[N8 v2.0]

Who's gonna stomp some hippy-wannabe's this weekend?

http://www.unitedforpeace.org/


More: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=ft.+bragg+protest+antiwar

 

[manimal]

ha, i saw that flyer at school last week. (i attend one of the most liberal "quaker...read: religious passifists" schools in the region. i took a few of them into class w/ me and ...uh....improved them they didn't have a very big turnout from my school due to the freak snow/slush storm that hit that morning......fine by me!

"we're showing support for the troops by demanding that they return from this costly wwar...." friggin BS!!! no soldier over there wants to hear that what they're doing isn't ok, it's the same damn thing as jane fonda during vietnam, only the scapegoat and tactics have changed....the effect is the same on our fighting soldiers.

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

no soldier over there wants to hear that what they're doing isn't ok,

isnt a soldier supposed not to think, and just execute orders???

why would, within the military school of thought, care if they are doing "right" or "wrong"... if after all the only "right" for them is the superiors command?

 

[Silver]

isnt a soldier supposed not to think, and just execute orders???

why would, within the military school of thought, care if they are doing "right" or "wrong"... if after all the only "right" for them is the superiors command?

God no. You execute orders, and hope to hell that your side wins so you don't end up testifying at a war crimes tribunal.

 

[manimal]

isnt a soldier supposed not to think, and just execute orders???

why would, within the military school of thought, care if they are doing "right" or "wrong"... if after all the only "right" for them is the superiors command?

i will take your ignorant and offensive statement with a pinch of salt as i understand that you haven't the intestinal fortitude to understand why a soldier VOLUNTEERS for this duty. your type is simply the "grabastic piece of amphibian sh**" that will heckle at the man/woman in uniform claiming intellectual superiority and yet not even comprehend the relation between your ability to speak openly about your passifistic rantings in a COUNTRY NOT YOUR OWN and those who ultimately gave you that ability.

i can take the jabs of silver, changleen, vb and the like when it comes to religious/political issues with stride and understanding.......
...but had you made that cowardly, ignorant and unsubstantiated claim to my face, i would have shown you what it means to stand up for something; and you would know, be it from your broken nose or the flame in my eyes that those soldiers/marines/sailors/airmen are not robots and THEY are not politics. they are there because they chose to be there. so...alexis DH, stay the hell in peru, i've lost too many close friends over the past few years that fought and died for something far more important than your ungrateful arse can ever understand (and no, i'm not talking about any president's agenda....it's much, much more than politics)

(ok mods.....i lost it...sorry, go ahead and ban me from this forum if you have to, i'll understand)

 

[Silver]

The problem, manimal, is that it isn't an offensive statement.

It's the standard that we held the Germans up to after WW2.

 

[manimal]

have you ever served? do you know what is taught and expected? it's the same blanket statements that label all Socal-ians as granola eating hippies and all Southeasterners as rednecks....except that mr. peru was implying that the soldiers are there against their will because they're too stupid to know better. we are not investigating war crimes here, this is about understanding what these protests do to soldiers who have willingly sacrificed themselves on the altar of service.
i doubt i can make you understand what it is like, silver. i believe that you are very educated but I don't think you can be offended....unless i try to opose some religious belief on you

 

[El Santo]

So because someone exercises their first amendment right they are a trust fund hippy that deserves to get 'stomped'? Wow. I hope this whole internet-venting-therapy thing is going well for you, N8. You sound like a really well adjusted guy that exerts a positive influence on the world. Good work by you. Next time you are in the bay area PM me - I'll teach you how to ride a mountain bike. It's a good way to get out some of that hostility.

Manimal, I don't know where to start.

1. as a cop, it prolly isn't a great idea to threaten people where other people can hear you. I'm glad I haven't been speeding in the birthplace of Krispy Kremes lately. Actually, there has to be a stereo-joke in here somewhere - you are a cop, and draw attention to the fact that you are from the birthplace of Krispy Kremes.

2. your wires are crossed. Our military presence in the middle east has nothing to do with the current freedom of speech that Americans or Peruvians enjoy. In a year or so you may be able to make a case for the Iraqis... but we'll have to see about that.

It makes me ill when the pro-war folks try to evoke Iwo Jima, Normandy, or the eastern front with what our military is doing in the present. It seems to be a common mantra, "we're fighting for freedom". What bullsh|t.

As an ex-marine, it's you that should be standing up and screaming foul at the top of your lungs about the treatment of our military by our government! If I were an ex-marine I would be abso-focking-lutely livid. You clearly have the anger - focus it somewhere productive.

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

have you ever served? do you know what is taught and expected? it's the same blanket statements that label all Socal-ians as granola eating hippies and all Southeasterners as rednecks....except that mr. peru was implying that the soldiers are there against their will because they're too stupid to know better. we are not investigating war crimes here, this is about understanding what these protests do to soldiers who have willingly sacrificed themselves on the altar of service.
i doubt i can make you understand what it is like, silver. i believe that you are very educated but I don't think you can be offended....unless i try to opose some religious belief on you

i dont imply they are stupid. in fact i dont see how it can be offensive.
isnt what i said, the purpose of military training?? making the soldiers follow orders OVER ANY OTHER THING???

question 1:
isnt a soldier instructed on JUST TO FOLLOW ORDERS??? personal beliefs being secondary to just follow orders?
isnt that the central concept in military training?? and if you dont comply.. isnt that usually enough grounds to take you to martial court???

question 2:
they are what they are, just to get the job done, regardless of what they think.. or not? otherwise they face martial court?

question 3:
what is the definition of "insubordination"??

just like an executioner, that just turns on the electric chair because its his job, regardless the executed is innocent or guilty as sin.

like silver said, whether what he did was "right" or "wrong" wont be known until the operation is over, and depend on whether his side wins or loose?????

plus is naive to imply that because soldiers "can" do good things like beating the nazis and saving the world... every time they get to do business is gonna be for "good".....

 

[jaydee]

The problem, manimal, is that it isn't an offensive statement.

It's the standard that we held the Germans up to after WW2.

Yup, it's the old "Ours is not to question why. Ours is but to do or die". It's way too archaic and simplistic a philosophy to live (or die) by these days. If a person volunteers to serve in the armed forces, he/she is a willing participant in any conflict he is sent to. The rationalization "I was just following orders" is not morally valid for any person with free will. If you don't agree with US military activities, don't volunteer. Manimal, if you stand behind the US actions in Iraq, that's your opinion and you can live with it. Likewise Silver is entitled to his view, and he can live with that. But your threats of violence and accusations of cowardice and ignorance show that you have no respect for opinions opposing yours.

 

[Silver]

have you ever served? do you know what is taught and expected? it's the same blanket statements that label all Socal-ians as granola eating hippies and all Southeasterners as rednecks....except that mr. peru was implying that the soldiers are there against their will because they're too stupid to know better. we are not investigating war crimes here, this is about understanding what these protests do to soldiers who have willingly sacrificed themselves on the altar of service.
i doubt i can make you understand what it is like, silver. i believe that you are very educated but I don't think you can be offended....unless i try to opose some religious belief on you

No, and I never will, unless there happens to be hostile troopships massing off of the coast of San Diego. I am not willing to allow my moral decisions to be made by someone who does not share my values, especially when it regards the taking of human life for capricious reasons. I'm hardly a granola eating hippie (unless it's on blueberry yogurt. I love granola on that!) but even if I was, that doesn't have much relevance to the situation.

The funny thing about Vietnam is that the protesters were right. We killed a whole lot of people (and lost a lot of our own) because of a colonial wet dream. There is no intrinsic honor in war.

As for not being offendable...pretty much any one of N8's posts seem to do the trick

 

[Changleen]

Soldiers should, like other other human being, be responsible for, and be accountable for their own actions. Any soldier who goes to war without understanding why he is there has no business being there. Any soldier who does not care is a piece of human ****.

 

[chicodude]

have you ever served? do you know what is taught and expected? it's the same blanket statements that label all Socal-ians as granola eating hippies and all Southeasterners as rednecks....except that mr. peru was implying that the soldiers are there against their will because they're too stupid to know better. we are not investigating war crimes here, this is about understanding what these protests do to soldiers who have willingly sacrificed themselves on the altar of service.
i doubt i can make you understand what it is like, silver. i believe that you are very educated but I don't think you can be offended....unless i try to opose some religious belief on you

So, basically, anyone who does not share your POV is a granola eatin' hippie, Right?

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

the whole "gloryfing our death soldier" thing is going on in the whole world, not just the US shows you the multiple standard on such thing. just like you glorify the US soldiers, the iraqies are glorifying theirs.... which "gloryfication" is the "good" one??

it just depends on who wins....

that is just a timeless marketing trick by armies in the US and everywhere to get more volunteers to risks their life to push others economical agenda... (unless its an strictly defensive war, which is a whole different matter).

after all, what can be more important for a person (in an strictly logical and sound sense) than his or her own life???
and dont come with that BS of pride and honor.. which is another marketing trick by armies...

what honor or pride is there in surrendering your free will (which is that very same thing you are supposed to die for) to others in the first place??? dont you see the paradox there???

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

Soldiers should, like other other human being, be responsible for, and be accountable for their own actions. Any soldier who goes to war without understanding why he is there has no business being there. Any soldier who does not care is a piece of human ****.

thats true...
tomorrow i´ll go shoot somebody for no reason, and tell "my mommy told me so", and then expect the court to let me go????

we humans, have a messed up legal system that allows that figure, in the case of the government letting you kill and exciting you to develop a big enough desensitizing that you will shoot another human being on the ONLY word of another person???? damn! thats is so fvkd up in so many levels, and even more that we even condone and glorify such behavior!!!!!!!!!

 

[N8 v2.0]

We interupt this thread for the following announcement:





Nothing is funnier than listening to a bunch of non-vet-latte-swilling-coffee shoppers talking about the military...





...we now return to your regularly scheduled bong-toking, sit-in....

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

We interupt this thread for the following announcement:





Nothing is funnier than listening to a bunch of non-vet-latte-swilling-coffee shoppers talking about the military...





...we now return to your regularly scheduled bong-toking, sit-in....

so i have to be a 75 years olf jew to talk about the holocaust?
do i have to be part of the manhattan project engineers, to talk about nukes?
do i have to be hilary clinton to talk about monica lewinsky?
do i have to psychotic to talk about schizophrenia??

does being a marine, or other not mutually recognized authorative source, makes you more correct??

i think you get the point...

what you are talking about, is perfectly defined logical fallacy, whose name i dont recall right now....
there is some of argumentun ad hominem, and some of that other one....

 

[jaydee]

We interupt this thread for the following announcement:





Nothing is funnier than listening to a bunch of non-vet-latte-swilling-coffee shoppers talking about the military...





...we now return to your regularly scheduled bong-toking, sit-in....

Nothing is sadder or scarier than listening to a narrow-minded warmonger stomping all over the opinions of people who question whether there may be a better way to do things.

 

[mack]

States holding hippy rallies... found on the website...

http://www.unitedforpeace.org/article.php?id=2782

UTAH: Logan, Moab, Salt Lake City

CALIFORNIA: Alameda, Albion, Altadena, Bakersfield, Belmont, Benicia, Berkeley, Bishop, Brentwood, Camarillo, Capistrano Beach, Castro Valley, Cazadero, Chico, Claremont, Clayton, Cloverdale, Corona, Costa Mesa, Cupertino, Davis, Eagle Rock, El Centro, Encinitas, Eureka, Fairfax, Fallbrook, Fort Bragg, Fresno, Glendora, Hollister, Hollywood, Huntington Beach, Idylwild, Irvine, La Canada, Lafayette, Lakeport, Livermore, Loomis, Los Angeles, Malibu, Mendocino, Mill Valley, Mountain View, Mt. Shasta, Napa, Newbury Park, Oakland, Oxnard, Pacific Palisades, Pacifica, Palm Springs, Palo Alto, Pasadena, Penn Valley, Petaluma, Piedmont, Placerville, Pleasanton, Point Arena, Redding, Redlands, Reedley, Riverside, Rohnert Park, San Bruno, San Diego, San Francisco, San Jose, San Luis Obispo, San Rafael, Santa Barbara, Santa Clarita, Santa Cruz, Santee, Sausalito, Sebastopol, Sonora, Susanville, Thousand Oaks, Torrance, Tustin, Valencia, Van Nuys, Ventura, Walnut Creek, West Hollywood, Willits



Well i think its safe to say that most hippies live in california.

 

[mack]

Nothing is sadder or scarier than listening to a narrow-minded warmonger stomping all over the opinions of people who question whether there may be a better way to do things.

Tell me about it.

 

[chicodude]

Well i think its safe to say that most hippies live in california.

Er.....Not quite.....


PENNSYLVANIA: Allentown, Bally, Bangor, Beaver, Bellefonte, Bethlehem, Bryn Athyn, Chambersburg, Coatesville, Easton, Emmaus, Erie, Harrisburg, Hatboro, Hatfield, Healdsburg, Hellerton, Honesdale, Huntingdon, Jenkintown, Jim Thorpe, Kutztown, Lancaster, Lansdowne, Lewisburg, Middleburg, Mohnton, Nazareth, New Tripoli, Norristown, Pennsburg, Philadelphia, Phillipsburg, Pittsburgh, Schnecksville, Squirrel Hill, St. Davids, State College, Valley Forge, Warminster, Wellsboro, West Chester, Wilkes-Barre, Williamsport, Worcester, Wynnewood, York

NEW YORK: Albany, Bay Shore, Bellport, Binghamton, Brooklyn, Buffalo, Chatham, Cherry Valley, Cooperstown, Coram, Dobbs Ferry, Dunkirk, East Norwich, Elmira, Farmingdale, Flushing, Garden City, Greenport, Greenwich, Honeoye, Ithaca, Johnson City, Kingston, Liberty, Malden Bridge, Nanuet, New Hartford, New Paltz, New York, Norwich, Oneonta, Patchogue, Poughkeepsie, Rochester, Saranac Lake, Sarasota Springs, Saugerties, Schenectady, Setauket, Southampton, Staatsburg, Staten Island, Stony Brook, Syracuse, Troy, Trumansburg, Utica, Wading River, Watertown, Woodside, Woodstock, Yonkers, Yorktown Heights

MASSACHUSETTS: Abington, Amherst, Andover, Arlington, Boston, Brimfield, Brookline, Cambridge, Connecticut Valley, Duxbury, Fall River, Falmouth, Framingham, Harwich, Holyoke, Hyannis, Jamaica Plain, Lexington, Longmeadow, Milton, Monson, Montague, Nantucket, Natick, New Bedford, Newburyport, Newton, Northampton, Norton, Pittsfield, Quincy, Roslindale, South Hadley, Spencer, Springfield, Stoneham, Stow, Sudbury, Vineyard Haven, Wendell, Waltham, Warwick, Wenham, Westborough, Westfield, Wilbraham, Winchester, Woburn, Worcester

 

[mack]

Coincidentally these states also have the most starbuck chains.

 

[chicodude]

Coincidentally these states also have the most starbuck chains.

Hippies don't drink starbucks........Yuppies do. I could see how you could mix the two up seeing as they sound alike

 

[Discostu]

To all you that hate these hippies so intensely, I present a hypothetical situation: Suppose the United States did enter a war unjustly, in which our country was responsible for the slaughter of innocents and at the same time American soldiers were dying en masse for this cause. What would be the appropriate thing for us civilians to do? Sit back and watch it happen? Protesting would hurt our soldiers morale as you said, but at the same time, people are dying on both sides unnecessarily. What is the solution, it seems that it is our duty as Americans to exercise our rights to correct our government's actions.

Now I realize this does not characterize your view of the current war, and it is hard for some to believe the US could possibly be responsible for something like what I proposed, but still, think about it as a hypothetical.

 

[sanjuro]

Here is a good war protest for RM's: When Bush first declared war on Iraq, I decided the war was over oil, so the only legitmate protest I could think of was to stop driving. I didn't drive for 3 weeks.

You might 3 weeks was a short period of time, but I lived in Ct, where there is a very poor public transit system, and most of my locales were 15-20 miles away.

I had to carefully plan my days, so I would not overextend myself. The worst is if I visited a friend in the suburbs in the evening. I would have to ride on country roads when no car would expect to see a bicycle at night.

I felt I like I did something positive and personal, and while not many people knew what I was doing, I felt like I accomplished something.

 

[Changleen]

Here is a good war protest for RM's: When Bush first declared war on Iraq, I decided the war was over oil, so the only legitmate protest I could think of was to stop driving. I didn't drive for 3 weeks.

You might 3 weeks was a short period of time, but I lived in Ct, where there is a very poor public transit system, and most of my locales were 15-20 miles away.

I had to carefully plan my days, so I would not overextend myself. The worst is if I visited a friend in the suburbs in the evening. I would have to ride on country roads when no car would expect to see a bicycle at night.

I felt I like I did something positive and personal, and while not many people knew what I was doing, I felt like I accomplished something.

Well you were probably fitter

 

[Brian HCM#1]

States holding hippy rallies... found on the website...

http://www.unitedforpeace.org/article.php?id=2782

UTAH: Logan, Moab, Salt Lake City

CALIFORNIA: Alameda, Albion, Altadena, Bakersfield, Belmont, Benicia, Berkeley, Bishop, Brentwood, Camarillo, Capistrano Beach, Castro Valley, Cazadero, Chico, Claremont, Clayton, Cloverdale, Corona, Costa Mesa, Cupertino, Davis, Eagle Rock, El Centro, Encinitas, Eureka, Fairfax, Fallbrook, Fort Bragg, Fresno, Glendora, Hollister, Hollywood, Huntington Beach, Idylwild, Irvine, La Canada, Lafayette, Lakeport, Livermore, Loomis, Los Angeles, Malibu, Mendocino, Mill Valley, Mountain View, Mt. Shasta, Napa, Newbury Park, Oakland, Oxnard, Pacific Palisades, Pacifica, Palm Springs, Palo Alto, Pasadena, Penn Valley, Petaluma, Piedmont, Placerville, Pleasanton, Point Arena, Redding, Redlands, Reedley, Riverside, Rohnert Park, San Bruno, San Diego, San Francisco, San Jose, San Luis Obispo, San Rafael, Santa Barbara, Santa Clarita, Santa Cruz, Santee, Sausalito, Sebastopol, Sonora, Susanville, Thousand Oaks, Torrance, Tustin, Valencia, Van Nuys, Ventura, Walnut Creek, West Hollywood, Willits



Well i think its safe to say that most hippies live in california.

Why do you think I hate hippies so much..........................we're infested with them :mumble:

 

[ohio]

Nothing is funnier than listening to a bunch of non-vet-latte-swilling-coffee shoppers talking about the military...

Interestingly enough, I spent last night visiting with a friend from home who was out here with his wife for a conference of hers. This friend comes from a career military family, enlisted in the national guard right out of highschool, and believes strongly that he should fulfill his obligation to the very best of his abilities. He also feels strongly that this is an unjust war, perpetrated by those who have never served (he didn't mention whether or not rumsfeld swills lattes), and he feels extremely manipulated and abused by the military. He was forced to re-enlist, putting off in-process plans for he and his wife to have a baby (fortunately she wasn't pregnant yet) and build a new home near a new job (too late on the home and the job), and again will serve to the best of his abilities, but certainly not willingly and happily. It absolutely gives him strength to think that while he's in Iraq, there are people here fighting to bring him home from a war he doesn't believe in.

He is one of two very close friends in this position (family was career military, one Nat Guard, on Army, enlisted straight out of highschool). They both feel the same. Now, the be fair, he also said his opinion is on the minority in the military. He is also not a marine (= not brainwashed ) but I feel his opinion is valid.

You even mention the name Rumsfeld near him, and he practically starts flipping tables.

 

[Changleen]

Interestingly enough, I spent last night visiting with a friend from home who was out here with his wife for a conference of hers. This friend comes from a career military family, enlisted in the national guard right out of highschool, and believes strongly that he should fulfill his obligation to the very best of his abilities. He also feels strongly that this is an unjust war, perpetrated by those who have never served (he didn't mention whether or not rumsfeld swills lattes), and he feels extremely manipulated and abused by the military. He was forced to re-enlist, putting off in-process plans for he and his wife to have a baby (fortunately she wasn't pregnant yet) and build a new home near a new job (too late on the home and the job), and again will serve to the best of his abilities, but certainly not willingly and happily. It absolutely gives him strength to think that while he's in Iraq, there are people here fighting to bring him home from a war he doesn't believe in.

He is one of two very close friends in this position (family was career military, one Nat Guard, on Army, enlisted straight out of highschool). They both feel the same. Now, the be fair, he also said his opinion is on the minority in the military. He is also not a marine (= not brainwashed ) but I feel his opinion is valid.

You even mention the name Rumsfeld near him, and he practically starts flipping tables.

Better not mention his name, GenPowell will hunt him down and kill him.

 

[Guntruck]

Who cares if a bunch of hippies want to protest. Would you be happier if they were not allowed to do so? It's amuseing to me when people get mad over other peoples views because they think they're unamerican. I thought the United States was founded on the premise that all people should be able to have their own personal beliefs. I think its pretty unamerican to say you want to attack anybody for beleiveing in something. I'm quite happy that I can say whatever I want about our country, or most anything else, and theres nothing anybody can do about it. And it's really never gotten on my nerves when people belive things I think to be incorrect. I don't quite understand the point of threads like this. Seems pretty immature to me.

 

[McGRP01]

Nothing is sadder or scarier than listening to a narrow-minded warmonger stomping all over the opinions of people who question whether there may be a better way to do things.

Quoted for Truth!

Where'd Manimal go? Think he's out beating somebody up for wearing a tie-dye or listening to the Grateful Dead? I try not to pass judgement on people without meeting them in person, but some of the stuff he posts makes me sick.

 

[BurlyShirley]

We interupt this thread for the following announcement:





Nothing is funnier than listening to a bunch of non-vet-latte-swilling-coffee shoppers talking about the military...





...we now return to your regularly scheduled bong-toking, sit-in....

Bwaaaaaahahhahaha!

N8, you're not that funny of a guy, but that was good.

 

[N8 v2.0]

Bwaaaaaahahhahaha!

N8, you're not that funny of a guy, but that was good.

Where ya been? Getting your builder's license?

 

[jon cross]

The only thing I have a problem with is when people start protesting at bases and getting in soldier's faces about the orders they carry out. It's not a matter of what they are saying, but the questionable way in which they are expressing their message and to whom. I realllllly like the idea of not driving to protest our involvement in what you said was a war about oil. I may disagree with you, but I give you much respect for finding a way to express your dissent without just screaming at soldiers.

The thing many people forget, is that, while it may be a popular and legitimate opinion to say that this war is not about national defense, the VAST majority of the men and women who have served and fought did so to protect the nation. When people protest the war by going after soldiers (and this doesn't happen all that often, as most yuppies and hippies keep their **** within starbucks and drum circles and those that truly care find a smarter way to express themselves) they are disrespecting decades and centuries of service. Being pissed about are current situation does not mean you need to go spouting off to someone who signed up to protect you, at the cost of their own life if needed. For the troops, some respect is deserved. Say whatever you want, all I ask is that you find an intelligent way to get the point across.

Article I, US Military Code of Conduct:
I am an American, fighting in the armed forces which guard my country and our way of life. I am prepared to give my life in their defense.

This is why the vast majority of people are in the military, not to make money for Bush or to expand what some people think of as an American empire- they want to fight for YOU.

 

[McGRP01]

Article I, US Military Code of Conduct:
I am an American, fighting in the armed forces which guard my country and our way of life. I am prepared to give my life in their defense.

And what did invading Iraq have to do with "guarding our country and our way of life" again? Nevermind...

Soldiers have a job to do, and they do it. Not their fault. It's the politicians that put them in harms way for questionable reasons that I have issue with.

 

[jon cross]

What I'm saying is that regardless of whether or not you think this war is being fought in our defense or even our best interest, the soldiers are there to fight on the behalf of the nation. There is a tradition of fighting and dying to protect the nation that goes FAR beyond the last two presidential terms.

 

[McGRP01]

What I'm saying is that regardless of whether or not you think this war is being fought in our defense or even our best interest, the soldiers are there to fight on the behalf of the nation. There is a tradition of fighting and dying to protect the nation that goes FAR beyond the last two presidential terms.

What are they fighting to protect us from?

 

[motomike]

Manimal, I don't know where to start.

1. as a cop, it prolly isn't a great idea to threaten people where other people can hear you. I'm glad I haven't been speeding in the birthplace of Krispy Kremes lately. Actually, there has to be a stereo-joke in here somewhere - you are a cop, and draw attention to the fact that you are from the birthplace of Krispy Kremes.

Your wrong, he is an individual, who happens to be a cop. It's his job. He is only a cop when clocked in and beating down crackheads in the allies.

Sorry, its a sh*itty day here and I need to vent.

 

[jon cross]

You're not listening. I don't care whether or not you think that the soldiers in Iraq currently are protecting you, personally, but because that responsibility is a massive risk that they have assumed you should leave them the hell alone. They signed up to fight so people like me could ride their bikes and chill in college (until I decided to enlist). Iraq is not representative of our country's military history, so, for the last time, leave the soldiers alone.

 

[Silver]

Iraq is not representative of our country's military history, so, for the last time, leave the soldiers alone.

Leaving out the two world wars, it sure is.