[syadasti]

pretty straightforward video on what the problem is:
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/01/29/video-in-depth-look-at-toyotas-sticky-accelerator/

So does that mean the pedal shaving and zip ties fixes were for nothing or is this in addition? I don't remember those fixes mentioning the bushing problem?

 

[IH8Rice]

So does that mean the pedal shaving and zip ties fixes were for nothing or is this in addition? I don't remember those fixes mentioning the bushing problem?

it doesnt appear so. that guy seems to know what he is talking about since he worked as a engineer for years, so they say.

i guess the pedal shaving has to do with the floor mats creeping up on the pedal, which was another recall by Toyota.

 

[syadasti]

i guess the pedal shaving has to do with the floor mats creeping up on the pedal, which was another recall by Toyota.

Yeah I knew it was the floor mats for those fixes. Didn't realize there were two gas pedal related recalls

 

[IH8Rice]

looks like they are doing the smart thing and taking care of the millions of customers with issues instead of future customers
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/01/30/throttlegate-toyota-will-now-send-needed-pedal-repair-component/

 

[Straya]

looks like they are doing the smart thing and taking care of the millions of customers with issues instead of future customers
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/01/30/throttlegate-toyota-will-now-send-needed-pedal-repair-component/

"Right now, Toyota's "solution" (reportedly involving shims) is being reviewed by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration"

I approve.

 

[Silver]

"Right now, Toyota's "solution" (reportedly involving shims) is being reviewed by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration"

I approve.

I wonder if the person at the NHTSA in charge of the case already has a job lined up at Toyota...

Or is that too cynical?

 

[Pesqueeb]

"Right now, Toyota's "solution" (reportedly involving shims) is being reviewed by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration"

I approve.

Duh. The solution is always MOAR SHIMZ!!!!

 

[syadasti]

The shims solution is nixed. Also mention of both recalls in bold:

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/02/01/toyotas-remedy-for-recalled-pedals-announced/
Toyota announced early this morning exactly how it's going to repair 2.3 million Toyota brand vehicles affected by its latest sticking accelerator pedal recall. The fix involves installing a "precision-cut steel reinforcement bar" into the pedal assembly that will reduce friction between a shoe and the adjoining surface, the place where Toyota has found these defective pedals to be sticking. The automaker says the fix is "effective and simple" – it should take around 30 minutes to perform – and has been rigorously tested on pedal assemblies that have been known to stick. Since words only paint so clear a picture, we'll be searching for more visual evidence today of how the repair works, so stay tuned.

In the meantime, Toyota says owners of vehicles affected by the sticking pedal recall can expect a letter by mail sometime in the next couple of days with instructions on how to coordinate their repair with a dealer. Dealers, meanwhile, will remain open extended hours to perform the repairs, some even 24 hours a day. And for those owners whose vehicles are affected by both the floormat recall and sticking pedal recall, Toyota will try to coordinate only one trip to the dealer for both fixes.

Follow the jump for Toyota's official statement as well as a video released today in which Toyota Motor Sales President and COO Jim Lentz expresses some heart felt apologies to current customers.

 

[IH8Rice]

precision cut steel? lol

 

[syadasti]

precision cut steel? lol

This time they used a ruler for the recall fix.

 

[IH8Rice]

This time they used a ruler for the recall fix.

god forbid some hack mechanic mis-cuts it by 1-2mm's and someone else gets hurts

 

[syadasti]

The Toyota house of cards is falling. Woz is also claiming the Prius has a software related acceleration problem:

Toyota admits Prius had a braking problem

Toyota has received a lot of negative publicity for its sticking accelerator pedal and floormat recalls, and now brake problems with the Prius can be officially added to the list. While there were reports of some serious concern about the brakes in the best-selling hybrid, Toyota has now admitted that there are indeed known problems with the car's anti-lock braking system.

A Toyota spokesperson said on Thursday that Prius models sold before the end of January have this brake system design problem, but that the problem has been corrected on models sold since then, according to the Associated Press. The announcement follows Japanese and U.S. officials ordering the company yesterday to investigate around 180 claims of braking problems in the 2010 Prius.

The Japanese automaker's explanation for what causes the braking issue seems right in line with the possible explanation we posited yesterday. Long story short, the Prius has both a regenerative and friction braking system, and can apparently experience a short, temporary loss of braking during the transition between the two on slick or bumpy surfaces. Toyota calls it a "slight unresponsiveness" and it usually lasts under a second.

While 2004–2009 Prius models are included in Toyota's floormat recall and none are affected by the sticking accelerator pedal recall, the new third-generation model had remained above the fray completely until yesterday. And while a recall to fix the brake issue on these models has not been announced yet, it is being considered.

UPDATE: The U.S. Transportation Department has opened an investigation into brake problems with the 2010 Toyota Prius after the company admitted it knew of the problem earlier this morning.

Read more at The New York Times

 

[IH8Rice]

heres the fix:
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/02/04/toyota-dealer-shows-us-fix-for-sticking-accelerator-pedals/

 

[jonKranked]

Duh. The solution is always MOAR SHIMZ!!!!

 

[IH8Rice]

pretty straight forward fix.

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/02/04/fixing-toyotas-recalled-pedals-the-video-starring-doug-the-mas/

 

[syadasti]

These types of incidents will only get worse now that the Supreme Court ruled that government by the corporations for the corporations is acceptable:

Report: After NHTSA investigator hired by Toyota, serious unintended acceleration cases ignored
by Chris Shunk on Feb 5th, 2010 at 11:28AM

The more we learn about Toyota's rumored relationship with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, the less we like it. Remember the claim that the government agency may have known about unintended acceleration issues as early as 2004? ABC News does, and the news network has been doing its best Sherlock Holmes work in an effort to learn more about the potentially damaging claims.

The ABC News investigation revealed that NHTSA wrote a memorandum limiting unintended acceleration claims to episodes lasting two seconds or less when the brake was never applied. The report states that the memorandum came down after agency representative Scott Yon met with two former colleagues (including Chris Santucci) who left the government to work for Toyota. Santucci testified back in December that the limited scope of investigations "worked out well for both the agency and Toyota."

Also in question is whether federal safety investigators are included in a federal law that states that "an employee in the executive branch is barred for two years after leaving government service from representing any matter under the employee's previous official responsibility." Santucci left his job at NHTSA six months before he reportedly negotiated the terms of the investigation with his ex-colleagues.

According to ABC News, the limited scope of the investigations ruled out 26 of the original 37 claims of unintended acceleration. A reported 25 of those 26 incidents led to an accident or crash, and since those incidents were outside of the scope of the investigations, NHTSA never looked into the incidents. Sean Kane of Safety Research & Strategies told ABC News that the narrow scope of the investigation meant "NHTSA almost ensured they wouldn't have enough complaint data to take action."

The extremely limited and nonsensical scope of the investigations between 2004 and 2007 continually failed to show any failures, and Toyota routinely pointed that out when the subject was brought up even in the weeks that led to the original recall of 3.8 million floor mats in the fall of 2009. In fact, ABC News claims that a document provided by Toyota to NHTSA stated that the Japanese automaker would not even submit a report to the government "in which the customer alleged that they could not control a vehicle by applying the brake."

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/02/05/report-after-nhtsa-investigator-hired-by-toyota-serious-uninte/

 

[syadasti]

Cannot be more clear...These types of incidents will only get worse now that the Supreme Court ruled that government by the corporations for the corporations is acceptable:

AP: Lawmakers investigating Toyota have previous ties to the automaker
It looks like the Toyota recall mess is going to keep getting messier. Today we're hearing that there might be some, let's say, inappropriate ties between the Japanese automaker and the lawmakers that have been investigating its recent round of recalls. The Associated Press reports that the group of investigators includes "a senator who was so eager to lure the Japanese automaker to his state that he tramped along through fields as its executives scouted plant sites, and a congresswoman who owes much of her wealth to a Toyota supplier."

Several other members of the congressional committees on the case are said to represent states that host Toyota manufacturing facilities as well, an obvious conflict of interest when you think of the possibility that sanctions against Toyota could jeopardize constituent jobs. It's certainly not hard to understand why some people might question their objectivity.

As if that weren't bad enough, one of Toyota's executives is reported to be a former worker at one of those federal agencies that's supposed to be keeping an eye on the automaker. Lead Toyota investigator in the Senate, West Virginia Democrat Jay Rockefeller, goes so far as to say he felt like part of the selection committee when Toyota chose the site for its plant in Buffalo, West Virginia. And yet Rockefeller apparently thinks it's fine to stay on the committee.

On the House side of Congress, the investigating panel includes California Rep. Jane Harman, who happens to host Toyota's U.S. headquarters in her district. Harman and her husband, Sidney, also reportedly own at least $115,000 in Toyota stock. Harman International Industries, a company founded by Sidney Harman, also sells audio and entertainment systems to Toyota, and has earned millions in the process.

The ties to Toyota fall on both sides of the aisle as well, so neither party is likely to point fingers any time soon. We'll keep an eye on this part of the Toyota case, just like the rest of the story, as it continues to develop.

 

[syadasti]

More on Toyota's quality products:

Toyota Corolla reportedly suffering from steering woes
Will it ever stop? Yo, we don't know. And yes, we're quoting Vanilla Ice because... well, at this point in the never ending Toyota tale of woe, why not? Anyhow, there have been 83 complaints about the power steering systems in 2009 and 2010 Toyota Corollas, most of which are claiming that the car will veer to the right or left at speeds over 40 mph. Coincidently, the Corolla is one of the eight Toyota models affected by the production and sales stoppage. The alleged problems have purportedly caused 10 accidents and six injuries. Here's the gist:

Complainants have compared the movement to being buffeted by strong winds, sliding on black ice, or hydroplaning. They said that after trying to straighten the car, it can overcorrect -- requiring the driver to use a tight, persistent, two-handed grip on the wheel to travel in a straight line.

...

Our friends at AOL Autos have also been reporting on this breaking story, and have discovered this:

" notice the steeering wheel sometimes pulses only when my cell phone is...docked to the right of the steering wheel," wrote one Corolla driver in an official complaint on June 26, 2009. "It's strange I can sometimes tell if my Blackberry is going to ring or get an email. The steering wheel seems to shake or try to steer on its own. This is similar to my other 2009 Toyota Corolla that I resold to the dealer. I wonder if more shielding is needed to reduce any interference."

 

[syadasti]

Oh and even more models recalled globally:

In what is perhaps our least surprising announcement of the young day, Toyota has officially announced that it will recall 2010 model Prius and Lexus HS250h models globally along with the Toyota Sai in Japan to fix an issue the performance of their braking systems. The latest in a series of safety related problems with Toyotas became public fodder last week when Toyota acknowledged that customers of the third generation hybrid had complained of a loss of stopping power at low speeds.

Toyota has also acknowledged that it has developed a software update to improve the blending of the regenerative and friction braking systems and implemented the update into new production models sometime in January. The automaker did not, however, order a recall of vehicles in customer hands until more than a week after reports of the issue turned up in the media.

The Prius, Prius PHEV, HS250h and Sai (a Toyota badged version of the Prius sold only in Japan) are all being recalled for the software bug fix. In total about 400,000 vehicles are involved in this recall. First- and second-generation Priuses are not included since they have a different braking system, although there are concerns that there could be performance issues with those vehicles, too.

In the same release, Toyota has also announced that it will recall about 7,300 2010 model Camry sedans to inspect a power steering hose that may sit to close to a brake hose and cause it to wear through. Official press release after the jump.

 

[Silver]

Cannot be more clear...These types of incidents will only get worse now that the Supreme Court ruled that government by the corporations for the corporations is acceptable:

It's been acceptable for a long time.

It's just explicit now...

 

[syadasti]

It's been acceptable for a long time.

It's just explicit now...

Yes but until recently there had been steps towards reform.

 

[MMike]

Wow....Toyota is the victim of one seriously vicious smear campaign.

I'd be willing to bet that EVERY company out there is s bad or worse than Toyota. Honda GM Ford Volkswagen....you think the US automakers are not in WORSE shape with "hidden defects"?

Anyone remember the "runaway Audi 5000's of the '80's? They never fixed those either. always driver error.It happenend to one of my neighbours when I was a kid. Totaled his car in his front yard

Toyota is still one of the best engineering/manufacturing companies in the world. It's just that their dirty laundry is out in the open.

 

[syadasti]

Wow....Toyota is the victim of one seriously vicious smear campaign.

Wrong - this is a real, long term, on-going problem and was brought to light by a Japanese reporter for the WSJ back in 2006. They became the Japanese GM:

http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2333519&postcount=11

 

[MMike]

Wrong - this is a real, long term, on-going problem and was brought to light by a Japanese reporter for the WSJ back in 2006. They became the Japanese GM:

http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2333519&postcount=11

I don't believe any company is any different. They have a proven track record of high-quality, safe, reliable cars. This fact did not just evaporate in the last two weeks.

 

[syadasti]

The Washington Post - Opinion Column
By Akio Toyoda (President of Toyota Motor Co.)
Tuesday, February 9, 2010

When consumers purchase a Toyota, they are not simply purchasing a car, truck or van. They are placing their trust in our company. The past few weeks, however, have made clear that Toyota has not lived up to the high standards we set for ourselves. More important, we have not lived up to the high standards you have come to expect from us. I am deeply disappointed by that and apologize. As the president of Toyota, I take personal responsibility. That is why I am personally leading the effort to restore trust in our word and in our products.

For much of Toyota's history, we have ensured the quality and reliability of our vehicles by placing a device called an andon cord on every production line -- and empowering any team member to halt production if there's an assembly problem. Only when the problem is resolved does the line begin to move again.

Two weeks ago, I pulled the andon cord for our company. I ordered production of eight models in five plants across North America temporarily stopped so that we could focus on fixing our customers' vehicles that might be affected by sticking accelerator pedals. Today, Toyota team members and dealers across North America are working around the clock to repair all recalled vehicles.

But to regain the trust of American drivers and their families, more is needed. We are taking responsibility for our mistakes, learning from them and acting immediately to address the concerns of consumers and independent government regulators.

First, I have launched a top-to-bottom review of our global operations to ensure that problems of this magnitude do not happen again and that we not only meet but exceed the high safety standards that have defined our long history. As part of this, we will establish an Automotive Center of Quality Excellence in the United States, where a team of our top engineers will focus on strengthening our quality management and quality control across North America.

Second, to ensure that our quality-control operations are in line with best industry practices, we will ask a blue-ribbon safety advisory group composed of respected outside experts in quality management to independently review our operations and make sure that we have eliminated any deficiencies in our processes. The findings of these experts will be made available to the public, as will Toyota's responses to these findings.

Third, we fully understand that we need to more aggressively investigate complaints we hear directly from consumers and move more quickly to address any safety issues we identify. That is what we are doing by addressing customer concerns about the Prius and Lexus HS250h anti-lock brake systems.

We also are putting in place steps to do a better job within Toyota of sharing important quality and safety information across our global operations. This shortcoming contributed to the current situation. With respect to sticking accelerator pedals, we failed to connect the dots between problems in Europe and problems in the United States because the European situation related primarily to right-hand-drive vehicles.

Toyota will increase its outreach to government agencies charged with protecting the safety of motorists and passengers. I have spoken with U.S. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood and given him my personal assurance that lines of communications with safety agencies and regulators will be kept open, that we will communicate more frequently and that we will be more vigilant in responding to those officials on all matters.

In recent years, much has been written about what we call "the Toyota Way" -- the values and principles at the heart of our company. Chief among these is our unwavering commitment to continuous improvement: going to the source of a problem and fixing it. While problems with our cars have been rare over the years, the issues that Toyota is addressing today are by far the most serious we have ever faced.

But great companies learn from their mistakes, and we know that we have to win back the trust of our customers by adhering to the very values on which that trust was first built. The hundreds of thousands of men and women at Toyota operations worldwide -- including the 172,000 team members and dealers in North America -- are among the best in the auto industry. Whatever problems have occurred within our company, the strength and commitment to fix them resides within our company as well.

You have my commitment that Toyota will revitalize the simple but powerful principle that has guided us for 50 years: Toyota will build the highest-quality, safest and most reliable automobiles in the world.

The writer is president of Toyota Motor Co.

 

[MMike]

I ain't reading it. too long.

Toyota is still a better company that most manufacturers.

 

[syadasti]

I don't believe any company is any different. They have a proven track record of high-quality, safe, reliable cars. This fact did not just evaporate in the last two weeks.

No what happened was herd mentality on the part of consumers - perception though marketing and group think versus reality. People were lead to believe based on Toyota's past reputation and the company's policy of favoring hidden service campaigns (rather than public recalls like most other brands) that their products were still higher quality while domestic and European brands, despite big strides in quality, were always thought as inferior. Despite the true difference not being as notable anymore people looked for flaws in the competitors and overlooked those in Toyota's which grew unchecked as they expanded too fast. This just highlights the reality of the situation - companies change and Toyota's quality isn't a clear distinction anymore and they've failed to keep up their standards as they grew and their product and customers have suffered.

 

[MMike]

still too long

 

[Pesqueeb]

I'd be willing to bet that EVERY company out there is s bad or worse than Toyota. Honda GM Ford Volkswagen....you think the US automakers are not in WORSE shape with "hidden defects"?

We were having this discussion the other day at work. The example we and I always use is Ford. They had a whole bunch of models that had defective ECU's back from the late 80's to mid 90's. I drove one. Car would just die randomly driving down the road. No power steering or brakes etc. Thats not dangerous at all Then there were a whole series of transmissions that would shell out at 60000 miles. Then there is the turd of the 6.7l diesel engine on the "super duty" trucks. Complete f-ing junk. My employer spent over $10000 on our 05 work truck last year alone, with another 1500 spent so far this year just trying to keep it on the road (ramp).
My co-worker has a theory that people just expect American cars to be sh*t because they've been sh*tty for so long that they just put up with it, where as the expectation when you buy Japanese is for immaculate perfection. So it seems like a big shock to realize that something can go wrong with a Japanese car, even if in reality they are still way better built and safer than a US product.

 

[IH8Rice]

 

[loco-gringo]

Yup - Ford wanted to save a buck and use the cheap half-assed shortcut:

I really recall seeing every one of these that was crashed having the right rear tire gone. I always figured it was an alignment issue that Firestone took the fall for. I buy Firestone tires now, myself.

 

[splat]

I really recall seeing every one of these that was crashed having the right rear tire gone. I always figured it was an alignment issue that Firestone took the fall for. I buy Firestone tires now, myself.

Yes but was that for the Wifes Car ?

 

[syadasti]

Big oil hose recall to prevent engine damage/failure - Toyota claims its not a recall (silent recalls were Toyota's signature recall method prior to the pedal issues)

Toyota to replace oil hose on 933,800 vehicles
Company not issuing recall, says that defect isn’t a safety issue

updated 3:55 p.m. ET, Mon., March. 1, 2010

DETROIT - Toyota Motor Corp will replace an oil hose in some 933,800 vehicles in the United States due to the risk of a potential leak that if left untreated could damage the engine, the automaker said on Monday.

On some Camry, Avalon, Rav4 and Lexus vehicles equipped with V6 engines, the rubber portion of the engine oil hose may develop a small hole, potentially causing oil leakage and engine failure, Toyota said in a document sent out to U.S. dealers and obtained by Reuters on Monday.

Toyota spokesman Brian Lyons confirmed the company had sent the document on a "limited service campaign" to U.S. dealers. He added the oil hose issue is not a safety issue and the vehicles are not being recalled.

Lyons said a leak would likely be noticed by drivers as an oil puddle beneath a vehicle.

The service campaign covers 2007-2010 model year Camry, 2005-2009 Avalon, 2006-2009 Rav4, 2007-2008 Lexus ES 350 and 2007-2009 RX 350 vehicles.

Owners of the vehicles can have the oil hose fixed at Toyota dealerships at no charge under a safety campaign that will run until March 31, 2013.
Copyright 2010 Reuters.

 

[IH8Rice]

at least GM manned up with their recent recall of 1.3mil car and actually called it a recall

 

[IH8Rice]

i knew after watching that horrible ABC report on the "unintended acceleration" was total BS

It appears that an editor or producer at ABC felt they could pull a fast one on the audience and used some B-roll in the report showing the tachometer needle sweeping rapidly from near idle to over 6,000 rpm. That clip was injected at the precise moment when David Gilbert triggered his simulated sudden acceleration. As you can see from the screen cap above, the shot of the tachometer clearly shows the warning lights for the parking brake on, the doors open and the transmission indicator in park. The camera operator shot this segment separately so it could be used to illustrate a point in the report, and ABC claims that getting a steady shot during the test would've been both difficult and dangerous.

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/03/08/report-abc-news-faked-at-least-one-part-of-runaway-toyota-repor/

 

[IH8Rice]

more egg on ABC's face...

In a video webcast for the media that concluded a just a few moments ago, Toyota hit back at the "simulated unintended acceleration" demonstration that was shown by ABC News late last month. When we saw the original report, we postulated that the condition Gilbert produced may not be representative of a scenario that can actually happen in the real world, and judging by Toyota's findings, we were right.

As reported on Friday, Toyota went to an independent testing firm called Exponent to attempt to replicate the results from the Gilbert study. Dr. Shukri J. Souri of Exponent acknowledged that Gilbert did indeed create a scenario that produced what looked like a valid accelerator pedal signal to the electronic engine management system. But before demonstrating how the test was performed, Souri explained how the pedal sensor wiring works and showed how the connector is constructed. As we expected, Gilbert's testing methods and ABC News' report are very much in question

During the webcast, Toyota and Exponent demonstrated the same scenario on a Ford Fusion, BMW 325i and Subaru Legacy (they also had a host of other vehicles on hand) and each vehicle replicated the racing engine condition without signaling a fault code, although each one required a different resistance value. Like pretty much every modern vehicle available, these vehicles use a similar type of gas pedal architecture.

So what does this all prove? First, it demonstrates that with a bit of re-engineering of the pedal circuit, any engine can be made to race independently of what the driver commands with their foot. David Gilbert was able to modify the Toyota pedal sensor circuit to make this happen within the parameters that the fault diagnosis system was expecting so that no fault was detected.

What it doesn't prove is that Gilbert's scenario is a possible cause of the issues that drivers have seen. In fact, based on how this test was conducted, it's almost impossible that this is the cause of Toyota's unintended acceleration woes.

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/03/08/toyota-hits-back-at-david-gilberts-no-fault-code-demonstratio/

 

[4xBoy]

So what is the bet they can't find anything wrong with the Prius that the 61 year old was driving.

 

[MMike]

What's the betting that the attention whore who pulled the balloon boy stunt also ends up with a mysterious sticking gas pedal?

(Actually he was probably kicking himself when he heard about this one that he didn't think of it first)

 

[IH8Rice]

So what is the bet they can't find anything wrong with the Prius that the 61 year old was driving.

id put money on that. he said in his interview that he wouldnt drive and talk on the phone, who's to say that he wasnt hitting the gas and the brake.

they are actually putting new software in the cars to make them go to neutral if the gas and brake are hit.

 

[syadasti]

they are actually putting new software in the cars to make them go to neutral if the gas and brake are hit.

Only new for Toyota - other brands already have had this safety feature in production for many years now.