[johnbryanpeters]

I have read too many descriptions on the intarwebz regarding converting fatbike wheels to tubeless. In general they involve stuffing about 47 pounds of duct tape, foam, rat pelts, and herbal essences into the space once occupied by the tube, increasing wheel weight and rotational inertia by a factor approaching infinity.

BadDNA provided a link which I can't find right now to a relatively clean conversion involving only yards of duct tape, which got me to thinking.

I'm running Big Fat Larry tires on Clown Shoe rims in the summer. I decided that I might just be able to remove the tube, install a tubeless stem, add sealant, and let the factory rim strip suffice.

Starting with an inflated tire, I let the air out, broke the bead on one side of the rim, and removed the tube. I installed a WTB TCS tubeless stem, fastened a ratchet strap around the tire, gently cinched down to push the bead outwards, and tried to inflate with a floor pump. No deal. Then an air compressor. Almost, but no golden ring. Couldn't get the bead to seat.

Pulled the stem, removed the tire and rim strip, on which I had previously done no prep, and washed everything with water and a sponge. Put the tire back on with a tube and inflated to seat the beads. Deflated, broke one bead, removed the tube, installed the rim strip and stem, strapped the tire, and went at it with the air compressor.

This time the bead seated. Pulled the stem core and added four ounces of Stans sealant and reinflated, then spent some time doing the Stans dance until nothing was bubbling and no white goop showed up when I hosed the tire and rim off.

I was feeling stoked. I had been using a Presta to Schraeder adapter and removed it. It helpfully removed the core as well, the tire deflated, the rim strip relaxed, and sealant started emerging from every conceivable orifice.

General hysteria ensued, but I managed to get air back into the tire, danced the Stans dance until no more bubbles or emerging goop, and the tire's holding air nicely.

Learnings:

• I hate TCS valve stems. When you screw the core in, the body wants to screw back into the rim.
• It'd help to seal the edges of the rim strip with something. I'm thinking a single narrow layer of duct tape or some sort of adhesive between outer edge of rim strip and rim.
• It is possible to convert to tubeless without getting too complicated.

To be learned:

When I reduce tire pressure to the 8 PSIG I normally run in front in the summer, I'm not sure whether the rim strip will continue to seal. I think it should.

To be continued

 

[StiHacka]

How many gallons of sealant did you pour in?

 

[johnbryanpeters]

How many gallons of sealant did you pour in?

As stated above, four ounces.

 

[amishmatt]

Not on a fat bike, but I recently did a Gorilla Tape tubeless conversion on some old Sun rims and it was a cinch. Removed the rim strip, cleaned all the residue thoroughly, wrapped one layer of Gorilla Tape (1" wide in my case, just wide enough to cover the whole inside of the rim, wall to wall, but not up the side) overlapped at the valve stem. I used a valve stem cut out from an old tube, tightened the nut down hard on the rim. Soap and water on the beads, 2-3 oz. of Stans, seated right up with a floor pump.

TL/DR; I think you should pull the rim strip and add the duct tape/gorilla tape in its place.

 

[eric strt6]

try some non leveling dicor lap sealant on the rimstrip/ rim interface it should do the trick (hint wear exam gloves as the stuff is sticky as hell and next to impossible to get off your skin) it stays flexible in hot and cold it is waterproof and air proof. You can get it at any big box hardware store and it is cheap.

 

[jdcamb]

try some non leveling dicor lap sealant on the rimstrip/ rim interface it should do the trick (hint wear exam gloves as the stuff is sticky as hell and next to impossible to get off your skin) it stays flexible in hot and cold it is waterproof and air proof. You can get it at any big box hardware store and it is cheap.

I'm fine. I walked home....

 

[eaterofdog]

All the bike trends are converging at your house. Is it 29er?

 

[johnbryanpeters]

amishmatt: Dumping the rim strip with a fatty pierced rim is not very practical. Much drama would ensue.

eric strt6: Thanks for the suggestion. Not sure when my next pass might be - it's going to be a giant mess, have to remove and clean everything. Certainly sometime after NEMBAfest if the wheel continues to hold air until then.

eaterofdog: Don't you have some crabon to polish?

 

[eaterofdog]

Don't you have some crabon to polish?

Is that a euphemism for masturbation? Because, uh... maybe.

 

[4xBoy]

I have been running tubeless for a while now, HED rims make it easier.

STANS fat rims should be out soon, I will be switching to those.

 

[johnbryanpeters]

The wheels were still inflated this morning. Next iteration, I think I'll try contact cement to glue the edges of the rim strips to the rims.

 

[johnbryanpeters]

One year report:

The front wheel I set up tubeless last year lasted happily all summer, which is to say six hundred miles or so. I added air once during the season.

I put on studded tires for the winter, using tubes.

Today, it being time to put summer tires back on, I set up both wheels tubeless. I used a 3M abrasive pad to remove dried up Stans on the front rim and on the inside and beads of the tire. Still did not use any tape or foam or similar tubeless religious relics. Didn't disturb either rim strip; whatever mud, dried Stans, or road salt that might have been under the strip stayed there. So did a couple of pieces of beer can that adorn the rear wheel.

• Mounted the tire.
• Seated the beads using a tube.
• Broke one bead.
• Removed the tube.
• Installed tubeless stems **using a hex nut** and with no core.
• Strapped the tread center.
• Placed the wheel on an empty five gallon plastic bucket with the bead I wanted to seal facing down.
• Went at it with the air compressor, thumping the wheel on the bucket to encourage the bead to move down.
• When the bead sealed, let the air back out and took off the strap.
• Added four ounces of Stans through the valve stem.
• Replaced the valve core.
• Did the happy Stans dance.
• Inflated.
• Did a few cycles of adding air and repeating the dance until no more sealant was emerging and nothing was bubbling. The rear wheel, with the beer can inserts, took longer to decide that it was happy, but it eventually cooperated.

I think I'm set up for the summer.

 

[4xBoy]

I just got a pair of Hugos.

 

[4130biker]

Wow- tubelss newbie here, about to change tires and kind of dreading it. Anyway, I've been having valve stem leakage trouble. Does the hex nut help by being able to tighten the crap out of it?

 

[Westy]

You clearly need more fire extinguishers, woks and microwaves.

 

[jdcamb]

I am very good at Archery and Golf. But not Bowling or Darts. I want to try fencing next only because I like the idea of owning a sword.

 

[4130biker]

Hehe, I love this place

 

[Westy]

I am very good at Archery and Golf. But not Bowling or Darts. I want to try fencing next only because I like the idea of owning a sword.

What do you use the sword for? Making sure suppliers don't mention that you purchase stolen goods?


Edit: Duh, snitches get sttiches.

 

[jstuhlman]

I hope he enjoyed his loin of shame.

 

[AngryMetalsmith]

I am very good at Archery and Golf. But not Bowling or Darts. I want to try fencing next only because I like the idea of owning a sword.

There is this Greek place near me that makes awesome onion rings.

 

[jdcamb]

What do you use the sword for? Making sure suppliers don't mention that you purchase stolen goods?


Edit: Duh, snitches get sttiches.

You would have to go to the Hospital for that. I can't stitch you up. I am not very good at that either....

I love Onion rings but I don't know how to make them. I do not understand what purpose the strap has either.

 

[Westy]

You would have to go to the Hospital for that. I can't stitch you up. I am not very good at that either....

I love Onion rings but I don't know how to make them. I do not understand what purpose the strap has either.

BTW, foils are used in fencing, not real swords.

 

[jdcamb]

BTW, foils are used in fencing, not real swords.

Thanks for ruining fencing for me. I still want a sword.

Still no idea what the strap is for....

 

[jdcamb]

My friend Jon rides hundreds of miles on his fat bike. I asked how his tubeless experience went. He stated it was fine until the spring. He switched over to tubed tires for the summer season because his camp is to rocky for tubeless. He also had nothing but praise for Surly also.

 

[SkaredShtles]

Thanks for ruining fencing for me. I still want a sword.

http://www.sca.org/

HTH.

 

[johnbryanpeters]

Wow- tubelss newbie here, about to change tires and kind of dreading it. Anyway, I've been having valve stem leakage trouble. Does the hex nut help by being able to tighten the crap out of it?

I went to the hex after having the stem loosen while reinserting a valve core. You want to tighten it moderately but not super tight.

Over time I have discovered that there's some undetermined pressure at which the rim strip relaxes and stops sealing, resulting in a flat tire and sealant all over the place.

I just redid the rear wheel, cleaning and drying everything, then applying a single turn of 1" Gorilla tape over each edge of the rim strip, going to about 1/16" shy of the bead mounting surface. That held air quite reasonably even before I added sealant.

The one thing that took some time to seal was two rim piercings with beer can pieces inside (One Heady Topper and one Pabst Blue Ribbon). They took some wheel rotations, time, and reinflation to finally stop bubbling.

 

[johnbryanpeters]

Winter tires went on today using four ounces of Orange Seal Subzero in each wheel. Tossed the old rim strips and the beer can inserts, Removed %&$# Gorilla tape and old sealant from rims, put on new Surly rim strips. Seated the tires using a tube, broke one bead and removed the tube, put in stem, re-seated the bead, deflated tire, added sealant, re-inflated, and played the toss the puking baby game until the sealant did its work.

It's been said before: Tubeless has its benefits, but it's a fucking pain in the ass. Changing a tire used to be such a simple operation.

 

[jstuhlman]

i'm tellin' ya...it's because fatbike.

serious question: does where you would generally ride said fatbike, and the conditions in which you would ride it, normally create a lot of flats? if not, is the weight savings alone enough to warrant the annual pain in the ass?

 

[canadmos]

Changing a tire used to be such a simple operation.

It still is up here.

 

[jonKranked]

Sometimes I almost wish I lived in a region. That got enough snow to justify a fat bike.

Almost.

 

[StiHacka]

Seated the tires using a tube, broke one bead and removed the tube, put in stem, re-seated the bead, deflated tire, added sealant, re-inflated, and played the toss the puking baby game until the sealant did its work.

FF to 2:00 (seriously, he seats the beads with a tire lever)

 

[johnbryanpeters]

i'm tellin' ya...it's because fatbike.

serious question: does where you would generally ride said fatbike, and the conditions in which you would ride it, normally create a lot of flats? if not, is the weight savings alone enough to warrant the annual pain in the ass?

Dealing with flats was the primary driver. Any weight/reduced rotational inertia was secondary.

Sometimes I almost wish I lived in a region. That got enough snow to justify a fat bike.

Almost.

I don't understand why snow would be the deciding factor. I ride the Moonlander all summer.

 

[TreeSaw]

Sometimes I almost wish I lived in a region. That got enough snow to justify a fat bike.

Almost.

I've yet to ride my mukluk on snow and it's an amazing amount of fun.

 

[jonKranked]

I don't understand why snow would be the deciding factor. I ride the Moonlander all summer.

i don't need more excuses for being slow

 

[kickstand]

I don't understand why snow would be the deciding factor. I ride the Moonlander all summer.

I have only put a few miles in on a fatbike, but I do plan to purchase one for winter riding. However, I don't think I could go full fatbike year round.

 

[jstuhlman]

joke bumper stickers made for a friend recently. *relevant*

 

[johnbryanpeters]

I have only put a few miles in on a fatbike, but I do plan to purchase one for winter riding. However, I don't think I could go full fatbike year round.

So don't.

I use the Moonlander for errands, trail work, and what I call mixed media rides - mixtures of pavement, gravel, singletrack, swamp, whatever I happen upon.

I ride the T275 when I feel like that kind of riding.

For you or jonKranked, do whatever the hell you feel like. I'm not trying to convince anybody, just describing whay I personally am futzing around with.

 

[jstuhlman]

#futzbike

 

[SkaredShtles]

So don't.

I use the Moonlander for errands, trail work, and what I call mixed media rides - mixtures of pavement, gravel, singletrack, swamp, whatever I happen upon.

I ride the T275 when I feel like that kind of riding.

For you or jonKranked, do whatever the hell you feel like. I'm not trying to convince anybody, just describing whay I personally am futzing around with.

Get off your lawn?

 

[Jm_]

i'm tellin' ya...it's because fatbike.

serious question: does where you would generally ride said fatbike, and the conditions in which you would ride it, normally create a lot of flats? if not, is the weight savings alone enough to warrant the annual pain in the ass?

I ride mine in the snow and tubeless allows significantly lower pressure safely, also fat tubes are usually of two varieties, heavy Moto tube (anchor) or thin mountain that gets stretched way too thin in a fat tire. The reduction in rolling resistance is also a big deal. Run like 4-5psi when snow conditions are really soft. Plus, most of the newer carbon rims are made for tubeless, so relatively easy to set up. Most Alu rims are not.