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What trail bike tire casings don't suck?

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,502
4,754
Australia
Come on... no way that "tire lube" is anything other than vegetable oil, right??
The water soluble aspect is pretty important considering its going on tyres and near rotors. I'll use a spray bottle of bike wash or even isopropyl alcohol to provide some slip to allow a tyre to pop out to the bead. Not sure I wanna risk oil based options.

*edit* to be fair, I'm still traumatised from a tyre exploding off the rim once and making my garage look like a bukkake scene was filmed there. There's still Peaty's sealant on the ceiling
 

slyfink

Turbo Monkey
Sep 16, 2008
9,325
5,078
Ottawa, Canada
got my supertrail Magic Mary and Big Betty in the mail on Monday. Installed them last night. Mary went onto my Chromag rim easily enough despite a stiffer than expected bead (soaped up the beads, popped them on with a tube, removed it and one bead, removed the valve stem, hit it with a compressor). Held air overnight, so that's a win.

Rear rim is a Spank Spike 33. Even soaped up and with a tube, I couldn't get the beads to seat properly and evenly all the way round. Left it at 40psi overnight, and they didn't budge. I'm going to try and install my Tannus tubeless insert tonight, but I'm not hopeful it will work and hold air. I'm very torn about this rim. It's stiff, straigtht and true after 1.5 seasons, but goddam is it ever a pain in the ass to get it to seat tubeless. I don't think I will be getting another one next time around...
FWIW, turns out it was much ado about nothing. came home last night and pulled the tube out, installed the valve (coreless) and aired it up with my compressor. It was holding air with the pump head still on. So I installed the Tannus insert (I sprayed it with a mist of water), got it seated, put Stans in through the valve, reinstalled the core and aired it up. There were no pops as the bead set in, and an 7" section of bead is still not perfectly seated, but it held air for my ride last night, and this morning it was still within 2 psi of where I left it after the ride.

I think I was traumatised by the first time I tried getting that rim to seal tubeless. Took about 3 (maybe 4?) tape jobs, and about 4 rides after that for the valve to seal fully. It must have taken about 3 weeks of faffing to finally settle. I was really not looking forward to doing that all over again. Happily it turns out I didn't.

Ride notes: the orange (soft) rubber is grippy as advertised. while unseasonably warm last night (15°C), it was humid and the leaves have mostly fallen. most rocky surfaces were snotty or covered in leaves, so slipping was inevitable. where I noticed it most was on roots. Also, not having the defined channel of the DHR2 on the front tire (now a Muddy Mary) meant a much more confident ride at slower speeds (which characterizes our fall riding at night). I'm very happy with the combo.
 

mykel

closer to Periwinkle
Apr 19, 2013
5,102
3,818
sw ontario canada
Finally got a post Covid ride on the new EXO+.
Rona symptoms have all cleared up except for some tinnitus and I still get winded just thinking about something physical. I was pretty much out of gas as soon as I started so my ride was slow and short, (8 km /5 mi ) so just first impressions.

The new ones feel quite a bit thicker in the sidewalls so I broke out the micrometer and did a couple measurements.

EXO - measured .037-.040 inches - two samples (Rekon and Dissector - both 29x2.4)
EXO+ 120 - measured .038-.044 inches - two samples (DHR2 - both 29x2.4)
EXO+ 60 - measured .067 -.070 inches - two samples (Assegai 29x2.5 and Dissector 29x2.4)

On trail, the feel is much much improved. Nicely damped and muted but not lacking in feedback. They do not bounce and kick like the EXO or old EXO+, much more DH like. There is a rootball section on one climb, kinda like corduroy and about 20 feet long that normally has the front kicking and hunting quite a bit. This time it was much more composed and tracked better. Even the rear felt like it was not hunting as much. These trails are pretty tight and not overly fast, so only hit a couple of berms at anything that could be considered speedy. They felt good, no squirm or rollover, but like I said, not moving with much haste.

Speedwise - hard to tell. I went from dual DHR2 to Assegai / Dissector (same compounds MG/MT), so probably picked up a bit in back and lost a boatload up front. Feels a bit slower, but not overly draggy, but hard to tell when you get winded just riding around the parking lot. More time will tell. They did do a very good job of finding traction amongst all the leaves and pine straw.

Overall, first impressions are quite positive.
 

slyfink

Turbo Monkey
Sep 16, 2008
9,325
5,078
Ottawa, Canada
Interesting review of Conti's new tires: https://fullattack.cc/fiche-test-continental-argotal-kryptotal/

To summarize:
he seems to love the DH tires: great carcass, and great rubber. softer than any Maxxis offering, but don't wear out too fast.

Enduro tires are less good, mainly due to the carcass: too heavy for too little puncture protection. he said they come in closer to an EXO than the EXO+, despite being heavier.
 

sethimus

neu bizutch
Feb 5, 2006
4,962
2,179
not in Whistler anymore :/
Finally got a post Covid ride on the new EXO+.
Rona symptoms have all cleared up except for some tinnitus and I still get winded just thinking about something physical. I was pretty much out of gas as soon as I started so my ride was slow and short, (8 km /5 mi ) so just first impressions.

The new ones feel quite a bit thicker in the sidewalls so I broke out the micrometer and did a couple measurements.

EXO - measured .037-.040 inches - two samples (Rekon and Dissector - both 29x2.4)
EXO+ 120 - measured .038-.044 inches - two samples (DHR2 - both 29x2.4)
EXO+ 60 - measured .067 -.070 inches - two samples (Assegai 29x2.5 and Dissector 29x2.4)

On trail, the feel is much much improved. Nicely damped and muted but not lacking in feedback. They do not bounce and kick like the EXO or old EXO+, much more DH like. There is a rootball section on one climb, kinda like corduroy and about 20 feet long that normally has the front kicking and hunting quite a bit. This time it was much more composed and tracked better. Even the rear felt like it was not hunting as much. These trails are pretty tight and not overly fast, so only hit a couple of berms at anything that could be considered speedy. They felt good, no squirm or rollover, but like I said, not moving with much haste.

Speedwise - hard to tell. I went from dual DHR2 to Assegai / Dissector (same compounds MG/MT), so probably picked up a bit in back and lost a boatload up front. Feels a bit slower, but not overly draggy, but hard to tell when you get winded just riding around the parking lot. More time will tell. They did do a very good job of finding traction amongst all the leaves and pine straw.

Overall, first impressions are quite positive.
i rode my assegai/dhr2 exo+ combo all summer with 1,6/1,7 bar and octamousse red/black. no problems , felt no difference to the dd combo i rode last year
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,502
4,754
Australia
Huge gravedig but anyone have any time on the Continental trail and enduro casings? Really happy with the Kryptotal DH on the enderpo bike but want lighter casings for my Smuggler. Are the trail and enduro offerings comparable to EXO and DD? Better or worse?

Bit annoying they don't offer the soft compound in trail casing (that I can see).
 

SkaredShtles

Michael Bolton
Sep 21, 2003
65,653
12,711
In a van.... down by the river
Huge gravedig but anyone have any time on the Continental trail and enduro casings? Really happy with the Kryptotal DH on the enderpo bike but want lighter casings for my Smuggler. Are the trail and enduro offerings comparable to EXO and DD? Better or worse?

Bit annoying they don't offer the soft compound in trail casing (that I can see).
Rumors are that this is coming. https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php/301864-New-Season-New-Tires-New-Thread?p=7052243#post7052243
 

Flo33

Turbo Monkey
Mar 3, 2015
2,066
1,306
Styria
I've been using Krypto endurpo for about 8 months now in the rear. Nothing to complain about. Quite the opposite, tbh, positively surprised by the longevity. Will bang again.
 

Andeh

Customer Title
Mar 3, 2020
1,008
982
I've been using Krypto endurpo for about 8 months now in the rear. Nothing to complain about. Quite the opposite, tbh, positively surprised by the longevity. Will bang again.
Ditto. Been running the Enduro casings on my enduro bike, no complaints. The sidewalls are stiff enough I can run a bit lower pressure without feeling squirm cornering. The Soft compound lasts much longer than MaxxTerra it feels like. Most of the year I'm riding hardpack & dust, no sharp rocks, so no worries about flats. The braking knobs on the Kryptotal Re Soft last *much* longer than a DHR MT (I suspect some of this is due to them just being a lot taller, so they can wear more and still retain bite).

I haven't ridden the newer 60tpi EXO+, but I'd put the Enduro casing at a similar level of support as DD, but feels less thick and rubbery. A set of Enduro Kryptotals weighs about 100g less than a set of DD DHR/Assegai (rear is about the same, front is 100g less).

I'm running the same pressures with the Enduro casings on my enduro as I do with the DH casing on my ebike, FWIW.
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,502
4,754
Australia
Yeah I'd like to try the Enderpo casing on my Mega once the Super Soft Krypto Enduro is offered but for now the DH casings are pretty light anyway (similar to Maxxis DD) and available in super soft front.

I tend to kill Exo casings on my Smuggler (that bike encourages me to get too silly sometimes) and I'm currently on a EXO+ which has somehow survived. Wondering how the Conti trail casings compare. Tyres are expensive enough to make the gamble a bit risky if they're going to die the first time I get silly with them.
 

mykel

closer to Periwinkle
Apr 19, 2013
5,102
3,818
sw ontario canada
FWIW I am quite happy with the 60TPI Exo+. Back to back with Exo with the only difference being casing, I found the + to be better damped and not as prone to bounce. My normal riding areas can be rooty, but not much rock, so there is that. For trips where there is more rock, an Exo+ pairs nice with a DD out back.
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,502
4,754
Australia
Any comparison opinions of Krypto front vs Assguy?
Dry and loose conditions ova hea.
The Assegai is still pretty hard to trump on dry and loose hey. I'm keen to try an Argotal though - one of the local pinners here swears by them and rates them over the Assguy in our mix of rubble and gravel
 

Andeh

Customer Title
Mar 3, 2020
1,008
982
Any comparison opinions of Krypto front vs Assguy?
Dry and loose conditions ova hea.
They're pretty similar. I'm in NorCal so those are my conditions 9/12 months. I'd say Assegai has a smidge more grip on hardpack, rolls considerably slower. Krypto Fr I like better for off camber or leaned over hard onto the knobs. I also prefer the 2.4 width over 2.5 just because it's easier to get onto the side knobs. I think Krypto brakes a bit better due to taller knobs.

Lots of good comparisons here:

I ran Argotals all winter and just took them off. For the bit of transition from wet to dry we had on both ends, they did surprisingly well. Most of our "loose" is <1" of dust on top of hardpack, so I prefer the Krypto for that. In loam or sandier soils, the Argo is pretty sweet. It's slower rolling for sure, but not as bad as a Shorty or Hillbilly. The Super Soft Argotal rear though showed a ton of wear though (compared to even SS Krypto Re), not sure why that was. I think it'd be great up front for a place like Oregon or Washington in the summer where you're riding a lot of proper loose, dusty trails with pine needles and such mixed in, paired with a Krypto Re in the back.
 

slimshady

¡Mira, una ardilla!
FWIW I am quite happy with the 60TPI Exo+. Back to back with Exo with the only difference being casing, I found the + to be better damped and not as prone to bounce. My normal riding areas can be rooty, but not much rock, so there is that. For trips where there is more rock, an Exo+ pairs nice with a DD out back.
I agree, just switched to DHF EXO+ Maxterras and even with the excessive rain we're getting down here they stay glued to roots and rocks. They are ±300 grams heavier than the Schwalbes they replaced, but oddly enough I got a KOM with the new tires and in much wetter conditions.
 

Jozz

Joe Dalton
Apr 18, 2002
5,862
7,376
SADL
The Assegai is still pretty hard to trump on dry and loose hey. I'm keen to try an Argotal though - one of the local pinners here swears by them and rates them over the Assguy in our mix of rubble and gravel
I've been on a front Argotal DH for a year, coming from an Assegai exo+. Around here on rooty rocky east coast trails I'm not a big fan. They seem a bit too stiff. They let go without warning. I have to run them at 18psi to get some proper grip. But I've spent a month in AZ this winter and I must say that for that kind of terrain they were great. The stiffness was welcome on those high speed slab sections.
 

HardtailHack

used an iron once
Jan 20, 2009
6,742
5,631
The Assegai is still pretty hard to trump on dry and loose hey. I'm keen to try an Argotal though - one of the local pinners here swears by them and rates them over the Assguy in our mix of rubble and gravel
I just ordered a Pirelli Scorpion Enduro Race M, it looks a bit like an assguy, grabbed a Scorpion rear for all of $52AuD.
Will be keen to see how they go on the XC trails I ride, hahaha!
 

HardtailHack

used an iron once
Jan 20, 2009
6,742
5,631
Banger offer! Could you share the link?
I didn't word that all that well.
The rear tyre on its own was $52.50, they have some other ones discounted but not by as much.

Will be keen to see how they go, I don't like my current Dissector 2.6" up front and there is no 2.6" Assguy Max Grip.
 

Andeh

Customer Title
Mar 3, 2020
1,008
982
I've been on a front Argotal DH for a year, coming from an Assegai exo+. Around here on rooty rocky east coast trails I'm not a big fan. They seem a bit too stiff. They let go without warning. I have to run them at 18psi to get some proper grip. But I've spent a month in AZ this winter and I must say that for that kind of terrain they were great. The stiffness was welcome on those high speed slab sections.
Yeah in the recent Jack Moir videos where he was trying out Contis vs. his usual Assegai/DHR setup, he said the stiffness is quite noticeable. He said comparing DH to DH, the Maxxis conforms to stuff better but it also folds a lot easier under load. That's my impression also, and since I mostly ride harder ground and hate tire squirm, I love the Conti casing. But I could see if I rode somewhere with a lot of slower moves over wet rocks and roots, it'd be hard to beat Maxxis.
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,502
4,754
Australia
Will be keen to see how they go, I don't like my current Dissector 2.6" up front and there is no 2.6" Assguy Max Grip.
Why 2.6"? The 2.5 Assguy is pretty big hey. And I'm loving the 2.4 Conti offerings.

Yeah in the recent Jack Moir videos where he was trying out Contis vs. his usual Assegai/DHR setup, he said the stiffness is quite noticeable. He said comparing DH to DH, the Maxxis conforms to stuff better but it also folds a lot easier under load. That's my impression also, and since I mostly ride harder ground and hate tire squirm, I love the Conti casing. But I could see if I rode somewhere with a lot of slower moves over wet rocks and roots, it'd be hard to beat Maxxis.
I find I gotta drop a psi or two in the Contis compared the Maxxis to get a similar feel. I wasn't expecting the Krypto to work as well in the wet as it does - somehow it holds on better than the Assguy when I tried it at Maydena in the rain. Didn't the Conti tyres nearly sweep the podium at Snowshoe in the rain a couple years ago?
 

HardtailHack

used an iron once
Jan 20, 2009
6,742
5,631
Why 2.6"? The 2.5 Assguy is pretty big hey. And I'm loving the 2.4 Conti offerings.



I find I gotta drop a psi or two in the Contis compared the Maxxis to get a similar feel. I wasn't expecting the Krypto to work as well in the wet as it does - somehow it holds on better than the Assguy when I tried it at Maydena in the rain. Didn't the Conti tyres nearly sweep the podium at Snowshoe in the rain a couple years ago?
Coz the formula fork I put on is short compared to the stock RS fork. Wanted to try to get a bit of height back without upping the travel.

Yeah I think I have a 2.4" Kryptotal on my other bike, it's good and it holds air like no other Conti I have had in the past.
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,502
4,754
Australia
Coz the formula fork I put on is short compared to the stock RS fork. Wanted to try to get a bit of height back without upping the travel.

Yeah I think I have a 2.4" Kryptotal on my other bike, it's good and it holds air like no other Conti I have had in the past.
Ah yep, was wondering why. I find the bigger size stuff gets squirmy or vague sometimes is all.

True that - I don't want to jinx myself but the Contis have me solid for the past twelve months. I think maybe one puncture in that time?
 

Jozz

Joe Dalton
Apr 18, 2002
5,862
7,376
SADL
I find I gotta drop a psi or two in the Contis compared the Maxxis to get a similar feel. I wasn't expecting the Krypto to work as well in the wet as it does - somehow it holds on better than the Assguy when I tried it at Maydena in the rain. Didn't the Conti tyres nearly sweep the podium at Snowshoe in the rain a couple years ago?
It's a little unnerving to run those Contis at below 20psi on plastic rims. But they work so much better with a few psi less. I'm also impressed by the rear Xynotal I've got. Better rolling than a DHR2, maybe less braking grip would be the main difference.
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,502
4,754
Australia
It's a little unnerving to run those Contis at below 20psi on plastic rims. But they work so much better with a few psi less. I'm also impressed by the rear Xynotal I've got. Better rolling than a DHR2, maybe less braking grip would be the main difference.
Yeah I'm thinking I'll grab a Xynotal rear for the Smuggler and pair with a Krypto F. A bit unsure on the endurance compound that the trail casing is available in. Dunno if its stupid hard or not.
 

Andeh

Customer Title
Mar 3, 2020
1,008
982
It's a little unnerving to run those Contis at below 20psi on plastic rims. But they work so much better with a few psi less. I'm also impressed by the rear Xynotal I've got. Better rolling than a DHR2, maybe less braking grip would be the main difference.
Yeah, I'm definitely Xynotal-curious. The photos of the tread make it look much more substantial than like a Dissector. But I've gotten burned so many times by Dissectors/Aggressors, I've been hesitant to try them.
 

Jozz

Joe Dalton
Apr 18, 2002
5,862
7,376
SADL
Yeah, I'm definitely Xynotal-curious. The photos of the tread make it look much more substantial than like a Dissector. But I've gotten burned so many times by Dissectors/Aggressors, I've been hesitant to try them.
They came with a used set of Reserve I bought. I had already picked up a new Krypto for the rear cause I was also skeptical of the thread. But I got the wheels and decided to give it a go.
 

Lelandjt

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2008
2,514
827
Breckenridge, CO/Lahaina,HI
Why 2.6"? The 2.5 Assguy is pretty big hey.
Disagree. The 2.5 Assegai & Aggressor are the same size as the 2.4 DHR. All three of those tires work for me but I frequently wish they were a little bigger. Dissector & Rekon 2.6" tires on my friend's bike are way bigger, like Plus Size. Maxxis needs to make all their burly tires either a healthy 2.5" or a reasonable 2.6".
 
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toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,502
4,754
Australia
Disagree. I the 2.5 Assegai & Aggressor are the same size as the 2.4 DHR. All three of those tires work for me but I frequently wish they were a little bigger. Dissector & Rekon 2.6" tires on my friend's bike are way bigger, like Plus Size. Maxxis needs to make all their burly tires either a healthy 2.5" or a reasonable 2.6".
Fair play, but I went to a 2.4 Conti and it seems visibly smaller than the Assegai and I still prefer it.

*old man story* Kovarik used to occasionally shuttle with us back in the day and he was giving me shit about running 2.7" DHFs (back when slow reezay was a thing). Out of interest I went to 2.5" like he suggest and dropped multiple of seconds off my lap times almost immediately. Not that it is particularly relevant with the modern bikes and tyres but ever since I've sorta preferred the small bag width tyres.
 

Lelandjt

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2008
2,514
827
Breckenridge, CO/Lahaina,HI
Fair play, but I went to a 2.4 Conti and it seems visibly smaller than the Assegai and I still prefer it.

*old man story* Kovarik used to occasionally shuttle with us back in the day and he was giving me shit about running 2.7" DHFs (back when slow reezay was a thing). Out of interest I went to 2.5" like he suggest and dropped multiple of seconds off my lap times almost immediately. Not that it is particularly relevant with the modern bikes and tyres but ever since I've sorta preferred the small bag width tyres.
Damn, because those were really more like 2.5" and 2.35". I've always liked the confidence in loose terrain of a genuine 2.5" wide front tire, but I haven't timed comparisons with narrower. The 2.4" DHR on the back of my DH bike and 2.5" Aggressor on the rear of my Enduro seem a little short and prone to bottoming out at 27psi (if I don't use an insert) so I feel like a touch more height (width) would give the cushion I'm lacking.