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vivid vs ccdb vs bos dh07

djamgils

Monkey
Aug 31, 2007
349
0
Holland
probably too early to tell how the vivid and bos shocks are performing but a theoretical opinion is also appreciated.

I have a intense socom with a dhx5.0 It is not that I am unhappy with the performance of the dhx but I am always curious if it could be better.

To start with a price comparison. vivid 280euro, ccdb 760euro bos 600euro. All of the prices are without spring. As you can see the vivid is very cheap comparing to the others. So the vivid wins on this point.

Next thing is concept. Vivid is a twin tube with HSR, LSR and LSC
CCDB is a twin tube with HSR, LSR, HSC, LSC
bos is twin tube or de carbon? with HSC, LSC, LSR
So the ccdb has the most adjustability. But will I miss the HSC adjuster on the vivid or the HSR on the bos? what adjuster is more important.

Also last but not least I am certainly no sam hill or even not a nico vink(for those who dont know him he is a fairly succesful belgium dh racer) I just ride for fun. But am personaly interested in suspension kinematics. So will I need a ccdb or bos, probably not. But is curiousity enough motivation to spend the cash?
 

bizutch

Delicate CUSTOM flower
Dec 11, 2001
15,922
8
Over your shoulder whispering
I've yet to hear the guys at Cane Creek say that anyone was ever unhappy with their Double Barrel. My Double Barrel was the best upgrade I ever put on a bike, hands down. If only times weren't tough with my job, I'd have one still. :thumb:
 

djamgils

Monkey
Aug 31, 2007
349
0
Holland
I am not interested in pushing a dhx. I just think that the concept of the vivid and ccdb are much better. So I dont believe that even with pushing the shock it can come close to a ccdb or vivid.

also something that I have been thinking about. Is rockshox capable of using the full potential of the double barrel concept? This is their first year with the vivid, could consider it their first coil shock even maybe?

kevin are you by any chance riding a v10 (kevinv10)?
 

Kevin

Turbo Monkey
I am not interested in pushing a dhx. I just think that the concept of the vivid and ccdb are much better. So I dont believe that even with pushing the shock it can come close to a ccdb or vivid.

also something that I have been thinking about. Is rockshox capable of using the full potential of the double barrel concept? This is their first year with the vivid, could consider it their first coil shock even maybe?

kevin are you by any chance riding a v10 (kevinv10)?
I think youre definitly underestimating the DHX and definitly underestimating PUSH.
And yes. :thumb:
 

General Lee

Turbo Monkey
Oct 16, 2003
2,867
0
The 802
I've yet to hear the guys at Cane Creek say that anyone was ever unhappy with their Double Barrel. My Double Barrel was the best upgrade I ever put on a bike, hands down. If only times weren't tough with my job, I'd have one still. :thumb:
Really?

You must have missed their ad in the last Dirt where they ran a pharmaceutical-commercial style disclaimer listing all the possible adverse side effects. And there was another one in Decline encouraging people to buy from the competition and featuring quotes from unhappy customers. I think it is called their 'transparent ad campaign for full disclosure'

Seriously Butch, Marlboro hasn't said anything bad about their cigarettes either:disgust1:
 

bizutch

Delicate CUSTOM flower
Dec 11, 2001
15,922
8
Over your shoulder whispering
Really?

You must have missed their add in the last Dirt where they ran a pharmaceutical-commercial style disclaimer listing all the possible adverse side effects. And there was another add in Decline encouraging people to buy from the competition and featuring quotes from unhappy customers. I think it is called their 'transparent add campaign for full disclosure'

Seriously Butch, Marlboro hasn't said anything bad about their cigarettes either:disgust1:
ADD? what?

Man..you been rockin' your douche cape and tights for too long now.

Perk up.:busted:
 

jonKranked

Press Button, Receive Stupid
Nov 10, 2005
55,748
4,698
media blackout
You must have missed their add in the last Dirt where they ran a pharmaceutical-commercial style disclaimer listing all the possible adverse side effects. And there was another add in Decline encouraging people to buy from the competition and featuring quotes from unhappy customers. I think it is called "reverse psychology"
fixed :busted:
 

General Lee

Turbo Monkey
Oct 16, 2003
2,867
0
The 802
ADD? what?

Man..you been rockin' your douche cape and tights for too long now.

Perk up.:busted:
damn, beaten to the editing button by a bee's d*ck. . . well done(unoffial score: General Lee 10, Butch 3).

But, when you (or anyone else actually) say silly things like "no one at the company has ever said anyone was unhappy." Or, as you did a few weeks ago, claim an entire iron horse team was testing and racing with CCDB's all year when clearly they were not I'll be happy to point out your errors; and often with varying degrees of sarcasm.

If you are going to be so sensitive, perhaps you should get your facts and logic in order first?


Don't worry, Butch, I still love you:cupidarrow:
 

Renegade

Monkey
Sep 6, 2001
335
0
Having had this discussion with the O.P. over at mtbr, what he hasn't yet said is he does not doubt that a Pushed dhx or roco wouldn't be a nice shock; he wants a high performance shock with as many adjustments as possible so that he can tune it himself for whatever conditions he is riding that day.
 

General Lee

Turbo Monkey
Oct 16, 2003
2,867
0
The 802
Having had this discussion with the O.P. over at mtbr, what he hasn't yet said is he does not doubt that a Pushed dhx or roco wouldn't be a nice shock; he wants a high performance shock with as many adjustments as possible so that he can tune it himself for whatever conditions he is riding that day.

well, if that's the case then the answer is easy: He should get the Cane Creek because of all the high-performace shocks in question it has the greatest # of adjustments.
 

bizutch

Delicate CUSTOM flower
Dec 11, 2001
15,922
8
Over your shoulder whispering
damn, beaten to the editing button by a bee's d*ck. . . well done(unoffial score: General Lee 10, Butch 3).

But, when you (or anyone else actually) say silly things like "no one at the company has ever said anyone was unhappy." Or, as you did a few weeks ago, claim an entire iron horse team was testing and racing with CCDB's all year when clearly they were not I'll be happy to point out your errors; and often with varying degrees of sarcasm.

If you are going to be so sensitive, perhaps you should get your facts and logic in order first?


Don't worry, Butch, I still love you:cupidarrow:

when I'm told by Cane Creek employees there are riders on the IH/Hondadaddy team running them, I regurgitate it verbatim. Nowhere did I say "entire team". You been holding that link in the clipboard for a while and just waiting to use it eh?:nerd:

And as for spittin' silly things..you sir are a "pro" henceforth a public figure and therefore can be parodied at will by us, the general pee-ons. Just like Brangelica....:weee:
 

Kevin

Turbo Monkey
wants a high performance shock with as many adjustments as possible so that he can tune it himself for whatever conditions he is riding that day.
I dont want to adjust my shock to every single track I ride.
I just want a shock that I can set up once and dont have to worry about ever again. A fork could be a different story.
I doubt that theres many people who change their shock settings every time they ride another track and I also doubt theres a lot of people that can actually adjust it perfectly in the one or maybee two days they ride a track without telemetry or a suspension guru with m.

But hey if someone wants to spend more time adjusting a shock then actually riding then be my guest.
Whatever floats your boat.

That said Ive never ridden a DB so maybee I just dont know what Im missing...
 

djamgils

Monkey
Aug 31, 2007
349
0
Holland
It isn't about the absolute number of adjustments, its about the usefull amount of adjusters. Thats why I am asking if it would be beneficial having the HSC adjuster featured on the ccdb(over the vivid).

about the perfect setup. does it exist? It is always a compromise and there is a clear difference between a track like willingen and champery. Even for a amateur I think the difference in setup for those 2 tracks is noticable.
I ride for fun, I get the fun from everything involved with biking even seting up suspension. Like said in another thread I even enjoy looking at bikes.

Maybe I am underestimating the work of push. But after push worked on the dhx you still have a shock with vague adjustability and it still works according the same concept.
Also regarding push and al the other tuners and shock manufacturers. The way they design the damping curve is how they think the compromise should be.

At this point I am leaning towards the vivid because concept wise this is comparable to the ccdb but for a much better price.

you dont know what youre missing until you experienced it.
 

General Lee

Turbo Monkey
Oct 16, 2003
2,867
0
The 802
when I'm told by Cane Creek employees there are riders on the IH/Hondadaddy team running them, I regurgitate it verbatim. Nowhere did I say "entire team". You been holding that link in the clipboard for a while and just waiting to use it eh?:nerd:

And as for spittin' silly things..you sir are a "pro" henceforth a public figure and therefore can be parodied at will by us, the general pee-ons. Just like Brangelica....:weee:
you mean Bangelina, or Benifer, or TomKat, or . . . i think i just threw up in my mouth.

do you have a pet name for me then?:cupidarrow:
 

Kevin

Turbo Monkey
Well I just set the shock at the beginning of the year and keep those settings on every track I ride, as do most pro's. (not saying Im a pro)
You mentioned Nico Vink in your first post, I know him pretty good and even he doenst change shock settings per track :lighten:
I think if a shock is set up properly it can handle all conditions.

Any suspension guru correct me if Im wrong please...
 

djamgils

Monkey
Aug 31, 2007
349
0
Holland
I think if a shock is set up properly it can handle all conditions.

Any suspension guru correct me if Im wrong please...
Theoretically speaking it isn't possible to get the best amount of damping for each type of bump out of one damper. It is always a compromise.
But in practice we also have arms and legs wich are actually highly sofisticated dampers and those arms and legs can adjust itself to the type of bump to a certain level.
Just as an example on willingen you would like to have more propedal/lsc because of the amount of pedalling and smoothness of the track then on champery where you are more busy slowing down because it is so steep.

Djamgils, what is it about the DHXs performance that you dont like?
I know it has problems with the v10 suspension but how does it effect your ride on a SOCOM that could be improved?
I would like to ride without propedal on it because it is my understanding that this is actually a blow off valve like in the swingers but without the propedal I need more boost valve to compensate but this gives a negative reaction on how much hSC I would like.
I could be completely wrong with this but that is the reason that I would like to have a shock that where I can understand and isolate the adjustments made.
 

-FLUIDRIDE-

Monkey
Jun 27, 2007
156
0
Hmmm... I didn't realize the IH Honda program was still going...

when I'm told by Cane Creek employees there are riders on the IH/Hondadaddy team running them, I regurgitate it verbatim. Nowhere did I say "entire team". You been holding that link in the clipboard for a while and just waiting to use it eh?:nerd:

And as for spittin' silly things..you sir are a "pro" henceforth a public figure and therefore can be parodied at will by us, the general pee-ons. Just like Brangelica....:weee:
 
you can't just combine two full names together ya dumb hick. -10pts:plthumbsdown:
That's pretty funny, a guy with a screen name "general lee" calling someone else a dumb hick!!

back to the topic: I can't comment on the vivid, but I've ridden DHX 5.0's on both my SX trail and Demo 8 and have replaced both with a ccdb. The ride is very different. To me the bike rides so much better especially in the rough stuff with the ccdb. The ccdb just locks the rear wheel to the ground and smooths everything out. I have never ridden a pushed DHX though so can't compare that. The adjustability of the ccdb is nice too. Doesn't take a engineers degree either like many people claim it does to set up. Just a little patience and trying different settings. The only shock that I'm putting on my DH bikes from now on.
 

FCLinder

Turbo Monkey
Mar 6, 2002
4,403
0
Greenville, South Carolina
Hands down the CC DB is the best feeling shock out there and will make any SP bike feel like a MPB. Been on mainy of them. With that said it will also cost you the most. I have a new RS Vivid and can say its the next best thing to the CC DB in feel. Its so easy to setup and think it will be the shock of choice n 08 because of the cost factor. Hands down a much better shock than the DHX. The funny thing is most riders really don't now how to setup their DHX's and never really feel the ture feeling of it. I know how to set them up (Don't ask me because I don't want to have to type it out to explan how). With that said one day on he Vivid and have yet to get the final dial in it already feels way better than my DHX did.

Hope this helps out some,
Cecil
 

djamgils

Monkey
Aug 31, 2007
349
0
Holland
@FCLinder with the vivid how big is the adjustment range of the LSC. Is that comparible to the ccdb?
When comparing the vivid to the ccdb do you miss the HSC adjuster? Have you tried different bottom out bumpers?
I have read the vivid service manual I guess it would be possible to change the HSC by changing shims on either the main piston or in the reservoir.

At this point I am leaning towards the vivid. Its cheaper, seems to work for the couple of people that have it. And it is possible to service it yourself, with that I presume that isn't possible with the ccdb.
But somewhere in my mind I keep hearing a voice, what if the ccdb would be better. the only way to find out is by buying one.
 

FCLinder

Turbo Monkey
Mar 6, 2002
4,403
0
Greenville, South Carolina
@FCLinder with the vivid how big is the adjustment range of the LSC. Is that comparible to the ccdb?
When comparing the vivid to the ccdb do you miss the HSC adjuster? Have you tried different bottom out bumpers?
I have read the vivid service manual I guess it would be possible to change the HSC by changing shims on either the main piston or in the reservoir.

At this point I am leaning towards the vivid. Its cheaper, seems to work for the couple of people that have it. And it is possible to service it yourself, with that I presume that isn't possible with the ccdb.
But somewhere in my mind I keep hearing a voice, what if the ccdb would be better. the only way to find out is by buying one.
Understand I have never owned a CC DB, but road on one for a full day up North in NJ. You can tell a change in the Vivids LSC or just C when you play around with it, much like the CC DB. With the Fox you only see a change in the last 5 Clicks. I have only ridden it one time and still need more time on it to make some changes like I said, but its way better than the DHX. Time will tell if its going to hold up though like the DHX has over the years.
 

Dhracer3

Monkey
Jan 10, 2006
155
0
Fletcher NC
Go with Cane Creek.... designed by Ohlins~... you can't beat that really? Shock is extremely reliable and performance is a night and day difference.