Toshi's thread
- Thread starter Toshi
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I always think in those terms when buying stuff, even clothes.
I have found leather soled italian shoes and diesel jeans (on sale) are marginally cheaper in the long run, vs department store alternatives... and that (new) high end mountain bikes are more expensive per hour/use than (lightly used) high-end sports cars.
A day late and a dollar short? I'm going to concentrate on his two most relevant examples to me, the vacation house and the choice of AWD:
Example 1: Mountain house.
Let's make up our own example here:
- $750k purchase price, 10% down, 4.5% mortgage, with the balance of the tax-bill $750k and my first mortgage's balance still being tax deductible
- 5% time value of money for that 10% down
- 5% appreciation rate on the property
- no maintenance but a $1k/mo condo fee
- rent out place 2 nights per week on average @ $250/night ex 10% fee
- 40 nights per year (20 weekends in winter, 10 in summer, doable) use, with no extra car trip costs accounted for since multiple daytrips would account for similar mileage if we didn't have such a place
The worst year will be the first due to the amortization schedule. In that year:
- $30,152 in interest, of which let's say half is tax deductible due to the principal cap
- $12k in condo fees
- $3,750 in lost gains @ 5% on the down payment
+ $37,500 in appreciation on the condo
+ $23,400 in rental income
So the net change in my bottom line would be +$20k/year due to appreciation, and this could be more positive if it were rented more. I'm ok with this over the long term, even if appreciation isn't a linear function year after year.
Example 2: AWD.
This one is kind of silly, because as evidenced by the Volvo I'm not picking vehicles based solely on utility vs price. $500 per year is chicken scratch compared to the relative costs of my whims, of which the dominant cost in most cases is depreciation. The rational choice in this case would be to pony up for a non-depreciating 993!
Please share your math for this one. I agree that bikes depreciate like stink if bought at/near retail, but their marginal cost per use is low. When I autocrossed I worked out at one point that I burned something like $20 of Kumho V710 per run.
give that I work in the auto industry, and bikes are expensive in south america (everything is at least US msrp +20% here), it works like that.
high end mtb. $6k. residual value after 2-3 years. $3k. Assuming 20 epic rides in 2-3 years (real average is lower):
$150 per use in depreciation.
$80, cost of shuttling for each day of epic shuttling to the andes,
$50 Basic bike service after use and provision for tires/reverb/fork/pads/drivetrain wear/service,
Thats about $280 per day of actual mountain biking in the andes, not counting the cost of dressing up (helmet, pads, shoes, et all). $130 direct/indirect costs associated to epic andes riding, and $150 in depreciation.
mtb Consumables are expensive and very short lived. Brake pads alone are $60-80 per set f+r, and can chew thru them in 35k ft of vertical (about 3 days worth of riding); good tires are $70 each.
I do not count quiet rides in the park as actual mt biking.
now cars..
thanks to bro deals, I pay about $700 per SET of high end rubber (p zero or pilot sport/sport cup 2). They last about 6-7k miles (with ~10 track days in between, plus some spirited drives in the mountains). $70 in tires per track day. (Retail in $1100 on those; or you can go for cheaper alternatives like Toyos or Zestinos to keep that number low)
Gas = $70 for 45 laps (which is an average track day of 3 15-lap sessions, which is about 70 miles), incluiding the 60 mi round trip to the racetrack from home.
brake pads = $400 set of original AMG pads (f+r), lasts as much as the tires. $40 per track day.
track fee = $110.
Total = $290 per track day (pro tip. always leave those last 1-2 seconds on the track. those are the most expensive by far. if trail-braking, that number can easily go +50%)
And thats pretty much assuming the car is used for nothing but track or canyon carving duties.
I normally drive 1000 miles of everyday driving for each track-day/epic mountain drive; so insurance (stupid cheap at $80/month full coverage for my AMG) and preventive service not included.
so far, running costs are pretty much equivalent; which brings us to the main point.
This. THE biggest difference is depreciation.
Do this, and depreciation will be zero or negative enough to offset running costs.
1) Buy a "sensible" (no 10 years old V10 BMWs, no ceramic brakes, no air suspension for instance) and healthy car at a good price (wait a few months, until one appears, and buy it the very same day), and 2) (equally important) do not keep the car long enough to face an expensive repair.
My latest toy, a garage-queen C63 was bought for a bit under $40k with 6k miles. It now has 12k miles. Will probably sell it before 20k miles. My anticipated expenses are 2 sets of brake pads and 2-3 sets of tires. Current market value is $42k. I expect market value to not reach my purchase price in at least a year.
Previous toys have been sold at purchase price or more. (Tommi Makinen Evo, rx7, camaro 68, etc), just a matter of timing, having the funds ready and picking the right car.
Am in no hurry to replace my C63; but if..... a mercedes SLS shows up for sale for under $80k, a dodge viper for $40k or a 997 GT3 for $45k (all possible in this market); I will jump ship.
No way to loose money on any of those. Heck, If I find an SLS for under $100K, I´ll wing it and buy it and keep it for my grandchildren. One sold for $110k 2 years ago; and we do not have the speculative bubbles you have in the US with "recent vintage" cars (yet).
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Gratuitious shot of latest (last saturday) epic drive to the Andes with some friends in Ducatis. The car is faster, btw.
Attachments
also, not using actual slicks helps a lot in keeping costs down.
besides being crazy expensive per mile; they turn the rims into wear items, and the extra grip will increase the wear to the suspension/steering/brake calipers. those extra 2 seconds per lap are a multiplier on costs.
I can wing a track day for under $300 in michelin sport cups 2 and stock AMG pads. 1:08 per lap at a fast pace, but not fast enough to break stuff.
A friend (on the same car) on hoosier r7s is 3 seconds per lap faster; braking 60-70ft later, and doing 1.2+g on corners vs my 1.13g. His running costs are probably twice, and resale on his car is shit. The calipers are all burnt, and the fenders knicked to hell and back (slicks do that); and has managed to crack rims.
Another guy, 1:03, on a 911 on hooosiers and ceramic brakes probably burns $1000 a day on track.
Another guy, 1:01 on a mclaren on hoosiers, probably blows $3000 a day.
Another guy just bought an actual Ginetta LMP3 last week (used to do 0:58 on an actual race-car Audi R8 LMS)... and I really have no clue on much those cost per day.
Track days depend on how much you want to spend, really. A $10k miata on cheap slicks, driven to pulp, does 1:09, by the same token.
besides being crazy expensive per mile; they turn the rims into wear items, and the extra grip will increase the wear to the suspension/steering/brake calipers. those extra 2 seconds per lap are a multiplier on costs.
I can wing a track day for under $300 in michelin sport cups 2 and stock AMG pads. 1:08 per lap at a fast pace, but not fast enough to break stuff.
A friend (on the same car) on hoosier r7s is 3 seconds per lap faster; braking 60-70ft later, and doing 1.2+g on corners vs my 1.13g. His running costs are probably twice, and resale on his car is shit. The calipers are all burnt, and the fenders knicked to hell and back (slicks do that); and has managed to crack rims.
Another guy, 1:03, on a 911 on hooosiers and ceramic brakes probably burns $1000 a day on track.
Another guy, 1:01 on a mclaren on hoosiers, probably blows $3000 a day.
Another guy just bought an actual Ginetta LMP3 last week (used to do 0:58 on an actual race-car Audi R8 LMS)... and I really have no clue on much those cost per day.
Track days depend on how much you want to spend, really. A $10k miata on cheap slicks, driven to pulp, does 1:09, by the same token.
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Not sure if Automobile magazine was sponsored by Porsche at the time of this video’s production:
(That’d be a 997 GTS.)
Also not sure on the black-only centerlocks. While the video is a nice demonstration of the practicality of the thing relative to its size, it also illustrates that can and should are distinct concepts.
Whenever I’m done with the Volvo (and it’s still verified by the DMV as not having its title paperwork complete as of yesterday) I should definitely eye vehicles with an eye for how they give me the fizz rather than whether they’re a good deal or highly pious or the like, but it needn’t be a 911 proper.
(That’d be a 997 GTS.)
Also not sure on the black-only centerlocks. While the video is a nice demonstration of the practicality of the thing relative to its size, it also illustrates that can and should are distinct concepts.
Whenever I’m done with the Volvo (and it’s still verified by the DMV as not having its title paperwork complete as of yesterday) I should definitely eye vehicles with an eye for how they give me the fizz rather than whether they’re a good deal or highly pious or the like, but it needn’t be a 911 proper.
I keep riding past a nice looking white 993 that's being left outside, makes me sad.
that's the shiz right there, IMO
Perhaps it’ll only be worth $74k instead of $75k as a 120k mile beater.
The Sony noise cancelling headphones for the family worked great (when not turning off randomly for one problematic pair) on the Dash 8 flight from Eugene to Seattle, for the record. Quite shocking how loud that plane is when headphones not on.
Which model do you have?
I like my Bose and need to get some for wifey at some point.
Sony WH-1000XM2.
So I’ve driven this Corvette a few times when visiting the parents, most recently this trip. It ate a 3 month old battery via a crappy unintelligent charger he kept it on and not being driven much at all. Anyway:My dad just emailed me out of the blue. I guess he's gone and bought a 2002 C5 Corvette.I didn't expect that, heh. Yellow, targa roof, 6 speed, black leather inside, and hopefully not a complete lemon like the last car he bought without my supervision...
2002 Corvette. Fastback, glass targa panel, 6 speed, bright fucking yellow over black leather.
Pros:
- rowing one’s own gears is fun
- great shove out of corners in 2nd gear accompanied by the soundtrack of ‘Murica
- novelty of being below most vehicles’ door handles
Cons:
- I’m limber albeit not slim and still feel like a goof getting into it +/- sitting right on the side bolster, and my paunchy, stiff dad looks at death’s door as he lowers himself into the driver’s seat
- while headroom is ok, per se, with that glass panel the windshield frame and sun visors intrudes on my field of view unless I slump, and over the shoulder views are similarly impeded
- long-ass gearing and long throw, imprecise shifter
- interior on the C5 has not aged well at all
I think he’s finally ready to sell the thing. It never gets driven anyway: 32k miles for a 2002.
Late life crisis machine?
Yeah. He bought it at the ripe old age of 64, I believe, which probably puts him right at the median age of Corvette drivers.
You should get it for crushing I70 on Friday evenings in January.
One of my dad’s toys with which I remain much more impressed is his upstairs hifi setup. Yamaha Aventage receiver driving a pair of DALI Euphonia MS5 speakers, the only source a CD/SACD player.
https://www.dali-speakers.com/discontinued/euphonia/dali-euphonia-ms5/
Those are some massive beasts. 8” x 2, 6.5”, dome and ribbon tweeters in each.
They sound fantastic, and I’m a harsh audio critic. (I did pick them out in the first place on a blind test, so my opinion isn’t news.) Great range, a wide soundstage, and detail galore without a hint of being harsh. I dig them.
I will end up with a similar setup myself one day. Given to be 3 kids and many other things higher on the priority list (student loans, funding 529s a bit more, that fabled Winter Park condo, getting ahead of one or two mortgages) it’ll be some years yet, but it’ll happen because the experience of sitting a dozen feet from them with Karita Mattila singing Strauss at full tilt is sublime.
https://www.dali-speakers.com/discontinued/euphonia/dali-euphonia-ms5/
Those are some massive beasts. 8” x 2, 6.5”, dome and ribbon tweeters in each.
They sound fantastic, and I’m a harsh audio critic. (I did pick them out in the first place on a blind test, so my opinion isn’t news.) Great range, a wide soundstage, and detail galore without a hint of being harsh. I dig them.
I will end up with a similar setup myself one day. Given to be 3 kids and many other things higher on the priority list (student loans, funding 529s a bit more, that fabled Winter Park condo, getting ahead of one or two mortgages) it’ll be some years yet, but it’ll happen because the experience of sitting a dozen feet from them with Karita Mattila singing Strauss at full tilt is sublime.
I am in my Dog The Bounty Hunter phase.
If I had F.U. money
http://www.rangertugs.com/models.aspx?itemid=2634&prodid=12355&pagetitle=31+Ranger+R31+Command+Bridge+2016 +
This should just go in the 'Campers' thread.
:ytho.gif:
Good for journeys up to the San Juans and fjords up in BC. In theory a sailboat would be better but the reality is winds are neither strong nor predictable enough for reliable journeys.
Aren’t there similarly comfortable powerboats that’d do it a whole lot faster?
Fast enough is plenty for a long distance cruiser. I like fast things but speed on open water is kind of pointless and noisy, at least on a power boat. Leaned over hard and doing 20 kts in a sailboat however is a blast,
You also will not be mistaken for coke dealer.
Do you still have to wear a captain's hat?
Westy favors a captain’s hat, a thong, and a wide smile for all who venture aboard.
As long as there is NO Jimmy Buffet, whatever floats his boat...
1) West Seattle Bridge to I-5 makes me very stabby. Such a poor design, inviting assholes to sneak in late/illegally. The I-90 collector/distributor is similarly a clusterfuck. Gah.
2) I test rode a Specialized Turbo Vado 5.0 from Gregg’s after not killing anyone in that traffic.
Pros:
- very quiet
- smooth assist, with comfortable cruising at 25 mph in the cards
- integrated look and practical, with lighting, fenders, rear rack all included
Cons:
- high, narrow handlebars (could be alleviated with fewer spacers and different bars)
- pedal and seat touchpoints also not to my liking
- feels sluggish at low speeds, exacerbated by the vastly different gearing to spin along at 25 mph and to push off from a start
Verdict: I’ll think about it a bit more yet, but such a thing would likely feel pretty good with some wider bars, Ergon grips, my usual WTB saddle...
2) I test rode a Specialized Turbo Vado 5.0 from Gregg’s after not killing anyone in that traffic.
Pros:
- very quiet
- smooth assist, with comfortable cruising at 25 mph in the cards
- integrated look and practical, with lighting, fenders, rear rack all included
Cons:
- high, narrow handlebars (could be alleviated with fewer spacers and different bars)
- pedal and seat touchpoints also not to my liking
- feels sluggish at low speeds, exacerbated by the vastly different gearing to spin along at 25 mph and to push off from a start
Verdict: I’ll think about it a bit more yet, but such a thing would likely feel pretty good with some wider bars, Ergon grips, my usual WTB saddle...
I could forcefully impose culture upon the masses.
I forgot to mention my random joy about driving here, which is not nearly enough to offset the gripe about traffic:
WA allows trucks to be up to 105,500 GVW as opposed to the usual 80,000 you see all over the place. To accommodate this the trucks have extra axles. Typically one might see a tractor with a steering axle, a pusher lift axle, tandem drive axles, and then a trailer set up to carry intermodal shipping containers with 4 axles each fitted with double wheels but only the outer set of tires on each.
:derp:
WA allows trucks to be up to 105,500 GVW as opposed to the usual 80,000 you see all over the place. To accommodate this the trucks have extra axles. Typically one might see a tractor with a steering axle, a pusher lift axle, tandem drive axles, and then a trailer set up to carry intermodal shipping containers with 4 axles each fitted with double wheels but only the outer set of tires on each.
:derp:
Stock is plastic pedals, 680 mm width 9 degree sweep bars, shitty grips and saddle, 11-42t cassette.
I’m thinking:
- no spacers under the stem!
- my existing XT touring half flat/half SPD pedals
- WTB Pure V under my butt
- a swept cockpit much as my 29er commuter was set up, with more sweep and a bit more width
- an 11-30 cassette to get those key 11-12-13-14-15 gears, as I found myself wishing for a 12t with the stock 11-13-15-17-19-21-24-28-32-37-42 spacing driven by a 48t chainring
- the 6.0 version rather than the 5.0 that I tested, as it has a 50 mm travel air fork that’d actually be nice with a hard to bunnyhop tank of a bike
I’ll wait to do this until after I complete the minivan transaction as I’ll need to bring cash to the table, but I think I’ll do it.
Re Alexis’s earlier point about the US being a regulatory mess with regard to autonomous cars:
https://jalopnik.com/audi-bails-on-traffic-jam-pilot-driver-assist-for-us-am-1827975491
Audi’s 37 mph and under hands off level 3 autonomous system is not coming to our shores.
https://jalopnik.com/audi-bails-on-traffic-jam-pilot-driver-assist-for-us-am-1827975491
Audi’s 37 mph and under hands off level 3 autonomous system is not coming to our shores.
A new project: watch through the Marvel cinematic universe in canonical order.
https://www.cnet.com/how-to/marvel-cinematic-universe-timeline-avengers/
Current status is halfway through Captain America: The First Avenger.
https://www.cnet.com/how-to/marvel-cinematic-universe-timeline-avengers/
Current status is halfway through Captain America: The First Avenger.
That's a phantom of an aorta and renal arteries, the left (image right) one with a fake stenosis via a rubber band.
Standard of care MR angio is simulated up top. What my modeling work predicts as optimal is simulated at bottom. Which would you rather have your radiologist looking at?