[norbar]

I've been doing much more racing this season that for the last couple years and one thing bugs me. When I train in the day/days before the race I can go very fast and ride with a tempo I'm happy with but when my race run comes I get very cautious of not making mistakes, going smooth etc. and I get results that are worse than my ridding budies that on training (and on most other days) are considerably slower than me.

Has anyone had similar problems and how you delt with them? A friend of mine went to a sport schrink or sth but I think it's a bit extreme.

 

[profro]

If you are doing a bunch of races, just try a completely different approach at one. Don't worry about results. Try your best to think of your race run as just another one of your practice runs. Its sounds like you are racing to not lose and are getting stiff as a result. Race like you got nothing to lose. Because you really don't. With the exception of a rare few, we all are weekend warriors.

 

[monkeyfcuker]

My race runs have always been diabolical, I'm very interested in hearing any tips that would improve them! No matter how good I feel in practice I always either go way way to cautious or crash! I got beaten by a fecking girl in one race this year

 

[Lelandjt]

The other end of the spectrum is trying to use less brake in your race run than practice runs cuz you don't want to be slow and then blowing a corner. You just gotta develop a plan during practice runs and then stick with it on your race run while adapting to any changes in the course. It's not easy but the pressure and difficulty is why we race.

I think from now on I'm gonna time my last few practice runs. The idea being that if I know I'm already going fast enough to win then I won't be tempted to take risks looking for more speed in my race run.

 

[rosenamedpoop]

Go to a hypnotist, tell him to instruct you to "ride like an RPG pointed at the finish line"






.

 

[LMC]

this is a petty good read..

http://www.descent-world.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=522&Itemid=94

 

[time-bomb]

This sounds like it is 100% mental to me. You have proven that you have the skills and then when it comes down the actual moment you tense up and don't ride as well. During practice there is no pressure to perform. Like profro said, ride like you have nothing to lose, just have a good time and enjoy the race. Hopefully after you have a few results that you like that will build more confidence and help you keep loose on future race runs.

Once you get to a certain level, skill plays a smaller role in performance and experience and mental toughness play a much more significant role.

Could also just be a bad streak you are going through. Usually just takes one good race run to shake that sort of thing and then you are back on track.

 

[LMC]

i was looking for another article i'd read but cant find it now.

The general gist was that next time you have a good run, you store in your memory everything about the experience, your physical and mental state etc..

then before your race run you concentrate on that imagery and block out all current outside influences.. use it to build confidence, and increace your chances of getting in the zone.

did your friend have a good or bad experience from the shrink?

 

[offtheedge]

Nerves and, or over thinking IMO. I'm a complete hack in my race runs compared to practice or general riding.

I found myself much more in the zone when I stopped thinking about what I should be doing and started just letting go and having fun.

 

[rb92078]

I would suggest trying to simulate your practice or training days practice more like what you will be racing. Try to set up your practice course that you ride with your buddies like a race. Study lines, practice in sections, link corners. A race run is not just another practice run, or run with your buddies as many like to put it. It's a race run, there are nerves, pressure, and most importantly your on the clock. Freelap timers work well, or if you don't have the money a simple stop watch on your bars. Get used to doing runs with the pressure of the clock ticking away at you.

 

[Da Peach]

Haha, I've only ever done one DH (Neds) but man, that was a total choke-fest. 3 crashes in my race run.

Still didn't come last though!

Whenever I race next, I'm just going to concentrate on staying on the bike. I'm convinced that will at least put me in mid-pack.

 

[norbar]

did your friend have a good or bad experience from the shrink?

Very good. Now he has top 10-15 results in the Juniors at nat cup.


In my case it's not really that much nevers before the run. I was nervous when I was starting racing but it was quite a while ago. I now study lines (in most cases I'm the guy who picks all the ninja lines that my friends later use to beat me :/ ), do sections and try to have the most race oriented mindset possible but something flips when I cross the start line. I think it maybe due to the fact that I try to overthink it and act profesional, have clean lines (which look cool on photos but suck for racing) instead of having fun.

 

[LukeD]

Go to a hypnotist, tell him to instruct you to "ride like an RPG pointed at the finish line"






.

hahaha that's awesome.

i have the same issue too. i keep telling myself..this year i'll do a ton of races then i never do. every race i've ever been in i've tensed up or done horrible even though i ride fast everywhere else. it's a complete mind f*ck for me. which is weird...i'm an ice hockey goalie too and don't have issues there.

 

[time-bomb]

I now study lines (in most cases I'm the guy who picks all the ninja lines that my friends later use to beat me :/ )

Don't share your ninja lines with your friends and that is one thing that will help ensure your chances of beating them

 

[norbar]

Don't share your ninja lines with your friends and that is one thing that will help ensure your chances of beating them

I want to ride to 100% on my ability and race with myself. If they are faster than me after that than it's good for them. They're my friends so I'm not gonna hide my lines under the table. It's not like showing them to everyone.

 

[MDJ]

Very good. Now he has top 10-15 results in the Juniors at nat cup.


In my case it's not really that much nevers before the run. I was nervous when I was starting racing but it was quite a while ago. I now study lines (in most cases I'm the guy who picks all the ninja lines that my friends later use to beat me :/ ), do sections and try to have the most race oriented mindset possible but something flips when I cross the start line. I think it maybe due to the fact that I try to overthink it and act profesional, have clean lines (which look cool on photos but suck for racing) instead of having fun.

You just answered your question. Just let go and have fun - don't think, you're not a professional so don't try to act like one, and don't worry about photos unless you want to model instead of race DH. And get the nervousness back. A little bit of nerves are a good thing.

I see this all the time with newer racers. Some get over it and some don't.

The other mind trick you can try is to keep thinking that they guy behind you is going to pass you. Nothing like a little embarrasment and shame to get step it up a little.

 

[Huck Banzai]

My problem is simple - I psych myself out (not racing, just when hitting new lines or really tearing through shiz...)

Put a ripper in front of me, Ill tail him (not nec pass) - without that guy in front of me, lately Im completely PUNK.

So make sure you're not jus psyching yourslef out -- if anything, just let it go, rip and ride on the OTHER side of the edge!

or not...

 

[Heavey Hitter]

At least you dont kill yourself trying to win practice and end up wounded like a dumb ass come race time,like myself

 

[norbar]

At least you dont kill yourself trying to win practice and end up wounded like a dumb ass come race time,like myself

Did that 2 years ago on a regular basis. Went threw 3 derails on one day, in the other I tried to wallride a non wallrideable obstacle. Hurt yourself enough times and you get more cautious

 

[dante]

I've been doing much more racing this season that for the last couple years and one thing bugs me. When I train in the day/days before the race I can go very fast and ride with a tempo I'm happy with but when my race run comes I get very cautious of not making mistakes, going smooth etc. and I get results that are worse than my ridding budies that on training (and on most other days) are considerably slower than me.

Has anyone had similar problems and how you delt with them? A friend of mine went to a sport schrink or sth but I think it's a bit extreme.

How exactly are you training/practicing? One of the best things that I do (did...) was recreate the race at the end of the day beforehand. So top to bottom, at 90-95% of race pace. Full start in the starting gate, wait till it's clear enough that you don't have to catch/pass too many people and just go. For me the difference between cruising at 75% and racing at 95% is HUGE, and while I'm smooth and quick at 75, racing at 95% requires an entirely different mindset. Keep it at 90-95% so (hopefully) you don't crash your brains out during a practice run, but it gives you a great feeling on how different sections link up, and what speed/exhaustion level you're going to be at at different points.

Then make motorcycle noises during your race run. Relieves the tension.

edit: also, don't overtrain the day or two beforehand. I did relatively well on a couple courses just showing up the day of the race and getting 2-3 runs in total beforehand. I realized that I was overpracticing and that my body was just exhausted by riding the course so much...

 

[norbar]

How exactly are you training/practicing? One of the best things that I do (did...) was recreate the race at the end of the day beforehand. So top to bottom, at 90-95% of race pace. Full start in the starting gate, wait till it's clear enough that you don't have to catch/pass too many people and just go. For me the difference between cruising at 75% and racing at 95% is HUGE, and while I'm smooth and quick at 75, racing at 95% requires an entirely different mindset. Keep it at 90-95% so (hopefully) you don't crash your brains out during a practice run, but it gives you a great feeling on how different sections link up, and what speed/exhaustion level you're going to be at at different points.

Then make motorcycle noises during your race run. Relieves the tension.

edit: also, don't overtrain the day or two beforehand. I did relatively well on a couple courses just showing up the day of the race and getting 2-3 runs in total beforehand. I realized that I was overpracticing and that my body was just exhausted by riding the course so much...

Actualy when I'm in my race run I do like 50% of my speed. The problem is that it's a bit the other way around you say. I'm never happy with the speed I'm going, even after a great day of practice when I scare the **** out of myself but I'm double dissapointed when I can't keep up with that tempo the day before.
The overpractising problem is also something I have to deal with. I've had a very bad result this year due to this. The problem is with the fact that I always find something to improve in my run so I tend to ride till I have no power left (or actualy till the lift closes).
Also I think I have a problem with the fact I'm a slow learner in terms of how quick I adapt to new courses. Especialy the ones that don't suit me (the ones that are more flowy instead of techy where you can ride sketchy and just use strange moves to go fast).

I hope it will go away as I do more races this season instead of a ocasional event like in the previous years.
Thanks for everyone for the advice. Even if it sounds obvious (to me or anyone) sometimes its good to hear it from someone else. Keep em comming

 

[Muttely]

ive done 3 race this year, 1 i didnt have a bike for, 1 was cancelled and 1 my forks exploded and i didnt have a front brake.

Not cool.

 

[smithyM1]

I've been doing much more racing this season that for the last couple years and one thing bugs me. When I train in the day/days before the race I can go very fast and ride with a tempo I'm happy with but when my race run comes I get very cautious of not making mistakes, going smooth etc. and I get results that are worse than my ridding budies that on training (and on most other days) are considerably slower than me.

Has anyone had similar problems and how you delt with them? A friend of mine went to a sport schrink or sth but I think it's a bit extreme.

Mate...i feel your pain!!

Last season was by far my best, despite wrecking my knee half-way through the season i still managed to get bumped up to expert. Fast fwd 6months, new bike etc etc and i'm getting beaten by people i was smoking last season. Now, i'll probably get slated for saying this but i partly blame the bike(Orange). I'm used to riding linkage bikes, ie, Intense & Iron Horse and sure, the 224 is a really good bike but i'm just not gelling with it and this is screwing me up mentally, it's almost like i get on the bike expecting not to get a result....
So, at the end of the season i'll buying a trusty Iron Horse!

 

[norbar]

Mate...i feel your pain!!

Last season was by far my best, despite wrecking my knee half-way through the season i still managed to get bumped up to expert. Fast fwd 6months, new bike etc etc and i'm getting beaten by people i was smoking last season. Now, i'll probably get slated for saying this but i partly blame the bike(Orange). I'm used to riding linkage bikes, ie, Intense & Iron Horse and sure, the 224 is a really good bike but i'm just not gelling with it and this is screwing me up mentally, it's almost like i get on the bike expecting not to get a result....
So, at the end of the season i'll buying a trusty Iron Horse!

The gear imho affects riding more than most people care to admit. No comfy on a bike no ride If you changed the whole bike I'd see what also changed beside the frame. For me the biggest positive change this year was body position and finally setting up my fork how I like it. In my opinion you can get most bikes to feel reasonably comfortable with some minor tweaks. I'm currently riding a frame 100% oposite to my riding style and still feel good on it after some changes (wide bars are the way to go ).

 

[dante]

Actualy when I'm in my race run I do like 50% of my speed. The problem is that it's a bit the other way around you say. I'm never happy with the speed I'm going, even after a great day of practice when I scare the **** out of myself but I'm double dissapointed when I can't keep up with that tempo the day before.
The overpractising problem is also something I have to deal with. I've had a very bad result this year due to this. The problem is with the fact that I always find something to improve in my run so I tend to ride till I have no power left (or actualy till the lift closes).
Also I think I have a problem with the fact I'm a slow learner in terms of how quick I adapt to new courses. Especialy the ones that don't suit me (the ones that are more flowy instead of techy where you can ride sketchy and just use strange moves to go fast).

I hope it will go away as I do more races this season instead of a ocasional event like in the previous years.
Thanks for everyone for the advice. Even if it sounds obvious (to me or anyone) sometimes its good to hear it from someone else. Keep em comming

Unless you're in INSANE shape, this is probably one of the biggest problems right there. Tiring yourself out the Saturday beforehand will rob you of speed and explosive power that you'll need on Sunday. Ride some, relax, ride some, relax, etc. Take it easy on the course to learn it, do 1-2 high speed runs at the end, go once or twice the next morning to see if anything's changed, and then charge it at full strength in your race run.

 

[smithyM1]

The gear imho affects riding more than most people care to admit. No comfy on a bike no ride If you changed the whole bike I'd see what also changed beside the frame. For me the biggest positive change this year was body position and finally setting up my fork how I like it. In my opinion you can get most bikes to feel reasonably comfortable with some minor tweaks. I'm currently riding a frame 100% oposite to my riding style and still feel good on it after some changes (wide bars are the way to go ).

I know what you mean. I rode the Sunday for 3years and loved it, it suited me perfectly. I decided to go with the Orange though as it was a chance to be on a good team. Most of the kit on the Orange is similar as i wanted to make it feel as similar as i could to the Sunday-wide bars etc. The main difference is suspension, the angles on the Orange are spot on imo but i find the bike really fussy, especially when braking in the rough stuff. i found the Sunday was very neutral whereas to get the most out of the Orange it requires you to ride off the back which doesnt really suit me + i'm too far set in my ways to change!

 

[norbar]

Unless you're in INSANE shape, this is probably one of the biggest problems right there. Tiring yourself out the Saturday beforehand will rob you of speed and explosive power that you'll need on Sunday. Ride some, relax, ride some, relax, etc. Take it easy on the course to learn it, do 1-2 high speed runs at the end, go once or twice the next morning to see if anything's changed, and then charge it at full strength in your race run.

On shorter courses it's not a problem. At least I don't feel tired on the tracks right now. Have some problem with leg fitness after an injury but as long as the track isn't to pedaly or tires my leg in any other way I won't feel tired. Unless you are talking about the fact that even though I don't feel tired I may go slower because I'm an idiot who's slow when his organism suggests it's time to stop.

 

[davec113]

Seems like you need practice with actually being in a race race, so I'd try to recreate the event and practice that. Maybe you and a few buds do short, informal races for a round of drinks so you get used to being timed and having it count for something...

 

[rosenamedpoop]

Do this.

Advil (600mg) + redbull 45 minutes before your run.

2 shots of whiskey + 1 pint of water 10 minutes before your run.


Not joking, did this many times. Works well.






.

 

[zipper]

Hey mate are you doing any track walks pre race day? I find if you do your obvious one before you hit the track first up, then do a few more pre race run. Making sure your lines still are the most effective and that your using 100% of each corner/feature.

As said before the more fun you have the quicker you go, the more it feels like your local track the more comfortable you'l feel flat out.

And when it comes down to it your only ever racing yourself, forget everyone else.

 

[jnooth]

go buy a cheap watch. set it on stopwatch, then mount it on your handlebar.

practice doing timed runs. the clock is what is adding all the pressure so if you practice with the clock it gets easier. it also helps make you faster. you can play with what lines result in faster times. weather a flowy smooth run is faster then a full out pinned run. It also gives you some idea where you stand before you cross the finish line.

 

[P.T.W]

What i found a few years ago, Was i was getting better results respectively at big national races than i was at smaller local races. I worked out that i was putting to much pressure on myself at the local events as i was kinda expecting to do well, an rode tight/crashed etc as a result.
Where at national races i didn't really expect so much an rode waaay better an got better results as i didnt have that pressure.
What i do now is not worry about who I'm trying to beat or what others are doing or where I'm going to get.... I do though set my self a time goal for that track to chase down, an if i match or beat it I'm happy.

 

[AR_]

Then make motorcycle noises during your race run. Relieves the tension.

Scientifically proven to make you go faster. And if you're loud enough everyone on the way down gets a good giggle too, it's win win

It's better to ride full on, crash in a race run and come lower down the pack, than ride a clean cautious run and come lower down in the pack. At least with the first method you can blame it on something more tangible

 

[Pegboy]

I may be off here, but if you are truely riding at 50% during a race, why wory about line choice? Slow is slow, doesn't matter what line you ride. Stop worrying so much about the lines and just ride fast...I'm sure that is what you are doing when you are ridding with your buddies. I'm going to guess that you are not making a living at this, not on the cusp of securing some world cup opportunities and maybe not even "sponsored"..so who cares. Try remebering a couple key spots on the course and just look ahead and haul ass the rest of the way. When line choice becomes the difference between being on the podium or not, then give it more thought. Ride as fast as you can and have fun...nothing else matters.

 

[Iridemtb]

Last year I had this problem. It is simple... Get up on that line with the attitude that you are going to shred this course. And also play it slightly conservative if you are not super comfortable from practicing it.

I.E:
I don't know about you guys, but did you ever go to hit a really big jump, or a gnarly turn, and think, "I am going to whip out so far moto style and go light speed", or in the turn, "I am going to scrape my bars to the ground, and push my bike till there's roost". Unless you have that confidence, I would play it a bit more conservative. Downhill racing is after all going as fast as you can without crashing. It's that simple.

Someone older who used to race a LOT of downhill told me that you need to ride your practice runs closer to the side you race at. If you aren't going almost race speed, then your going to slow in practice, and if you go to fast in the race, you could get injured or lose all your time.

So get up on the gate/line/deck and thing to yourself "I am a BOSS, I will own this course, I have practiced it a lot"

OR~if you didn't practice much

"I am still a BOSS, and I will ride fast, and just play it a little more conservative in a few tricky sections".

Oh, and don't let that boss thing go to your head or act cocky to other people, that will help.

 

[norbar]

Hey mate are you doing any track walks pre race day? I find if you do your obvious one before you hit the track first up, then do a few more pre race run. Making sure your lines still are the most effective and that your using 100% of each corner/feature.

As said before the more fun you have the quicker you go, the more it feels like your local track the more comfortable you'l feel flat out.

And when it comes down to it your only ever racing yourself, forget everyone else.

I do track walks. I do all that should be done with racing but I psyche myself out when the clock is on. I don't have a tempo that doesn't satisfy me at practice so the speed I have then is not a problem. The problem is I'm slower after it and it makes me go Tom Cruize Mad.

 

[rockofullr]

Get some of that old nervousness back! I'm not saying that you should be scared . What I mean is that feeling of anticipation when your body gets itself ready for something intense. (just thinking about being in the start gate gives me goosebumps)

I get this feeling in every sport I've ever competed in. I even used to get that feeling before a big test in school. It helps me focus, and push myself.

Maybe what I'm talking about is getting yourself "amped" for the race. You should feel like you are gonna explode out of the start gate.

On the other hand don't work yourself up to the point where you stop thinking and can't visualize your line or start riding crazy. It doesn't sound like you are a person who has that problem though.

I can't say for sure but I assume that even the fastest pros feel their heart speed up in the start gate. I know I have seen big Steve talking about how he gets mental amped before a race.

 

[slowitdown]

I've been doing much more racing this season that for the last couple years and one thing bugs me. When I train in the day/days before the race I can go very fast and ride with a tempo I'm happy with but when my race run comes I get very cautious of not making mistakes, going smooth etc. and I get results that are worse than my ridding budies that on training (and on most other days) are considerably slower than me.

Has anyone had similar problems and how you delt with them? A friend of mine went to a sport schrink or sth but I think it's a bit extreme.

It's psychological for sure.

Here's what I'd say based on reading your posts here.

1) You're a guy who cares about doing well in DH and you study it. You have a good amount of knowledge regarding the information side of DH.

2) You're positive and helpful.

3) You want to improve, and this thread says you're willing to see where you have weaknesses.

I would say your challenge is to drop the information side of things that you seem to enjoy, to drop the analytic side of riding. Of course I don't know you personally but I'd wager you're an analytic person by nature. This creates a psychological obstacle.

Your deficiency in a race run has to do with preoccupation. You need to relax and get into a different mind.

I suggest imagining yourself a predator who must chase down his evening meal. Imagine yourself a leopard, or cheetah. And imagine that if you don't catch that meal, you're going to starve to death.

Think about that one for a good while. Then when you next take a run on a DH course, try to see how it works for you.

What I'm suggesting here is getting into a mindset where you MUST go faster and you MUST rely on instinct to do that faster travel. If you think of yourself as a predator, you're probably going to realize that a cheetah or leopard doesn't talk about technique or equipment -- it just gets down to the business of hauling ass after its prey.

 

[P.T.W]

Isnt that over thinking the "over thinking"???

Less thinking more hitting i say

 

[norbar]

Isnt that over thinking the "over thinking"???

Less thinking more hitting i say

Whatever works I did try 2 races balls out totaly but one was plagued with mechanicals (sort of, I've had some new something in my 888 internals and I ripped off the clips of my boots) and the other one ended with a good 15-30 (far ) feet flight without my bike down a steep slope and ending running from a crazy doctor who instead of giving me some ice for hurting muscles wanted to scan me for everything including swine flu and aliens controling my brain.