The Amish versus Ridetoofast. The winner gets to challenge N8 for the title. N8 has got some serious competition for once.
 

ALEXIS_DH

Tirelessly Awesome
Jan 30, 2003
5,343
150
Lima, Peru, Peru
The Amish said:
I almost let this one slide, but then I realised i wouldnt be able to get any sleep tonight if I did. You want to know why all the other countries hate us, I can break it down real simple for you. Its because we're a country made up entirely of people from all those other countries who realised that there homelands were a pathetic joke, and that they'd never amount to anything if they stayed. So they came here on a rumour of the American dream, busted there ass's and actualy found it. Now the people from there homelands are pissed cause they stayed behind in there joke of a country and wound up with nothing

Its called Penis envy. Im sure you, opie, and change are familiar with it

lol.. you are gonna make me cry..
specially the penis part. now everybody knows mine is petite.
:p
 

Reactor

Turbo Monkey
Apr 5, 2005
3,978
1
Chandler, AZ, USA
LordOpie said:
We're not talking Jews and Palestinians ;) I think they can.

But more to the point... how can a war between the two biggest superpowers NOT lead to nukes?

Actually it's pretty simple. China tries to invade TW, their transports have some first hand experiences with the Mark 48 ADCAP, sea-lance and tomahawk. Their crappy diesel subs learn about passive sono-bouys, look down radar, and air dropped torpedoes. TW scrambles real jets (not mig 21 knock-offs) to shoot down any incoming air transport and escort. China thinks about the nuclear option, sees how out gunned they are, and that it's a zero sum game. They declare their fleet was lost to typhoon "longwang", and go home to lick their wounds. Just one scenario.

In reality mainland China's one card is the nuclear card. Their navy is incompetent, and extremely out of date. Their air force is not much better. They have a huge army, but what good is it if they can't deploy, because they can't control the sea or sky? Even if they managed to land they need sea control, they can't effectively resupply without it, and they won't get it. Russia is pretty sure to take a dim view of an aggressive neighbor, and when Japan and the US stop trading with them their economy will be in free fall.

I'm sure COMSUBPAC has a whole drawer of contingency plans.
 

blue

boob hater
Jan 24, 2004
10,165
0
california
The United States doesn't have the military/industrial power to get involved in a full scale conventional war with the Chinese. However, China doesn't have the naval or air power necessary to get into a war with the United States. Or with Taiwan, for that matter...Why do you think they haven't invaded yet?

Edit:

I just actually took the time to read this thread...Holy God...Amish...moron yes? Bwahahahaha, the Chinese are communists. I mean, it's not like a direct replication of the Industrial Revolution in Europe...You know...Capitalism at work...Bettering the lives of EVERYONE!
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,033
0
Denver
I'm thinking the only way China gets into a huge war is revolution.

Besides, China sure seems to enjoy being our subcontractor.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
36,484
3,238
Sleazattle
China would go bankrupt if they couldn't sell their crap in our Walmarts. You would see inflation skyrocket in a day if China decided to unload its Billions of American dollars. China and the US need each other, any conflict and both countries are royally screwed. I'd keep my eyes out for Canada, they have been massing at the border for years.
 

ohio

The Fresno Kid
Nov 26, 2001
6,640
4
SF, CA
Changleen said:
Other way round I think these days? The Japanese are the ones pushing the limits at the moment.
Nah, while we've cut funding to everything that might actually benefit us economically (from biotech research to college scholarships and loans), we still fund the **** out of defense. No one can touch our defensive technology lead. Which makes me feel a whole lot better about getting our economic asses kicked by Indian software firms, Korean biotech firms, and Taiwanese consumer electronics manufacturers.
 

Pesqueeb

bicycle in airplane hangar
Feb 2, 2007
27,534
3,803
Riding the baggage carousel.
LULZ hax0red!

Hackers have accessed designs for more than two dozen major U.S. weapons systems, according to a devastating classified report a Pentagon advisor shared with the Washington Post.
Although the report from the Defense Science Board did not identify the hackers, senior military and industry officials with knowledge of the breaches say they come primarily from China, according to Ellen Nakashima of the Post.
A public version of the report released in January warned of an "existential cyber attack" with "potentially spectacular" effects.
Some of the more disturbing leaks include designs for cutting edge jets, missile systems, and electronic warfare technology.
"This is billions of dollars of combat advantage for China. They've just saved themselves 25 years of research and development. It's nuts," a senior official told the Post.
Another referred to the items on the list as the U.S. Military's "family jewels," the Guardian reported.
Here's a partial list of compromised designs:
F-35
V-22
Terminal High Altitude Area Defense (THAAD Missile Defense)
Patriot Advanced Capability-3 (Patriot missile defense system)
AMRAAM (AIM-120 Advanced Medium-Range Air-to-Air Missile)
Global Hawk (high altitude surveillance drone)
PII (email addresses, SSN, credit card numbers, passwords, etc.)
“That’s staggering,” Mark Stokes, executive director of the Project 2049 Institute, a think tank that focuses on Asia security issues, told the Washington Post. “These are all very critical weapons systems, critical to our national security. When I hear this in totality, it’s breathtaking.”
What this means for the U.S., strategically speaking, boils down to the F-35 weapons systems: they're all run with complex software, and are hooked up to a cryptographic intranet communications systems.
In plain english: they can be hacked.
From a September 2012 Reuters story:
The military's move toward greater use of so-called autonomic weapons systems, which rely heavily on computers, promises to revolutionize the way weapons are maintained and operated, but also carries a new level of cyber risk.
And the weapons designers are having difficulty keeping up with the hackers.
So just like in the movie Independence Day, in theory Chinese hackers could use electronic warfare to give F-35 weapons systems a cold, make them sick, essentially inoperable.
For China, strategically speaking it's about fabrication.
Evidently part of the big haul was schematics for small parts needed to set up manufacturing for these weapons systems. China apparently uses several different means to gain access to these Defense Systems, most of them utilizing what Information Security experts call "human engineering" — when manipulative emails or clever online con-men actually get victims to divulge information on their own.
From Quartz:
[One more convincing tactic is executed] by creating innocuous-looking companies and research institutes that reach out to US companies, researchers and universities under the guise of civilian cooperation, only to steal their technology and experts for use by the PLA.
It's not clear yet what this means for China's military. China's defense industry has been plagued with corruption and projects that run over cost, require frequent modification, and often rely on second-hand Russian technology.
But they're getting better.
Just take a look at this excerpt from a brief study on China's aviation industry:
Notwithstanding some persistent weaknesses, the industry can now manufacture nearly every type of platform and system that China’s defence requires. In the process, the industry’s ability to innovate has leapt ahead. While once they were trapped in static patterns of imitation, China’s manufacturers now produce items showing creative adaptations and signs of architectural innovation.
Still, the full extent of China's ability to fabricate actual jets and missiles from these plans is still uncertain.
"Some of the Chinese defense groups are already quite strong after so much military spending in recent years, but you don't know exactly how well they are doing financially or technologically because China does not want others to know," Wu Da, a portfolio manager at Beijing-based Changsheng Fund Management Co Ltd which invests in listed Chinese defense stocks, told Reuters.


Damn, lots of lost souls in this thread. :(