Turner Highline - Devinci bike... similar, but not the same.....

FlipSide · Oct 7, 2004

It seems the canadian version will still have the Horst link... :eviltongu

Transcend · Oct 7, 2004

flip is correct. The horst link is gone on the US models in order to avoid paying licensing to specialized. Moral of the story: mail order from canada.

syadasti · Oct 7, 2004

Transcend said:
flip is correct. The horst link is gone on the US models in order to avoid paying licensing to specialized. Moral of the story: mail order from canada.

I wonder if they give warranty to US customers with CDN model bikes?

buildyourown · Oct 7, 2004

That's funny. Notice that the machined drop-out piece is the same, just flipped over. The seatstay is bigger than the chainstay on the canadian version and vice versa on the US version.
Interesting way around the patent.

MMcG · Oct 7, 2004

They should suck it up and pay the fee.

So if someone isn't in the know - they get an inferior product if the buy in the US.

I'm going to have to work with Jozz or Tartosuc or someone if my new frame decision ends up being a Devinci All Mountain frame set.

Acadian · Oct 7, 2004

Okay I got to say it...I've looked long and hard at that Highline - I know it's not finished (well I hope) but coming from Turner, IMO doesn't live up the expectations I had. In terms of look, it's at the bottom of the Turner ladder...

6-spot and flux on the other hand!!

vitox · Oct 7, 2004

buildyourown said:
That's funny. Notice that the machined drop-out piece is the same, just flipped over. The seatstay is bigger than the chainstay on the canadian version and vice versa on the US version.
Interesting way around the patent.

that makes me think, what if they made it so that you could horst-ify it by flipping the dropout?

would it still infringe the patents?

anyway it would be an awesome way to compare marketing vs reality.

MMcG · Oct 7, 2004

Acadian said:
Okay I got to say it...I've looked long and hard at that Highline - I know it's not finished (well I hope) but coming from Turner, IMO doesn't live up the expectations I had. In terms of look, it's at the bottom of the Turner ladder...

6-spot and flux on the other hand!!

I agree Acadian - in it's current configuration it lacks the elegance that Turner signifies in my mind. Lacks refinement perhaps - but I guess we'll have to see what the final product looks like right?

Incubus · Oct 7, 2004

The knolly V-tach is also very similar only they add the 4x4 linkage. I remember reading that Noel used the extra linkage to eliminate some of the flex that you might see in having such long chainstays. He actually compared it to the Devinci bike at the time.

MMcG · Oct 7, 2004

FlipSide said:
It seems the canadian version will still have the Horst link... :eviltongu

Flipside the Canadian all mountain frames will have the horst link as well correct??

Transcend · Oct 7, 2004

vitox said:
that makes me think, what if they made it so that you could horst-ify it by flipping the dropout?

would it still infringe the patents?

anyway it would be an awesome way to compare marketing vs reality.

That or simply order up new drops. I believe they are welded or bonded in however....

neaky:

buildyourown · Oct 7, 2004

vitox said:
that makes me think, what if they made it so that you could horst-ify it by flipping the dropout?

would it still infringe the patents?

anyway it would be an awesome way to compare marketing vs reality.

I don't think you could flip it because they changed the tube sizes on the stays.

MMcG, the fee is cheap. I think it cost us $7 per frame when we were paying it several years ago. I think we were grandfathered in though since we had been using it since it was owned by AMP. Anyways, it has more to do with premission from the big S than the cost of paying license fees. They have some weird formula they use to decide who gets to use it and who doesn't.

MMcG · Oct 7, 2004

buildyourown said:
I don't think you could flip it because they changed the tube sizes on the stays.

MMcG, the fee is cheap. I think it cost us $7 per frame when we were paying it several years ago. I think we were grandfathered in though since we had been using it since it was owned by AMP. Anyways, it has more to do with premission from the big S than the cost of paying license fees. They have some weird formula they use to decide who gets to use it and who doesn't.

Buildyourown,

Who is "Us" in your post? Who did or do you work for?

ohio · Oct 7, 2004

Like he said, it depends more on permission. Specialized won't license it to direct competitors. They learned their lesson with Intense, as the Intense FSR line prevented Specialized from moving upmarket. Now that Intense has gone VPP, Specialized can move into that high-end space.

Jamis dropped it too. Not sure which side that decision was made on, but Jamis was moving into the mid-range. Similar with Iron Horse... the DW-link came along just at the right time, methinks.

So now it really only goes to boutiques (Ellsworth and Turner), as far as I know.

MikeD · Oct 7, 2004

So when they drop turner's FSR license, will it be illegal for me to ride my RFX? Oh, the HUMANITY!

I can imagine getting stopped and my bike repo'd by the Specialized Trail Police...the utter indignity of it all.

FlipSide · Oct 7, 2004

MMcG said:
Flipside the Canadian all mountain frames will have the horst link as well correct??

As far as I know, the entire line gets the Horst link in Canada. XC, AM, FR, etc...

buildyourown · Oct 7, 2004

When I worked for Ti Cycles, we paid $7 per frame. Like I said, I think we were grandfathered in. We weren't deamed competition though since we were so small. I think we only made 200 frames that used the patent.

MMcG · Oct 7, 2004

FlipSide said:
As far as I know, the entire line gets the Horst link in Canada. XC, AM, FR, etc...

Thanks FlipSide!!

Kornphlake · Oct 7, 2004

You couldn't just flip the dropouts, sure the pivot would be in the right place but the axle would have to go in from the top instead of the bottom. It does look like the tubing used on the seat stays of the US version is the same as the tubing used on the chainstays of the Canadian version and viceversa though.

syadasti · Oct 7, 2004

Transcend said:
That or simply order up new drops. I believe they are welded or bonded in however....
neaky:

The dropouts are replaceable and also are reconfigurable for 24" wheels also. I think they have bolts that hold them in place if I remember right from last year (and probably some piece interlocs into the other. They didn't have any at the 03 dirt demo though except for their all-mtn 6" bike though :mumble: )

Bulldog · Oct 7, 2004

Acadian said:
Okay I got to say it...I've looked long and hard at that Highline - I know it's not finished (well I hope) but coming from Turner, IMO doesn't live up the expectations I had. In terms of look, it's at the bottom of the Turner ladder...

Really?!! I think the DHR is quite FUGLY and very unrepresentative of typical Turner beauty. The Highline is head and shoulders above the DHR in my book. :thumb:

HRDTLBRO · Oct 7, 2004

I disagree. The Turner's that I have seen look beautiful, with the squarish tubing if the DHR and Rail, to the simple, rounded tubing on the 5-Spot and XCE. It looks very simple and clean, not out of place. While the Highline looks like it will perform well (via e-speculation fax machine) it doesn't quite look as refined as the other Turner's, albeit the '04 models anyway. The large gusset doesn't quite look "refined," and the large tubing looks "heavy" in a cosmetic way, amoung other things. I also understand that this is a pure proto, and it's only my opinion, other people will love the look of it. Refined is a sweet word, ehh?

syadasti · Oct 7, 2004

I liked the style on last year's proto better:

Though round tubes are cheaper and at the same weight can be made stronger than square ones...

Lexx D · Oct 7, 2004

Why are people complaining about the looks? from the first press release from turner they said it wouldn't be pretty but it would be be functional. I'd take a bike that will last over a pretty one any day.

Bulldog · Oct 7, 2004

HRDTLBRO said:
I disagree. The Turner's that I have seen look beautiful, with the squarish tubing if the DHR and Rail, to the simple, rounded tubing on the 5-Spot and XCE. It looks very simple and clean, not out of place. While the Highline looks like it will perform well (via e-speculation fax machine) it doesn't quite look as refined as the other Turner's, albeit the '04 models anyway. The large gusset doesn't quite look "refined," and the large tubing looks "heavy" in a cosmetic way, amoung other things. I also understand that this is a pure proto, and it's only my opinion, other people will love the look of it. Refined is a sweet word, ehh?

Everybody is entitled to their opinions, but I find it funny that the gusset and large [rounded] tubing of the Highline does not look refined, yet the fence-post-sized square tubing and Kmart stickers of the DHR looks beautiful.

One man's trash is truly another's treasure!

Bulldog · Oct 7, 2004

syadasti said:
I liked the style on last year's proto better:

Though round tubes are cheaper and at the same weight can be made stronger than square ones...

I'm just the opposite. Never liked the industrial (aka strong yet cheap looking) tubing, and I also strongly prefer the traditional seat tube angle of this model. With this normal seat tube angle I've now got thoughts in my head of retiring my RFX. :devil:

Acadian · Oct 7, 2004

true...whatever floats your boat I guess. I did not like the DHR when I first saw it, but the looks grew on me. I feel the same way about the new Highline and like Josh, I liked last year's proto better.

I don't have a DHR anymore and don't think I would be getting a Highline - but I still got my BEAUTIFUL 5-spot!! :thumb:

binary visions · Oct 7, 2004

The ugliness of that frame makes baby Jesus cry...

...however, I'd imagine that, being a Turner freeride bike and being expected to fill a more modern niche of the RFX, it'll last forever.

Besides, like a woman, they always look even better after you ride 'em for a while and fall in love

OGRipper · Oct 7, 2004

I really like the new SCB dirt jump hardtail but I'm biased. You'd expect me to say it but that pic doesn't do it justice.

Acadian · Oct 7, 2004

binary visions said:
The ugliness of that frame makes baby Jesus cry...

...however, I'd imagine that, being a Turner freeride bike and being expected to fill a more modern niche of the RFX, it'll last forever.

Besides, like a woman, they always look even better after you ride 'em for a while and fall in love

Like I said in my post on MTBR yesterday...you are getting wiser and wiser every day!!

syadasti · Oct 7, 2004

OGRipper said:
I really like the new SCB dirt jump hardtail but I'm biased. You'd expect me to say it but that pic doesn't do it justice.

I'm sorry but I would have to say that is one of the ugliest HT's I've seen in awhile

ink:

Transcend · Oct 7, 2004

oly said:
Its not the ugliest thing at the show......here are some things i think are FUGLY.....

new haro - http://www.transcendmagazine.com/gallery/Ibike_2004/IMG_0249
inferno - http://www.transcendmagazine.com/gallery/Ibike_2004/IMG_0202
mountan cycle - http://www.transcendmagazine.com/gallery/Ibike_2004/IMG_0210
another MC - http://www.transcendmagazine.com/gallery/Ibike_2004/IMG_0213
SC- http://www.transcendmagazine.com/gallery/Ibike_2004/DCP_2634
Orange - http://www.transcendmagazine.com/gallery/Ibike_2004/DCP_2600
Who knows? http://www.transcendmagazine.com/gallery/Ibike_2004/DCP_2597

these are my opinions of course......and this isnt to say any of these bikes are bad..... I just dont find them apealing....

Im also not holding final jugment on the Highline since its still in PROTO stage, its close to production, but i bet a few fine details will be made.....

The shape of the haro and mountain cycle bikes is horrendous. I consider the MC worse, as it is completely unnecessary as they are just trying to be different.

The paint on all of the 2005 oranges is UGLY. We will be sticking with out matte grey+chrome stickers, thank you very much.

BTW i don't care about bandwidth usage on RM, it is one of the few sites i have whitelisted for this purpose. 99% of other sites are on the blacklist and cannot hotlink a la MTBR. :thumb:

Acadian · Oct 7, 2004

syadasti said:
I'm sorry but I would have to say that is one of the ugliest HT's I've seen in awhile ink:

another amen...that jack-all is fugly!!!

Turner Highline - Devinci bike... similar, but not the same.....

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