[canadmos]

Our little group of idiots were thinking of putting on a super mellow enduro race.

But with a twist, you have to buy a $100 bike off Craigslist and run it as is. Can't replace the brakes, tires etc. Can only replace the chain if needed.

But how do we time it? Without buying some expensive timing kit. Any thoughts? Strava segments?

 

[Westy]

I'd recommend a nice clock.

Or make the contestants make an astrolabe reading in order to cross the finish line.

 

[Full Trucker]

Stopwatches. Seriously. Sync a couple of handheld stopwatches and have one at the top and one at the bottom. Riders have to start exactly on a minute or a :30, starter writes down the time they started. If they go early, dock them a second or two. When they cross the line at the bottom, the finish timer clicks the lap button to freeze the display, write the time down. After the race, do the math. I’ve entered into a Google spreadsheet and have it calculate the difference, Excel sucks at anything time related but Google sheets is okay-ish. If you start everyone at the top of a minute the math is way easier to sort out with your brain. Heck, this method is done as a backup even at fancy races with chip timing systems.

 

[Full Trucker]

Also, the race concept sounds fun. Like Gambler 500 or 24 Hours of Lemons for mountain bikes.

 

[SuspectDevice]

synced stopwatches, write starttime and finish time on a piece of duct tape on the toptube, compile results in excel.

or, get android phones, and run the zone4.ca app in bib-entry mode. As long as you don’t charge for the race the zone4 app is free to use)

 

[Gary]

Stopwatches. Seriously. Sync a couple of handheld stopwatches and have one at the top and one at the bottom. Riders have to start exactly on a minute or a :30, starter writes down the time they started. If they go early, dock them a second or two. When they cross the line at the bottom, the finish timer clicks the lap button to freeze the display, write the time down. After the race, do the math. I’ve entered into a Google spreadsheet and have it calculate the difference, Excel sucks at anything time related but Google sheets is okay-ish. If you start everyone at the top of a minute the math is way easier to sort out with your brain. Heck, this method is done as a backup even at fancy races with chip timing systems.

We used to do almost exactly this method BITD on shorter DH tracks. But a with a pad and pen at the start and finish rather than any computers. Like you said. Start each rider on the minute and it's really simple to work out times. The stopwatch holders at the top and bottom will have phones these days so you won't even need walkie talkies to communicate.
Keep it simple as possible. it's meant to be fun.

The first DH races at Innerleithen (Golfie). (now famous from EWS racing and a bazillion youtubers). back in the early 90s were run by old mates of mine on a very tight budget. Just one Medic from the Red cross (charity). a start guy and finish guy with walkie talkies, stopwatches and pen and paper start sheets. Push up for practice and race run with about 70 riders and just a tenner to enter. You'd never get away with that these days. But no one really GAF about H&S back then.
Those guys were also responsible for getting chairlift bike access to the top station and the track running from to bottom at Fort William as a DH race venue. They got some help from the Avalanche cup guys. Who ironically ripped them off and bankrupted them. We wouldn't have had that first WC at Ft William without those guys vision.

 

[Gary]

A few years back a local group of riders used to run a monthly Enduro using Strava clubs. Basically someone picks 5 stages and you're free to ride each as many times as you like throughout the month then at the end of the month each riders best stage times are added up.
Not exactly the fairest format as those closest to the trails tended be out doing millions of laps when conditions were prime. But that's Strava all over really. We all know fine who's the fastest in our riding groups.

 

[canadmos]

Stop watches at the top and bottom seem like the way to go. And then no one would miss out, as they'd be self serve basically.

Just assign a start time for everyone and then just have to make sure everyone writes down their finish time?

The zone4 app could work, but I think we'd need someone to do it for us - otherwise the phones could lock, the app could close or the bib numbers would get messed up.

 

[canadmos]

A few years back a local group of riders used to run a monthly Enduro using Strava clubs. Basically someone picks 5 stages and you're free to ride each as many times as you like throughout the month then at the end of the month each riders best stage times are added up.
Not exactly the fairest format as those closest to the trails tended be out doing millions of laps when conditions were prime. But that's Strava all over really. We all know fine who's the fastest in our riding groups.

I've asked if trailforks could do this.

They have it already built out basically, just need the features tied together.

They have badges that you can be rewarded, which you can specify that you ride specific trails, have it on specific days (or a range). And then they have leaderboards.

Just need to roll that into an event and tie it together. You could create a race and let everyone go do it whenever they can - then just calculate the results at the end of the date range.

 

[Gary]

With premium You can list Segment leaderboards on Strava by Club, friends, age etc.
so if you started a club and asked all the riders to join you could (I think) just look at each segment choosing this day, (Other options being this week. this month. this year, all time)
Dunno. Haven't used Strava for anything other than recording rides for mileage for years

I don't understand Trailforx. Never used it until I downloaded it and paid for a subscription last month hoping it'd put trails on my Garmin whiln over in Spain riding. But NOTHING showed up at all on the Gasrmin! Don't know if it was my own technologicasl illiteracy, Garmin settings or TF settings. Unsubscribed (refunded) and deleted.

 

[Full Trucker]

Stop watches at the top and bottom seem like the way to go. And then no one would miss out, as they'd be self serve basically.

Just assign a start time for everyone and then just have to make sure everyone writes down their finish time?

The zone4 app could work, but I think we'd need someone to do it for us - otherwise the phones could lock, the app could close or the bib numbers would get messed up.

Even with manual (stopwatch) timing, you really need a person dedicated to recording the start and finish times. I didn't mention, but the stopwatch method was always a pad of paper like @Gary was saying. Person with the stopwatch and a pad and pen up top, the same down below. We'd have columns that look like this at the start line:

Bib	Start Time	Finish Time	Penalty
123	11:27:00
67	11:28:00		+1
98	11:29:00

An then like this at the finish line:

Bib	Start Time	Finish Time	Penalty
98		11:33:36
123		11:34:14
67		11:36:54

The penalty was used by the starter to record if the rider jumped the gun by a second or whatever. You could do it a little more "self-serve" by assigning a start minute to each rider and then just trusting them to go on their start minute, but for anything remotely accurate you'd have to at least have someone at the bottom recording times.

Now, if you really don't care THAT much about accuracy, I suppose everyone could just record their times themselves at the bottom. But honestly, just use Strava segments for that as it'd be probably about as accurate. If everyone is on Strava, you can filter a segment to just the day's results, like Gary was saying. But the segment has to be the full length of your course and everyone has to be on Strava.

 

[Gary]

Thing with using GPS/Phones is it's really not accurate at all. Devices don't all have the same accuracy or position update timing. Some may update once a second whereas some may be as long a every 3 sec. Meaning you could have upto a 6sec discrepancy.
Plus in tight tree covered steep terrain it's just not accurate. add in wet weather and it's laughably inaccurate at times. And you can't assume a dedicated GPS like Garmin is any more accurate than some phones. Though having a device mounted on your bars will almost always be better than a phone in your pocket.

 

[Jm_]

Strava segments, hidden till the day of, logistics with multiple stages is crazy and strava makes it manageable on the cheap, need at least one person w/pro account. Honor system for not riding day of if necessary. Put it in a spreadsheet.

 

[Gary]

Don't bother with numberboards and numbers if it's your mates. Just use their names

 

[Full Trucker]

Don't bother with numberboards and numbers if it's your mates. Just use their names

Yeah, this for sure.

 

[canadmos]

Don't bother with numberboards and numbers if it's your mates. Just use their names

Someone has to get number 69 though.

Hmm yeah maybe strava segments would be better. I don't think anyone would volunteer to do timing, unless we swapped at the end or something.

I could make the segments and have them start and end after/before the trails start and finish, so as to not accidentally start timing while someone is waiting to go. And then just delete them after or make them private.

The timing part is just for fun, I think the real challenge will be making sure the bikes make it through to the last trail.

 

[Full Trucker]

Someone has to get number 69 though.

Was about to rescind my previous agreement about not using number plates... I mean it is racing so you should have a number! Go old school AF, white paper plates and sharpies. Everyone can pick their own number, maybe people will fight over the good ones like 69, 666, etc. but maybe that's part of the fun?

Hmm yeah maybe strava segments would be better. I don't think anyone would volunteer to do timing, unless we swapped at the end or something.

You could do some swapping, like the finish line guy records the first few riders that come down, and then the first guy down swaps in to take over so the timer can go get their run or whatever. Though to be honest, you might be surprised and actually find someone that likes the idea but doesn't wanna race. I'm one of those people, I dig the culture of racing (and used to race) but kinda figured out that I don't like the actual race run part of it. I still volunteer with my local enduro series, sometimes as a timer.

 

[Jm_]

Don't bother with numberboards and numbers if it's your mates. Just make up names for them.

Fixed

 

[Gary]

Hmm yeah maybe strava segments would be better. I don't think anyone would volunteer to do timing, unless we swapped at the end or something.

We had non riders do it. either girlfriends of a rider or an injured rider

 

[SuspectDevice]

As someone who gets paid a few thousand dollars every year to time races:
you need to make a start list, use some plates, have dedicated top and bottom timing person.
You can do it on a shared google sheet with laptops top and bottom, too. That’s how all the free races at Kanuga and Windrock are prosecuted.

 

[Full Trucker]

prosecuted

 

[toodles]

Fixed

The Trans Enduros let riders choose what nickname they want on their plates. Our rules is we're not allowed to pick our own nickname and the crew gets to do it.


The Shithouse bikes Stravaduro we run here is like that with the cheap bikes and timed on Strava. You'll find the bikes will give bigger margins than the Strava accuracy issues anyway so its hardly a factor. After 25 mins of stages on cheap bikes the gaps are unlikely to be milliseconds. Its going to be a battle of attrition more than an actual race. Cheap bikes are fucken flimsy

 

[Gary]

@canadmos upcoming race has already had moar attention than the entire 2024 EWS or whateverthefucktheycalledit

 

[toodles]

@canadmos upcoming race has already had moar attention than the entire 2024 EWS or whateverthefucktheycalledit

It already sounds better organised, less elitist and will - fingers crossed - have better coverage

 

[6thElement]

Anyone know what streaming platform we need to be subscribed to?

 

[toodles]

Anyone know what streaming platform we need to be subscribed to?

Funniest Home Videos

 

[bullcrew]

Don't bother with numberboards and numbers if it's your mates. Just use their names

Nope...you have the skins with sharpie marker numbers on chest and back

 

[canadmos]

The Trans Enduros let riders choose what nickname they want on their plates. Our rules is we're not allowed to pick our own nickname and the crew gets to do it.


The Shithouse bikes Stravaduro we run here is like that with the cheap bikes and timed on Strava. You'll find the bikes will give bigger margins than the Strava accuracy issues anyway so its hardly a factor. After 25 mins of stages on cheap bikes the gaps are unlikely to be milliseconds. Its going to be a battle of attrition more than an actual race. Cheap bikes are fucken flimsy

25 mins of racing....I wish.

This will be 10 minutes of timed stuff...tops. maybe more if we add more descents.

@Full Trucker paper plate numbers is genius. Will do.

 

[toodles]

25 mins of racing....I wish.

This will be 10 minutes of timed stuff...tops. maybe more if we add more descents.

What kinda bikes are you expecting to get? You can have a pretty awesome time using kids bikes or even your own DJ bikes and some cones for a slalom on a (preferrably wet) grassy hill.

If you're using mega cheap MTBs, just be wary - they fail so drastically it can be a surprisingly spicy event once the beers slow the reflexes haha.

 

[canadmos]

What kinda bikes are you expecting to get? You can have a pretty awesome time using kids bikes or even your own DJ bikes and some cones for a slalom on a (preferrably wet) grassy hill.

If you're using mega cheap MTBs, just be wary - they fail so drastically it can be a surprisingly spicy event once the beers slow the reflexes haha.

I mean i expect to get department store type bikes. Aka, whatever Walmart sells.

Our trails are, for this, luckily not very rocky or anything. It'll just be the few steeps that I expect will keep is very spicy.

But low risk all around... I mean this is Ontario after all. And not even the good part of Ontario, Ala @slyfink 's hometown.

 

[jrewing]

Ha!
Was thinking of doing an underground race series for beers, and Redbulls for the underaged. Winner and a couple random finishes spots win prizes, announced before the race…that way fast guy gets it and the rest, anyone has a chance. Maybe a block of chocolate for last.
So 2 stop watches? Done. Im pumped for the underground Nth Tassie DH no club needed champs….seeing as no club will put it on any Gravity racing. ill do one! Screw legalisties, deny everything.
Coin donation entry because maintaining a couple kilometre DH track myself and my imagination is hard work and fuel.
Already got a couple keen to help do it.
BBQ on the Saturday arvo, sausage sangas and beer.
Like WayneStock… Oh it will happen!
Toodles, you in?

 

[6thElement]

Anyone got a link to the fantasy team website?

 

[shirk007]

Set start times and a person at the end with a phone writing down finish times.

I have not seen mention of it yet... mandatory beer shot gun at the end of the race and your time doesn't end till the can is empty. Spill too much beer and you get penalty time added. You gotta back up fast riding with a fast chug to win a true Shit bike race.

 

[toodles]

Winner and a couple random finishes spots win prizes, announced before the race…that way fast guy gets it and the rest, anyone has a chance. Maybe a block of chocolate for last.

The CX boys do a "mid-pack 6 pack" award for whoever gets the exact middle spot in the field which is quite fun.

Toodles, you in?

You in Hobart? I'm heading down November and again next year. Keen to make up the numbers like a dodgy accountant.

 

[jrewing]

The CX boys do a "mid-pack 6 pack" award for whoever gets the exact middle spot in the field which is quite fun.



You in Hobart? I'm heading down November and again next year. Keen to make up the numbers like a dodgy accountant.

Nah Launny unfortunately. But my season maydena pass came through, so im going to hangin round like an old bar fly down there.
The 3 guys at max who were doing the bass highway upgrades finally finished after 3 yrs, so its an easy drive up/down now.
November, is that for enduro jam?

 

[jrewing]

Set start times and a person at the end with a phone writing down finish times.

I have not seen mention of it yet... mandatory beer shot gun at the end of the race and your time doesn't end till the can is empty. Spill too much beer and you get penalty time added. You gotta back up fast riding with a fast chug to win a true Shit bike race.

I like this!

 

[toodles]

Set start times and a person at the end with a phone writing down finish times.

I have not seen mention of it yet... mandatory beer shot gun at the end of the race and your time doesn't end till the can is empty. Spill too much beer and you get penalty time added. You gotta back up fast riding with a fast chug to win a true Shit bike race.

Making people swap bikes is fun too and stops people from trying to sneak through with a legit bike in a shit bike race.

Nah Launny unfortunately. But my season maydena pass came through, so im going to hangin round like an old bar fly down there.
The 3 guys at max who were doing the bass highway upgrades finally finished after 3 yrs, so its an easy drive up/down now.
November, is that for enduro jam?

Christ thats good to hear. I drove the rental back after Trans Tassie last year and the highway was painful with roadworks. Torn between racing the Jam again this year (last year was wicked fun, but its expensive for a throwaway event) and just going down for a weekend of Soho and Maydena laps. I'm probably gonna be volunteering/marshalling Trans Tassie next March as well, so might tack on a few days for shenanigans.

 

[HardtailHack]

I have nothing useful to add, but we did some push run races many years back and on the shortest track you had to chug a beer at the end of your run to stop the clock.

The chief stoner got the win because he chugged the whole beer without having to take a breath, it was impressive.

 

[jrewing]

Making people swap bikes is fun too and stops people from trying to sneak through with a legit bike in a shit bike race.



Christ thats good to hear. I drove the rental back after Trans Tassie last year and the highway was painful with roadworks. Torn between racing the Jam again this year (last year was wicked fun, but its expensive for a throwaway event) and just going down for a weekend of Soho and Maydena laps. I'm probably gonna be volunteering/marshalling Trans Tassie next March as well, so might tack on a few days for shenanigans.

Yeah keep us in the loop. The season pass gets half price race events so that sold me, as its 1199. Supposedly itll work in their other parks… well bright so far when that happens.
the gravfest to coincide with hardline is going to be overhauled so that could be a worthwhile event to attend keep in mind.