I am quite happy with the Spesh Eliminator Blckdmndmdmdmd
1050g for a 27.5/2.3 tire.
1050g for a 27.5/2.3 tire.
What trail bike tire casings don't suck?
- Thread starter Kanye West
- Start date
I'm pretty into the Hutchinson Griffus 2.4 as a fast-ish rolling rear tire that actually grips well. Probably slightly slower rolling and grippier than an Aggressor, but in that same ballpark. Their burlier casing option is solid, but also impressively supple for how burly it is.
I've had my time on several Vittoria Graphene tires (although not the Martello in particular), and the transition from "good" to "skidland" is really notorious. As they use a dual compound construction (harder on the foundations, softer on the cover), once that soft top layer gets worn, you end up with a no-grip tire.
I love the Aggressor as a rear tire. Great climbing grip, rolling speed, and wear. Braking and cornering grip are good enough for general riding but for racing the lack of a 3C option holds it back. That's when I'd switch it for a Dissector.
That was such an awful review roundup, even by Pinkbike standards. It was like, let's review a bunch of shitty tires that ignorant people try as alternatives to good tires.
Both the Aggressor and Hans Dampf are truly awful in dry, dusty, loose over hard conditions. Neither brake for shit, and slide uncontrollably as soon as you even think about leaning your bike over.
The Wild Enduro Rear is a pretty good summer tire (for conditions above), but as they said, it wears incredibly fast.
I'm currently trying out the Dissector DD MG. I ran the EXO MT version last year and liked it except found it wore extremely quickly, and needed higher pressure and an insert for stability. So far the DD version seems to be a lot more stable (as you'd expect) but still needs about 1-2 psi more than a DD DHR. The MG compound is :chefskiss: on hardpacked berms. Durability still TBD.
I'm really curious to hear more about the Hutchinson tires. I know Yoann has been raving about them, but he's apparently running some prototype rubber compound.
I pretty much just leave the Aggressors for us on my small travel bike for general trail riding. I'd take a Dissector in dusty conditions any day over an Aggressor, and DHR2 the rest of the time. There's plenty of good riders who run the Aggressors though, but I never found them particularly confidence inspiring.
I've got one of the new Schwalbe Big Bettys in the garage waiting to be installed. It seems likely to grip very well but I have a feeling its going to roll horribly. I might be wrong but we will see.
I've got one of the new Schwalbe Big Bettys in the garage waiting to be installed. It seems likely to grip very well but I have a feeling its going to roll horribly. I might be wrong but we will see.
my dirt
I'm running schwalbe super gravity rear and super trail front again. I have to run a heavy casing rear and sifter front.....I had a set of maxxis but blew rear apart on a g-out at crestline...folded sidewall and tire ripped between rock and rim...now the 823 had a hefty dent...(finished the rock pile tireless)...
I learned to sacrifice some rear weight to hammer down more ..the super trail is a little heavier sidewall then the dd casing by maxxis . (I like maxxis alot not a dig)
I learned to sacrifice some rear weight to hammer down more ..the super trail is a little heavier sidewall then the dd casing by maxxis . (I like maxxis alot not a dig)
You will love the new one...I have one on the rear and I wasn't a huge fan of the old one...kept telling them its not a good front...now lo and behold its rear specific which is cool they finally made the change and that sob grabs and rolls well...braking is good it can be locked under load or a little unload itll Rutter steer very predictable...
Was doing feet on 2 wheel drifts st Daley coming access softer dirt and it was not sketchy ....it was really predictable.....
I will be curious to hear your thoughts this is just mine and I've been out for a while...
I did ride a continental and was pretty impessed with sidewall flex when I laid the bike over and loaded it..seems to be a good design braked well...little slow rolling but was a damn good tire
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Yeah My DHR2 is 50% and I have a DH race tomorrow but I think I'll stick with what i'm familiar with and try the Big Betty when i can get used to it.
Glad you like it though. Schwalbe had a gap in rear tyres for ages - either the mega grip slow rolling Mary, or the Hans Dampf which loses knobs faster than an orgy at a leper colony.
I just read the Pinkbike review and his take on the Aggressor was dead-on. My dream would be all those traits with slightly more predictable drifting, then a grippier/less durable compound version for racing.
i concur. i burned through a (new) big betty (super gravity, soft) on the rear over the winter. solid tire (at least for our wet coast conditions). may even like it a bit more than my current DD dhr2.
Yeah I'm waiting for schwalbe to restock and get a few for rears they are faster than magic mary for sure and the rear control is spot on....
Toodles
Yeah don't swap tires right before a run, its good but like anything don't swap right beforehand...good luck post up results....
Toodles
Yeah don't swap tires right before a run, its good but like anything don't swap right beforehand...good luck post up results....
Havent read the PB article, yet, but I put a Disector on the front of my hardtail, in place of a DHR, and an Aggresor in place of a DHR2. All exo casing. The 2.5 DHF is a balloon of a tire, which i really dislike, and the side lugs have a lot of under cutting, so wanted to try something else. In general I wanted faster rollong tires to make the local laps more fun. This combo is incredible for speed and the grip is outstanding on hardpack. I have ridden them in the wet with no issues, but the trails have'nt gotten loose over hard yet. Taking a shortcut back home on a trail that is verticle and muddy the Aggressor is shit. I would not put one on my full suss. I am impressed with the Dissector though. The local loop is harpack with corners you can really sink your teeth into, will sets of rollers to manual through or gap. Running faster tires has made this trail all the more fun.
For Winter on the full suss I put a DD DHR 2 Maxx Terra on the back with a DD Assegai Maxx Grip on the front. Absolute grip for miles but holy shit is this combo draggy. I tried to ride the same hardpack loop and could feel my speed dropping as I coast into rollers that I typically gap, removes all the fun from this trail. About swap tires out for summer and interested to feel the difference in speed and grip. I will say this combo has opened my eyes to the damping effect that tires can provide. Riding over roots and small rock chatter sections feels sublime, especially in flat corners.
I would be interested to try a MM and BB combo. Apprently the side lugs dont tear off so easily on the new gen of Schwalbe tires? I tried a MM years ago, and ripped ofd lugs after a handfull of rides.
For Winter on the full suss I put a DD DHR 2 Maxx Terra on the back with a DD Assegai Maxx Grip on the front. Absolute grip for miles but holy shit is this combo draggy. I tried to ride the same hardpack loop and could feel my speed dropping as I coast into rollers that I typically gap, removes all the fun from this trail. About swap tires out for summer and interested to feel the difference in speed and grip. I will say this combo has opened my eyes to the damping effect that tires can provide. Riding over roots and small rock chatter sections feels sublime, especially in flat corners.
I would be interested to try a MM and BB combo. Apprently the side lugs dont tear off so easily on the new gen of Schwalbe tires? I tried a MM years ago, and ripped ofd lugs after a handfull of rides.
The Aggressor's an ok summer/bikepark//hardpack tyre but not much else, on anything resembling mud it's downright scary!
@Rhubarb If you're goal is holding speed on dry trails try switching to a dual compound Minion SS on the rear.
They roll noticably faster than anything else you've mentioned and the side knobs are the same tread patern as a DHF's but being a 2.3 it doesn't suffer the balloon effect or sideknob undercutting leaving a nice supportive edge to rail when leant over.
Don't be tempted to run them low pressure though. as it negates the rolling speed and leaves the tyre with a more vague edge when leant right over
They roll noticably faster than anything else you've mentioned and the side knobs are the same tread patern as a DHF's but being a 2.3 it doesn't suffer the balloon effect or sideknob undercutting leaving a nice supportive edge to rail when leant over.
Don't be tempted to run them low pressure though. as it negates the rolling speed and leaves the tyre with a more vague edge when leant right over
Cheers Gary. I thought the SS wore too quick so it has never been on my radar. Yeah I dont need low pressures for the hardtail, especially as I can often back wheel tag some of the long gaps.
Out of curiosity where are you based? I have to move up to Dundee for work, when the office opens up again. Been rooting around for videos of Scottish trails to get a feel for whats on offer.
Out of curiosity where are you based? I have to move up to Dundee for work, when the office opens up again. Been rooting around for videos of Scottish trails to get a feel for whats on offer.
Dual compounds don't wear fast. I just switched out one on my Emtb that had done over 3000miles and still had centre tread and a decent edge but too many cuts in the casing.
I'm in East Lothian... Its actually flatAF here but its just 35 minutes drive from inners and the rest if the tweed valley which you'll probably already know is pretty much a DH/Enduro trail sweetie shop. I occasionally ride with a few guys from the Fife/Dundee area. If you're moving there you'll definitely want to check out the Dunkeld area. Sooo many good trails in the surrounding hills. But Stirling, Perth, Aberfoyle and Pitlochry all have a thriving riding/digging scene too. Ballo is pretty close to Dundee and worth going to too.
I don't really watch many trail videos so can't really recommend anyone you should watch.
Ps. All my Derp mates think I'm mental running an SS. Nevermind the hard compound version. It is what it is though.
I'm in East Lothian... Its actually flatAF here but its just 35 minutes drive from inners and the rest if the tweed valley which you'll probably already know is pretty much a DH/Enduro trail sweetie shop. I occasionally ride with a few guys from the Fife/Dundee area. If you're moving there you'll definitely want to check out the Dunkeld area. Sooo many good trails in the surrounding hills. But Stirling, Perth, Aberfoyle and Pitlochry all have a thriving riding/digging scene too. Ballo is pretty close to Dundee and worth going to too.
I don't really watch many trail videos so can't really recommend anyone you should watch.
Ps. All my Derp mates think I'm mental running an SS. Nevermind the hard compound version. It is what it is though.
Just bought a Magic Mary / Big Betty combo for my trail bike, super gravity rear, super trail front, both addix soft (orange)
Hopefully is not too heavy and draggy for me, guess I'll wait and see but it will be nice to have decent grip through the wet and cold season.
As an aside does anyone have a comparison between Schwalbe Addix and Maxxis 3c? How similar is Maxx Terra and Addix soft?
Hopefully is not too heavy and draggy for me, guess I'll wait and see but it will be nice to have decent grip through the wet and cold season.
As an aside does anyone have a comparison between Schwalbe Addix and Maxxis 3c? How similar is Maxx Terra and Addix soft?
@Gary, cheers for the info. I am certainly not dreading relocating up. I like Scotland for sure. I know there is riding local to Dundee and I am planning either before or after work sessions in the Summer. Was pretty stoked to be up there for Ft Bill, but the race got scrapped. I have a camper so on weekends I will be getting out and overnighting for riding and surfing.
Will have a look into an SS for the hardtail.
Will have a look into an SS for the hardtail.
I was on maxxis while I waited for schwalbe to get me set up again...
1- super trail is like 3c as far as weight
2- soft is stickier than 3c and park is a smidge harder...
3- i have beaten my magic mary rear and the days of lugs ripping or missing are over. I have ridden my rear tire hard and pushed outside lugs on concrete with my son or jump park which is natures asphalt its so hard...rocks etc...back tire is solid still...in past id have a lug or 3 missing and several would be ripped..
I like maxxis alot but will go schwalbe especially with the lug durability everytime
Big Betty rear rolls fast and brakes amazing, leaned in corners i cN 2 wheel drift the bike..back is predictable and rolls well..(if you have super soft it will have obvious drag from durometer)...
Can't go wrong with either brand...I'm a schwalbe guy but do respect the maxxis dhf..had alot of good solid rides on that tire...
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Sorry, I should have been clearer in my question, where does addix soft sit in comparison to 3c maxx grip and max terra? I'm hoping it's somewhere between.
I am looking forward to giving the BB a go. I ordered one for the trail bike and one for the dh bike.
I have been running ultrasoft MM this summer and had no issues with knobs ripping of early.
The Ultra Soft is the go for the front at any time IMO. The Orange Soft is noticeably harder than the Purple Ultra Soft and wear rates aren't worth the trade off.
I think you're spot on with positioning the soft between Maxx Grip and Maxx Terra but I don't think its worth the trade off.
I think you're spot on with positioning the soft between Maxx Grip and Maxx Terra but I don't think its worth the trade off.
Full ack. BB is a really good rear tire.
I've been running a 2.35 MM SG ultra soft front and 2.40 BB ST soft rear all winter long and the rear is still looking very good. I'd like to have a MM in SuperTrail casing and ultra soft as pedal bike front tire, I don't think I need the burliness of SG in the front. On the other hand the SuperTrail casing is not that much lighter, so it doesn't matter that much.
The BBs side knobs are bigger and better supported than the ones on the old 2.35 MM, but I guess they got bigger on the new 2.40 MM as well. Does anybody have a direct comparison? @Udi or maybe @buckoW ?
Interesting, even for a trail bike that I pedal a decent distance on? A ride here might include 800-1000m of vert and I need to ride a few km in and out of town on the road as well.
I have a spare ultra soft MM in SG casing so I guess I can give it a shot and see what I think.
Did a single action 1200 m climb on said combo last Sunday and didn't die.
As toodles said
Super soft front (purple) soft rear (orange) or even trail
I have to run a super gravity on rear ...i crush rear wheels and damage tires...I run these at 26 to 28 psi in rear...I have gone lower but sudden a rock pile appears and i head straight for it...learned this a few times pushing bike out destroyed tire and or rim...
Super soft front (purple) soft rear (orange) or even trail
I have to run a super gravity on rear ...i crush rear wheels and damage tires...I run these at 26 to 28 psi in rear...I have gone lower but sudden a rock pile appears and i head straight for it...learned this a few times pushing bike out destroyed tire and or rim...
I was interested in the SG BB for the rear until I saw its weight, I believe it was 1250g for the purple or orange Addix rubber. Does it really pedal better than a 1050g MM? I had a SG VertStar MM in the rear for winter riding and that thing just does not roll well at all in the rear, bike refuses to pick up speed even on smooth downhill sections.
I'm curious how the BB compares to the DHR2. I've pretty much settled on the DHR2 (27.5, 2.4, EXO+, w/ an insert in the rear) for my year round riding. Does most of what I want, most of the time. I like having the same tire front in rear so I can swap the front to rear and put a fresh tire in the front.
I read that the BB is rounder and doesn't hold off-camber corners as well as the DHR2. But I don't have too many off camber corners. If it's cheaper/more durable/rolls better/ or is lighter, it might be a worthy contender?
edited to add: not lighter than EXO+. In fact, 200g heavier (1140g vs 940g)
I read that the BB is rounder and doesn't hold off-camber corners as well as the DHR2. But I don't have too many off camber corners. If it's cheaper/more durable/rolls better/ or is lighter, it might be a worthy contender?
edited to add: not lighter than EXO+. In fact, 200g heavier (1140g vs 940g)
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Imho it's "more" of a tire than the DHR2, side knobs are taller and sturdier. It wears slower and rolls at least as good as the DHR2 in MaxxTerra compound. I'm running it on a ex471 and can't say it's got a rounder profile, off camber grip is better as well. But as you noticed it's heavier.
I find the DHR2 to be the suckorz of all trades. The side knobs of the 2.3 size are feeble, it sucks in the wet, it rolls badly, it does not inspire confidence - just not good for me at all.
I've always liked the dhr2, the 2.3 is a bit of a joke but the 2.4 is fine, my only issue with it is I need DD casing and can only get that with Max Grip rubber, which is too slow rolling and fast wearing for me.
Hopefully the Big Betty is what I have been looking for all along.
I guess that was a silly question. I just need to try it and see how I get on.
I'd be keen on a Magic Mary Ultra Soft in a Super Trail casing for the front if they made one. Pretty sure they only do the Ultra Softs in DH and SG casing though.
FWIW, I ran an Ultra Soft Mary front for all 3 Trans Enduros (biggish days, 1500 - 2000m, 30-40km for 6 days) and never hated them for long days. I've yet to ride a better all condition, multi-terrain front tyre. The Assegai comes very close but is still slightly more of a warm weather, dry condition tyre IMO.
Rear tyre tends to be a 2.4 DHR2 these days. I used to run the 2.3 to get some rolling speed out of them but its less of a factor for me now.
As I said in the DH thread, last weekends race we did a quick look over the shuttle trailers and seriously 90% of the field was running Assegai\DHR2 combos.
FWIW, I ran an Ultra Soft Mary front for all 3 Trans Enduros (biggish days, 1500 - 2000m, 30-40km for 6 days) and never hated them for long days. I've yet to ride a better all condition, multi-terrain front tyre. The Assegai comes very close but is still slightly more of a warm weather, dry condition tyre IMO.
Rear tyre tends to be a 2.4 DHR2 these days. I used to run the 2.3 to get some rolling speed out of them but its less of a factor for me now.
As I said in the DH thread, last weekends race we did a quick look over the shuttle trailers and seriously 90% of the field was running Assegai\DHR2 combos.
Yeah, that's the issue, they only make ultrasoft in SG and SD casing.
Maybe I just need to suck it up and run super gravity front as well. It's a bit heavier but grip is nice, especially in the cold wet winter.
Maybe I just need to suck it up and run super gravity front as well. It's a bit heavier but grip is nice, especially in the cold wet winter.
I gave a SuperTrail Soft version of the MM/BB a try over the fall / winter, and didn't like them. They're heavy as shit even in the trail casing, and don't have the ultra soft compound available then. Combined they felt slower than an EXO+ Assegai & EXO DHR with CushCore, and as you figured, felt less confident on off-camber. I never got a chance to see how the durability faired, as I took them off within a couple weeks.
The DHR2 2.4" DD/3C MaxxTerra is available in both 27 and 29. It will be my next rear tire, as I prefer Maxxterra for a grip/longevity compromise too.
www.universalcycles.com
www.universalcycles.com
Yes, all the Maxxis 2.3s have too puny of side knobs, imho.
Maxxis Minion DHR II 3C MaxxTerra/DD TR 27.5" Tire - Width: 2.3", 2.4", 2.5", 2.6"
Maxxis Minion DHR II 3C MaxxTerra/DD TR 27.5" Tire - Width: 2.3", 2.4", 2.5", 2.6" :: From $101.00 :: Maxxis 27.5 Inch (650b) Tires
www.universalcycles.com
Maxxis Minion DHR II 3C MaxxTerra/DD TR 29" Tire - Width: 2.3", 2.4", 2.5", 2.6"
Maxxis Minion DHR II 3C MaxxTerra/DD TR 29" Tire - Width: 2.3", 2.4", 2.5", 2.6" :: Available in Black or Tanwall :: From $95.00 :: Maxxis 29 Inch Tires
www.universalcycles.com
Yes, all the Maxxis 2.3s have too puny of side knobs, imho.