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Trek ore Specialized

Burud

Chimp
Jun 12, 2012
2
0
So, I'm coming from a Ghost DH 2011. And going to upgrade.
The reason to upgrade is: I ride where its a lot of roots, rock gardens. The ghost dos'nt like that kind of terrain weary well.

The choises i got is: DEMO 8 II ore Trek Session 88 .
 

Carraig042

me 1st
Apr 5, 2011
663
302
East Tennessee
I own a 2011 Demo, but I think I would go with a Session for that type of terrain. I rode a buddy's Session and it felt better than my demo in that rough stuff. Felt like it just floated through it.

Any reason you narrowed your search to just those two bikes? Consider any others?

-Brett
 
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troy

Monkey
Dec 3, 2008
910
547
Are You sure that it's frame fault and not Your damper setup? Kinda hard to believe that high pivot/very reward axle path frame handles roots/rock gardens and stuff poorly... How much You weight and what springrate and damper do You run?
 

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
10,768
1,121
Warsaw :/
I'm with Troy on that. Both frames you mention have a very small rearward component and are not really bikes that excell in the rough.
 

William42

fork ways
Jul 31, 2007
3,799
507
Because leverage rate, chainstay length, and geometry don't make any difference when it comes to excelling in the rough. If it doesn't have at least 8 inches of rearward travel, its not even worth looking at because it can't handle the rough.
 

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
10,768
1,121
Warsaw :/
Because leverage rate, chainstay length, and geometry don't make any difference when it comes to excelling in the rough. If it doesn't have at least 8 inches of rearward travel, its not even worth looking at because it can't handle the rough.
Ehhh yeah it's a reason to get offended. You ride it so you know the session 8 is not a plow bike. Yes other features also influence behaviour in the rough but Session does not plow through the rough. You know it well, hell even trek aknowledged it with changing their leverage for the 9.9 but ok next time I will write a 10 page explanation why both of them are not good in the rough. Session 8 is fairly progressive, not very long and not very rearward. I've tried riding one, I ridden behind one and while it's a very nice bike the rear wheel skips over the rough more than sticks to it.
 

Mo(n)arch

Turbo Monkey
Dec 27, 2010
4,404
1,377
Italy/south Tyrol
WWGD

What would Gwin do?
Longer front end.:D




Short chainstays (demo) and low pivot points are not attributes that ride and track well in really rough terrain.
Two attributes the demo and the Session (minus chainstays) have.
Then there is the leverage ratio which plays also a big role. High leverage ratios and excessive progressivenes don't shine in the rough as well.

Let's think about the Ghost frame:
High pivot point and long chainstays.
If the leverage curve is somewhat linear, that thing RIPS rough terrain for sure.
 
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William42

fork ways
Jul 31, 2007
3,799
507
Ehhh yeah it's a reason to get offended. You ride it so you know the session 8 is not a plow bike. Yes other features also influence behaviour in the rough but Session does not plow through the rough. You know it well, hell even trek aknowledged it with changing their leverage for the 9.9 but ok next time I will write a 10 page explanation why both of them are not good in the rough. Session 8 is fairly progressive, not very long and not very rearward. I've tried riding one, I ridden behind one and while it's a very nice bike the rear wheel skips over the rough more than sticks to it.
Actually I'm on a v10 right now for the record. I just think the session was perfectly fine in any sort of rough.
 

dcamp29

Monkey
Feb 14, 2004
589
62
Colorado
..... You know it well, hell even trek aknowledged it with changing their leverage for the 9.9 .....
All the Sessions have the same leverage rate now... the carbon frame was the first with the new leverage curves, but all the session frames have the same geo/leverage/etc (been that way for 2 years maybe?).

Yes it was changed to be more plowy than the original session 88. Obviously it is not the most plowy bike, but it gets through rocks ok.
 

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
10,768
1,121
Warsaw :/
All the Sessions have the same leverage rate now... the carbon frame was the first with the new leverage curves, but all the session frames have the same geo/leverage/etc (been that way for 2 years maybe?).

Yes it was changed to be more plowy than the original session 88. Obviously it is not the most plowy bike, but it gets through rocks ok.
No one says it doesn't, it's a good bike. I'd like it over a demo. It's just a stange idea to go from a Ghost to a Session if you want MORE plowy.
 
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bizutch

Delicate CUSTOM flower
Dec 11, 2001
15,915
21
Over your shoulder whispering
Which year model are you looking at? I've seen multiple snapped chainstays on Session's. Trek warrantied the two of the people I knew personally, but they were either the original owner or able to go through the original owner.

I have to assume this would be a big deal for you to have to go through...