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what did he know & when did he know it?

dan-o

dan-o

Turbo Monkey
Jun 30, 2004
6,499
2,805
REMEMBER BENGHAZI!

Frother email I received today:



THE BATTLING BASTARDS of BENGHAZI



We're the Battling Bastards of Benghazi,

No fame, no glory, no paparazzi.

Just a firey death in a blazing hell,

Defending the country we loved so well,

It wasn't our job, but we answered the call,

Fought to the consulate, n scaled th' wall.

We pulled twenty countrymen from the jaws of fate,

Led them to safety, 'n stood at th' gate.

Just the two of us, 'n foe by th' score,

But we stood fast to bar th' door.

We called for reinforcement, but it was denied,

So we fought, 'n we fought, 'n we fought, 'n we died.

We gave our all for our Uncle Sam,

'n Obama didn't give a damn,

Just two dead SEALS, who carried the load,

No thanks to us, we were bumps in the road.


:blah:
 
dante

dante

Unabomber
Feb 13, 2004
8,807
9
looking for classic NE singletrack
$tinkle said:
CBS embargoed this until 24 hrs ago

KROFT: Mr. President, this morning you went out of your way to avoid the use of the word terrorism in connection with the Libya Attack, do you believe that this was a terrorism attack?

OBAMA: Well it’s too early to tell exactly how this came about, what group was involved, but obviously it was an attack on Americans. And we are going to be working with the Libyan government to make sure that we bring these folks to justice, one way or the other.​

classy
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If you want cowboy diplomacy of shoot first, find out what happened later, I'd suggest changing the Constitution in order to get Bush back into the presidency...
 
blackohio

blackohio

Generous jaywalker
Mar 12, 2009
2,773
122
Hellafornia. Formerly stumptown.
I would go ahead and de-friend anyone sending that bull**** out. I had to tell my grandmother years ago to stop sending me her idiotic, racist religious nonsense and reminded her that she hasnt been to church once in my entire lifetime, other than a wedding or funeral.
 
$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
kidwoo said:
You're slightly smarter than the average foxtard so I'll ask you.


what
****ing
difference
does
it
make
what
it's
called?
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dante said:
If you want cowboy diplomacy of shoot first, find out what happened later, I'd suggest changing the Constitution in order to get Bush back into the presidency...
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you 2, pay close attention: cbs fvcked this one up. there's no good reason why what we've now come to find out in the past few weeks made its way to the editing room floor, unless being in the tank for him is a good reason. as much as it pains hannity & co, obama was asked - and answered - all relevant questions.

as i've oft said or expressed here previously, he's been surprisingly (to me) effective in his foreign policy, of special note, the conflict formerly called the WOT
 
dante

dante

Unabomber
Feb 13, 2004
8,807
9
looking for classic NE singletrack
$tinkle said:
you 2, pay close attention: cbs fvcked this one up. there's no good reason why what we've now come to find out in the past few weeks made its way to the editing room floor, unless being in the tank for him is a good reason. as much as it pains hannity & co, obama was asked - and answered - all relevant questions.

as i've oft said or expressed here previously, he's been surprisingly (to me) effective in his foreign policy, of special note, the conflict formerly called the WOT
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So, uh, to echo Kidwoo.... Honestly, what is the big difference as to what it's called? Serious question.

You're saying that 12h after the worst attack on American soil since 9/11 the president should have come out and with almost no direct evidence made some definitive statement that could have utterly pissed off half the world if he'd been wrong? Seriously? If he'd come out and said "this was a terrorist act" and it turns out that the "evidence" was some unknown jihad group 500 miles away that saw the attack on the news and claimed credit for it, the right wing would have been all over him for it. Any time there's an attack (bombing, shooting, whatever) a dozen different groups initially claim credit for it, and 11+ of those claims are utter BS. The Republicans are claiming that Obama should have acted on those (mostly dubious) claims and called it "terrorism" while the building was still smoldering?

As was noted, it took the US 5 years to finally put out a definitive report on what happened on 9/11, but Obama should have jumped to conclusions after barely 12h? This is why so many of us are utterly bewildered by the Republican's "OMFG, Benghazi!!" statements. We (or at least I) have NO idea what the big deal is. Have an inquiry, find out what happened, present to the American public. To think that Obama should have known within **hours** what exactly happened is utterly ridiculous...

The Republicans have also burned any trust with the whole F&F bullsh!t last year. It was obvious that the Republicans only wanted to try to pin it on the Obama administration as opposed to finding out what exactly happened. You'll forgive me if that doesn't appear to be EXACTLY what's happening here as well...
 
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$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
dante said:
You're saying that 12h after the worst attack on American soil since 9/11
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nidal malik hasan sees what you did there
dante said:
To think that Obama should have known within **hours** what exactly happened is utterly ridiculous...
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so that's your standard now?
got it.
dante said:
The Republicans have also burned any trust with the whole F&F bullsh!t last year.
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i keep reading this post to see if it will edit itself, but it doesn't appear to want to. tell me, with the undeniable stonewalling that holder has done in the past years on f&f, why do you not express even the most casual & temporary disappointment? why do you continue to laud his position & handling of this debacle?

oh, i think i know now...
 
kidwoo

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Aug 25, 2003
42,146
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Squirtin ketchup n' mustard on charred flesh
$tinkle said:
you 2, pay close attention: cbs fvcked this one up.
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Now you pay close attention: You didn't answer my question. The reason you didn't answer my question is because a bunch of fvcktards getting desperate in an election they're about to lose told you it mattered what it was called. The response wouldn't have been any different. The preparations wouldn't have been any different, and now you've told yourself that something so insanely inconsequential would have changed the outcome. It wouldn't have. The people who make your thoughts for you now just want you to think that it matters. Fox news isn't the only one popping off about this 24-7 all by themselves because they're fair and balanced. You apparently need to be reminded of this every so often.
 
$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
kidwoo said:
Now you pay close attention: You didn't answer my question. The reason you didn't answer my question is because a bunch of fvcktards getting desperate in an election they're about to lose told you it mattered what it was called. The response wouldn't have been any different. The preparations wouldn't have been any different, and now you've told yourself that something so insanely inconsequential would have changed the outcome. It wouldn't have. The people who make your thoughts for you now just want you to think that it matters. Fox news isn't the only one popping off about this 24-7 all by themselves because they're fair and balanced. You apparently need to be reminded of this every so often.
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here's why it matters what it's called (and by extension, whodunnit):
dear leader said:
"And today, Al Qaeda is on the run and Osama bin Laden is dead."
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if that doesn't matter to you, then darth cheney isn't in his last throes

gee, got awful quiet now that i remind you of that.
 
kidwoo

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Aug 25, 2003
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Oh noes. Some douchebags in a recently 'liberated'(sic) shlthole with a bunch of loose firearms got all medieval on an american building in BFE-istan. It's like 9/11 all over again. Exactly like that. Totally. It's like the last 11 years never happened. No really :rofl:
 
dante

dante

Unabomber
Feb 13, 2004
8,807
9
looking for classic NE singletrack
$tinkle said:
i keep reading this post to see if it will edit itself, but it doesn't appear to want to. tell me, with the undeniable stonewalling that holder has done in the past years on f&f, why do you not express even the most casual & temporary disappointment? why do you continue to laud his position & handling of this debacle?

oh, i think i know now...
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Sorry, I thought that the result of a year+ investigation with Republicans screaming TREASON!!!! day after day would result in something more substantial than, uh, "casual and temporary disappointment". It's the modern-day equivalent of a stained dress...

The best I can get from the whole Benghazi situation is the Republican claim that "Obama lied" to the American people by being vague on a statement 12h after the event since all of the facts/inquiry weren't completed by that point. Is that it? Because of so....

OMFG, the horror!!!!! :panic:
 
MikeD

MikeD

Leader and Demogogue of the Ridemonkey Satinists
Oct 26, 2001
11,698
1,749
chez moi
I don't get the fury being unleashed about Susan Rice's statements. The video I've watched, she qualifies her statements twice: once saying that an FBI investigation is going on and the results will be what can tell what really happened, and prefacing her comments with "to the best of our knowledge based on what we can tell right now (or somesuch)" that a group of militants took advantage of a protest based on the youtube vid to attack the consulate.

People make it sound like she flat out denied anything else could have happened...I had to go back and re-watch the footage to make sure I wasn't smoking crack, because I recalled statements that sounded downright devoid of commitment to any particular narrative.


But no State Dept security officer I know has an emergency plan which involves the president spontaneously deciding to allocate military assets to start bombarding an area with standoff weapons. Nor were the decisions made about security on the ground made by Administration officials...professional bureaucrats do that within the budget, laws, and regulations they're given. And the Ambassador certainly knew the security situation and had not recommended a shut-down of the consulate and traveled there of his own volition...if he'd have suspected the situation to be totally untenable it would have been his call to vacate the facility. He didn't. Ultimate authority in-country rests with him, not even with the security officers.


Where I think there might be room for legitimate anger at a white-house level policy is the ready establishment of a consulate in a fairly non-permissive environment with questionable host-government support, which could be seen as an attempt to validate the POTUS's Libya policy in the face of grave risk.
 
kidwoo

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Aug 25, 2003
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Squirtin ketchup n' mustard on charred flesh
$tinkle said:
ok

that's actually funneh
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Just to reiterate that this was ALL about the election and nothing substantive for all the reasons everyone here including mikeD have layed out, here are the minor non-election headlines that fox news deems more worthy than benghazi right now.


Latest News
Pot, gay marriage set up state and federal battle
West falls short in re-election bid, isn't giving up yet
Syrian rebels fire at presidential palace, storm capital
Herman Cain calls for creation of third party
Bachmann narrowly retains Minnesota House seat
Murphy beats McMahon in Connecticut Senate race
GOP wins House, Dems fend off Senate challengers
McCaskill beats Akin in Missouri Senate race
39 reported dead in major Guatemala quake
Psychiatrists question psychiatry diagnostic manual
France pushes forward with bill to legalize gay marriage
LA voters decide porn actors must wear condoms
Michigan man charged in 4-county shooting spree
Homeowner arrested after shooting alleged intruders
Man behind anti-Muslim film sentenced to prison
Testimony suggests soldier knew he killed Afghans
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Do you fvcking get it yet?
 
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$tinkle

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
kidwoo said:
Just to reiterate that this was ALL about the election and nothing substantive for all the reasons everyone here including mikeD have layed out, here are the minor non-election headlines that fox news deems more worthy than benghazi right now.




Do you fvcking get it yet?
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if you look closer, the first letters of each spell out B-E-N-G-H-A-Z-I

now gonna go legally make some chemtrails
 
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J

jasride

Turbo Monkey
Sep 23, 2006
1,069
5
PA
Anyone know about the man who wrote this article?



http://pjmedia.com/barryrubin/2012/10/29/a-short-guide-to-the-benghazi-issue-what-is-it-really-all-about/

Competence and Courage

Once upon a time a candidate for the Democratic presidential nomination warned that if Obama were elected president he would not be reliable in a crisis when answering a 3 a.m. phone call requiring instant response. That claim, of course, came from Hillary Clinton. Benghazi was that phone call.

That conclusion is reinforced by the killing of al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden. Notice something of huge importance that has been neglected. Obama and his supporters bragged about his indecision on the no-brainer of getting the architect of the September 11 attacks. If he would hesitate on an obvious call like that one, how would he deal with a consulate under attack in Benghazi?

There is, or should be, a sacred trust between the U.S. government and those who put themselves in harm’s way for the sake of America. Everything should be done to protect and save them. In this case, however, the country’s leaders let those people down both before and during the crisis.

Note, too, how revealingly Obama responded to this issue in the presidential debate. Once the crisis was over, Obama said, he swung into action, securing those who still survived, investigating who was responsible, and promising to punish them.

What about before and during the multi-hour assault? Silence. The details — for example, whether there was a drone overhead — obscure the fact that no proper preparations were made for the ambassador and consulate being unprotected and that passivity prevailed during the battle.

If the U.S. government didn’t trust the Libyans, wouldn’t that show that America thought itself superior and that its interests should override those of others? And isn’t that racist?

One could say that the Obama administration’s failure to act denotes incompetence, and there is truth there. But the larger picture is that it was a failure due to its concept of America and the world. The real danger is not from totalitarian enemies grown bolder by the fact of American weakness and a loss of self-confidence. No, according to the prevailing view, it was rather excessive American self-confidence and strength in the past.

The effort to change those bad old ways (and to open a new era with completely different behavior) and the failure to perceive the real enemies and to understand America’s rights and duties were the causes of the incident in Benghazi, and many other setbacks as well.

The chickens have come back to roost and have roosted in the White House. And the vultures are gathering.
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johnbryanpeters

johnbryanpeters

Hero
Sep 27, 2001
36,136
16,612
Making moss sad in New Haven, Vermont
MikeD said:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/18/magazine/christopher-stevens-and-the-problem-of-american-diplomacy.html?pagewanted=1&smid=fb-share

Not a bad read.
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It does not just apply to embassies.

Police stations have turned into paranoid fortresses - used to be you'd walk in the door and there was a desk behind which was a Desk Sergeant - immediately accessible point of contact. Today there's a buzzer, a camera, and possibly no one on the premises.

Corporate offices, factories, power facilities, ditto. Of course, it don't stop the good old boys from coming in and stealing copper, nor do I think at the end of the day it does squat to deter the imagined terrorist du jour...

And I think we have recently discussed borders with our neighbors.
 
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