[sanjuro]

I was thinking about the Dems message last night. Obviously two points are going to be hammered: Get rid of the Republicans and No Way McCain.

But what is McCain going to say next week? Republicans are doing a great job? I heart Bush?

It does remind me of the screw job the Clintons received at the end of Bill's last term. It basically nullified his popularity, forcing Gore to run on his own strengths.

 

[MMike]

Live from New York! It's Saturday Night!

SOMEONE has to say it eventually...

 

[Secret Squirrel]

I'd expect his speech to go along the lines that the dems are out of touch with reality and hammering home the points that we're now safer or some such rot...

 

[$tinkle]

I was thinking about the Dems message last night.

which was what? that if you elect a democrat you'll no longer have to struggle to pay your bills, or that equal pay for equal work will happen without having to move to find a job?

i think anyone who fools people into thinking this could happen for the first time in our country's history is odious & deceitful. they should just say they'll put more money in your (lower- & lower/middle-class) pocket & leave it at that. in order to accomplish everything they said would require nothing short of a dictatorship (neither of which i believe would happen).

 

[ohio]

which was what? that if you elect a democrat you'll no longer have to struggle to pay your bills, or that equal pay for equal work will happen without having to move to find a job?

I don't think anyone is claiming to have a magic wand to instant utopia, but it IS reasonable to expect that good policy could improve conditions:

- have you struggle LESS to pay your bills
- achieve closer to equal pay for equal work
along with...
- improve your healthcare or decrease your healthcare burden
- decrease dependence on foreign oil

etc. etc.

do you really think the democrats are claiming teleportation rather than redirection?

 

[$tinkle]

do you really think the democrats are claiming teleportation rather than redirection?

dennis kucinich did speak last night; was he reigned in? i don't know, but it could have been his missed golden opportunity

 

[reflux]

1) Gays are the evil of society
2) Illegal immigrants are poisoning our society
3) Democrats hate freedom, liberty, and all things 'merican.
4) Whoa, where am I?

 

[Defenestrated]

which was what? that if you elect a democrat you'll no longer have to struggle to pay your bills, or that equal pay for equal work will happen without having to move to find a job?

i think anyone who fools people into thinking this could happen for the first time in our country's history is odious & deceitful. they should just say they'll put more money in your (lower- & lower/middle-class) pocket & leave it at that. in order to accomplish everything they said would require nothing short of a dictatorship (neither of which i believe would happen).

or we could invade iran

 

[MMike]

"matloooooock!!!!!!"

 

[dante]

1) Gays are the evil of society
2) Illegal immigrants are poisoning our society
3) Democrats hate freedom, liberty, and all things 'merican.
4) Whoa, where am I?

5) Terrorism
6) War on Terror
7) We've been kept save for 7 years by our strong foreign policy
8) 9/11
9) Terrorism
10) Gays
11) Abortion
12) Terrorism
13) Lower taxes cure cancer
14) How the bush tax cuts were good and lead to increased revenue
15) 9/11
16) Terrorism

Hmmmmm. I might've missed one (terrorism? lower taxes=capitalist utopia?), but that's probably about it. He's going to have to walk a fine line between "I know you're not that happy about bush's legacy" and "These parts of bush's legacy were great".

edit: oh, definitely forgot talking point #17, "How making Bush's tax cuts for the top 0.1% of Americans permanent will average out to $2,000 savings per person when spread out among all 300million citizens (150,000 people - $1 million in savings each, 299,850,000 people - $0)

also
18) Inflation really isn't that bad, and certainly wasn't caused by reckless fiscal policy or tax cuts
19) How the increasing pay for CEOs is indicative of overall worker pay increases
20) Foreclosure isn't really that bad, since those people can go live in one of their other 6 houses...

 

[$tinkle]

dante: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/29/business/29econ.html?ref=business
if the nytimes can swallow their pride & acknowledge our strong-ish fundamentals, why can't you?
btw, i'm gobbling up chinese large caps today on the fire sale of this news

 

[dante]

dante: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/29/business/29econ.html?ref=business
if the nytimes can swallow their pride & acknowledge our strong-ish fundamentals, why can't you?
btw, i'm gobbling up chinese large caps today on the fire sale of this news

where exactly did I talk about the fundamentals of the economy?

and from the article:

Consumer spending, which amounts to more than two-thirds of the nation’s economic activity, grew at a 1.7 percent rate in the second quarter, up from the original 1.5 percent increase. That figure is still low by historical standards, reflecting anxiety among Americans about the weak job market and higher energy prices that are putting a strain on household budgets.

Americans are spending more on smaller items and discounted products, putting a pall on sales of durable goods, which are items intended to last three years or more. Purchases of these goods, like dishwashers and automobiles, dropped 2.5 percent from April to June, even as spending on other types of goods grew. That was a smaller decrease than the originally reported 3 percent drop for the quarter.

if I'm not mistaken, consumer spending is based on dollars, not units, and the CPI in the 2nd qtr were up more than 1.7%... therefore consumer spending actually DROPPED, it's just that they were spending more on the items they bought.

edit: also, don't forget that there was $100b in rebate checks mailed out during this period, and enough stores have issued guidance that their 3rd/4th qtr sales aren't going to be as strong.

 

[$tinkle]

where exactly did I talk about the fundamentals of the economy?

your litany was econ-based, so i ran w/ it

it's just that they were spending more on the items they bought.

that's quite the tautological statement there

edit: also, don't forget that there was $100b in rebate checks mailed out during this period, and enough stores have issued guidance that their 3rd/4th qtr sales aren't going to be as strong.

traditionally, 4th qtr sales are the strongest due to holiday shopping; 1st & 3rd compete for lowest as they're bookends of the 4th. as always, i'll take a wait-and-see approach.

either way, i don't see either candidate contributing significantly right from the jump, so there's plenty of "blame bush" left in the cupboards

 

[dante]

your litany was econ-based, so i ran w/ it

anything there was small-picture, as in general salary/purchasing strength (down in the past 8 years), or rising foreclosures (again, up in the past couple years). I'm not convinced of the strength (or weakness) of the current economy, but I can say it's probably not as rosy as the bulls make it out to be, or as dire as the bears claim.

as for today's rally, I thought that this was pretty telling:

^DJI 11,688.96 186.45 1.62%
^GSPC 1,295.41 13.75 1.07%
^MID 817.53 5.32 0.66%
^SML 386.79 1.98 0.51%

DOW's Industrial stocks are up 1.62%, the 500 Large caps are up 1.07%, Mid caps are .66% and Small caps are .51%. The few big guys who are exporting are pulling a lot of this up, and everything else is going along for the ride. Not that I'm complaining, but it's not exactly a healthy, broad-based rally...



(damn, can we get n8 back in here? $tinkle's trying his best to fill in the "economy's doing fine, lets go republicans" slot, but still... )

 

[IH8Rice]

"blah blah blah, the Democrats suck, we are better" ..the same thing the Democrats said about the republicans....

 

[$tinkle]

DOW's Industrial stocks are up 1.62%, the 500 Large caps are up 1.07%, Mid caps are .66% and Small caps are .51%. The few big guys who are exporting are pulling a lot of this up, and everything else is going along for the ride. Not that I'm complaining, but it's not exactly a healthy, broad-based rally...

seems to me fund mgrs are also to credit for today's rally. if they went w/ the sm caps their prices would be more artificially inflated than djia/lg caps. it's kind of hard to move the magellen fund w/o drawing attention.

 

[jimmydean]

"You damn kids, get off my lawn!"

 

[dante]

"blah blah blah, the Democrats suck, we are better" ..the same thing the Democrats said about the republicans....

swing, and a miss.

 

[Slugman]

He is probably re-writing his speach right about now...

 

[dante]

He is probably re-writing his speach right about now...

"To all of my fellow Americans. We're not *that* bad, really..."

 

[$tinkle]

swing, and a miss.

how you figure? for a convention to forgo lauding their party at the expense of the other is political malpractice.

 

[J-Dubs]

"I'll take the wait and see approach" - stinkle - Distinctly Republican, still waiting for the trickle down.

McSellOut will try to avoid talking about his previous ideals and focus on his new ones which reflect the party's agenda.
That and he will lie and distort Obama's plans in an effort convince people that he will raise mid-class taxes. (Unfortunately the facts are on Obama's side and that he will cut mid-class taxes more than McSame's plan will.)

And the inevitable - "I'm a war hero because I got shot down in a combat mission"

 

[stinkyboy]

 

[JohnE]

I think he will tell Palin to have her daughter keep her legs together...