[Capt. Jack Sparrow]

So when our soldiers/contractors take prisoners over in Iraq and put hoods on them (BTW, I am horrified at the alleged abuse!!!), where do the hoods come from? Does the military employ hood-sewers? Or is there some weird supply company for this kind of need? Anybody else wonder things like that after your feelings of heart-sickness and horror abate?

Edit: "hostages" to "prisoners"--my bad. I'm no good at the game of war, which is why I ask questions like above.

 

[llkoolkeg]

Huh?

Our soldiers do not take hostages- they capture prisoners.

As far as the hoods, why do you ask? Any good S&M dungeon should carry them, I'd think.

 

[Silver]

Probably supplied from Halliburton using Chinese slave labor....

Hoods you want?

www.stockroom.com should have them.

(Not work safe, unless you have an open minded boss)

 

[Spud]

Look like empty sand bags to me.

 

[Tenchiro]

Originally posted by llkoolkeg
Huh?

Our soldiers do not take hostages- they capture prisoners.

Exactly, Americans take POW's. Everyone else, takes hostages.

 

[MMike]

Abercrombie and Fitch

 

[Capt. Jack Sparrow]

Originally posted by Silver
...Hoods you want?...

No. My point is that, wow, don't we all have such different occupations. For instance, a friend of mine designs rockets... to kill us all eventually, I suppose. And some people have the task of sewing hoods to cover people's faces while they are imprisoned
during war.

What a world we live in. Never ceases to amaze me.

 

[LordOpie]

well, at least the hoods aren't plastic :devil:

 

[Slugman]

They Iraqi prisoners were being held in a jail used by Saddam's forces to hold and torture prisoners... so they could have been there already.

Good for the Americans for recycling, which shows globally responsible thinking!

 

[BurlyShirley]

Originally posted by Capt. Jack Sparrow
No. My point is that, wow, don't we all have such different occupations. For instance, a friend of mine designs rockets... to kill us all eventually, I suppose. And some people have the task of sewing hoods to cover people's faces while they are imprisoned
during war.

What a world we live in. Never ceases to amaze me.

Its Iraq. Im sure there are tons of hoods just lying around all over the place.
Id say that likely, even there, you dont just go in to Safeway and pick up a hostage hood. Probably they're just cloth bags for fruit or dead rabbits or something

 

[Tenchiro]

Didn't one of Saddams kids have a swingers pad, maybe there was an ample supply there.

 

[Silver]

Originally posted by Capt. Jack Sparrow
No.

Ahh, I thought perhaps your were curious. My fault...

 

[llkoolkeg]

Originally posted by Tenchiro
Exactly, Americans take POW's. Everyone else, takes hostages.

Certainly you are capable of making the distinction, Tenchiro. Try lifting up your left foot and meditating on it for five minutes in a crane pose.

 

[Tenchiro]

What kind of sack is that anyway? 5 points if you can spot the terrorist.

 

[llkoolkeg]

Originally posted by Tenchiro
What kind of sack is that anyway? 5 points if you can spot the terrorist.

Well, she's smoking a cigarette now so maybe she knows what kind of sack it was first-hand. Since when is blindfolding lined-up men and giving them complimentary handjobs abuse, though?

 

[Silver]

Originally posted by llkoolkeg
Well, she's smoking a cigarette now so maybe she knows what kind of sack it was first-hand. Since when is blindfolding lined-up men and giving them complimentary handjobs abuse, though?

I guess the depends on whether or not you're at the beginning or the end of the line...

 

[Capt. Jack Sparrow]

I don't see how it's funny. I would like to spit on that woman if I ever saw her.

 

[DamienC]

Originally posted by Capt. Jack Sparrow
Na friend of mine designs rockets... to kill us all eventually, I suppose.

Really? Who? Just curious.

Originally posted by BurlySurly
Id say that likely, even there, you dont just go in to Safeway and pick up a hostage hood. Probably they're just cloth bags for fruit or dead rabbits or something

Yeah, you need the Club Card for those but I think your home phone number works just as well. FWIW, I don't think the hoods are standard military issue gear.

 

[N8 v2.0]

.....that in a "culture" where women are treated like some kind of chattle, the female prison guard is turning the tables on the men...

Why aren't the N.O.W. nags applauding this unquestionably empowered woman????!?










On the other hand, this just goes to show what happens when you let women in the military...



:devil:

 

[Capt. Jack Sparrow]

Originally posted by DamienC
Really? Who? Just curious.

Damien, I'll PM you his name.

 

[Silver]

Originally posted by N8
.....that in a "culture" where women are treated like some kind of chattle, the female prison guard is turning the tables on the men...

Why aren't the N.O.W. nags applauding this unquestionably empowered woman????!?

Was the picture from Afghanistan? Because otherwise you're ass backwards again...

 

[Westy]

Originally posted by N8
.....that in a "culture" where women are treated like some kind of chattle, the female prison guard is turning the tables on the men...

Interestingly Iraq being secular, women had greater rights than most Arab countries. But I forgot all them people over there are the same, right .

Even more interesting is the fact that the US sponsored interim government has pulled back certain rights that women had under Saddam's regime.

The worst thing about all this is how the resulting publicity will set back the US cause in Iraq. A complete failure in winning hearts and minds. This will undoubtably cost additional American soldiers their lives. Those responsible should be punished and whoever allowed the pictures to be taken should be shot.

 

[Capt. Jack Sparrow]

Originally posted by N8
.....that in a "culture" where women are treated like some kind of chattle, the female prison guard is turning the tables on the men...

I fail to see the humor in it. I think it's sad that she (and the others) lowered themselves to the level of scum by engaging in the kinds of abuse we are supposedly trying to save people from.

 

[N8 v2.0]

Did we all forget that POW Jessia Lynch was raped by her progressive IRAQI captors...

 

[Capt. Jack Sparrow]

And now our soldiers, our loved ones, if captured over there, are really screwed if we keep up with this "Two wrongs makes a right" crap.

 

[Westy]

Originally posted by N8
Did we all forget that POW Jessia Lynch was raped by her progressive IRAQI captors...

Maybe she should have gone to the Air Force academy. She would have been better prepared for it.

Last time I checked we were supposed to be the good guys. We should hold ourselves to a higher standard.

 

[N8 v2.0]

Originally posted by Capt. Jack Sparrow
And now our soldiers, our loved ones, if captured over there, are really screwed if we keep up with this "Two wrongs makes a right" crap.

Like they have had such an easy time until now...

Granted... having a few naked pix taken of you and your female guard is embarssing...

...but being burned alive just sucks.

 

[Capt. Jack Sparrow]

Originally posted by N8
...but being burned alive just sucks.

Which is why we shouldn't add fuel to the fire.

 

[Spud]

Damn, I thought we were supposed to be the good guys. So we are willing to settle for our military is somewhat better restrained than the Iraqi mobs or Saddam's killers?

That shi^t is weak...

 

[Slugman]

Originally posted by N8
...but being burned alive just sucks.

Actually they were shot then burned, it's a tragedy without you're editorializing it...

 

[Spud]

Sandbags it was....

One of the first reports from the military has been posted at the smoking gun. 57 pages

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0505041torture1.html

 

[Trond]

 

[Tenchiro]

Once again it seems this administration has been lying to us...

Red Cross Sought Action on Prisoner Abuse

GENEVA - The international Red Cross said Thursday that it had repeatedly asked U.S. authorities to take action over alleged prisoner abuse at Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison before recent revelations about the way detainees were treated.

"We were aware of what was going on, and based on our findings we have repeatedly requested the U.S. authorities to take corrective action," said Nada Doumani, spokeswoman for the International Committee of the Red Cross, speaking from Amman, Jordan.

More...

 

[Skookum]

This whole deal is weird. I can't even begin to think what the fascination is with piling up naked captives and taking pictures.

My thought is that behavior like this in war does happen (not excusing it with this statement), but it amazes me still that these morons actually photograph it. Must be that weird psychological power/control phenomenom like the student prison guards underwent in the study at Berkeley that Opie i think posted before.
Seems like a huge propaganda war is being waged and with a moron like Bush in office we're losing that one bad. These pictures don't help, but as other's mentioned before it pales in comparison to being killed and tortured. Perspective people, war is not pretty.
But in my eye watchin ole Georgy he reaffirms my belief that he really has no clue and is bungling our future. Thanks for having the soldiers back over there by going on Arabic Propaganda t.v. and addressing THIS specific situation, while dodging others. Bushy condemns these soldiers is to me like using them to excuse and cover his own mistakes of arrogance, hastiness, and continuing mismanagement of the mission. Commander in chief my ass.....

 

[LordOpie]

http://www.prisonexp.org/

http://www.vaniercollege.qc.ca/Auxiliary/Psychology/Frank/Thirdwave.html

 

[Silver]

Did Bush call these soldiers "evildoers" by any chance?

Must be hard to see shades of gray when you're living in a black and white world...:devil:

 

[T-Dog]

Originally posted by Skookum
This whole deal is weird. I can't even begin to think what the fascination is with piling up naked captives and taking pictures.

My thought is that behavior like this in war does happen (not excusing it with this statement), but it amazes me still that these morons actually photograph it. Must be that weird psychological power/control phenomenom like the student prison guards underwent in the study at Berkeley that Opie i think posted before.
Seems like a huge propaganda war is being waged and with a moron like Bush in office we're losing that one bad. These pictures don't help, but as other's mentioned before it pales in comparison to being killed and tortured. Perspective people, war is not pretty.
But in my eye watchin ole Georgy he reaffirms my belief that he really has no clue and is bungling our future. Thanks for having the soldiers back over there by going on Arabic Propaganda t.v. and addressing THIS specific situation, while dodging others. Bushy condemns these soldiers is to me like using them to excuse and cover his own mistakes of arrogance, hastiness, and continuing mismanagement of the mission. Commander in chief my ass.....

While I agree with you that the whole scene is sickening and weird, I think it's wrong to assign the blame once again to Bush....Yeah he's commanger in chief but it's not like he personally recruited the weirdos that were involved, was running the prison or had day-to-day knowledge of the abuses-like the ceo of a gigantic company, he has managers that are supposed to be doing that, and there's no way he can be expected to micromanage.....making him responsible for the actions of all the enlisted men is ridiculous. He's already spoken to the press and is currently whaling on Rumsfeld, (and others I'm sure). Why not just follow your line of reasoning all the way out and blame him for the actions of every person in the country.....

 

[Westy]

Originally posted by T-Dog
While I agree with you that the whole scene is sickening and weird, I think it's wrong to assign the blame once again to Bush....Yeah he's commanger in chief but it's not like he personally recruited the weirdos that were involved, was running the prison or had day-to-day knowledge of the abuses-like the ceo of a gigantic company, he has managers that are supposed to be doing that, and there's no way he can be expected to micromanage.....making him responsible for the actions of all the enlisted men is ridiculous. He's already spoken to the press and is currently whaling on Rumsfeld, (and others I'm sure). Why not just follow your line of reasoning all the way out and blame him for the actions of every person in the country.....

Bush has been strongly criticized for being too much of a hands off leader. He seems to be very far out of the loop. Back in the seventies Carter caught flak for trying to do too much himself. There is a happy medium between the two. The problem with relying on your subordinates too much is they will tend to filter the information they present too much. We may never know the truth of what actually goes on in the whitehouse but you must look at the Pres as a representative for his whole administration. He is the one who hired Rumsfeld and the rest of his cabinete.

 

[T-Dog]

Originally posted by Westy
Bush has been strongly criticized for being too much of a hands off leader. He seems to be very far out of the loop. Back in the seventies Carter caught flak for trying to do too much himself. There is a happy medium between the two. The problem with relying on your subordinates too much is they will tend to filter the information they present too much. We may never know the truth of what actually goes on in the whitehouse but you must look at the Pres as a representative for his whole administration. He is the one who hired Rumsfeld and the rest of his cabinete.

Agreed......I remember that Carter used to actually set the schedule of day to day use of the WH tennis courts himself. And you're right about the appointments of cabinet members; but not the rank and file/commisioned officers in the military. It just seems like it's easy to be a monday morning quarterback on this issue, or on 9/11......but when the Red Cross or Amnesty international says "I told you so, we've been reporting that" it isn't like Bush takes those calls himself. If these things happen, and there's no reaction or no shakeup and head rolling in the administration, then I'll bitch too. But you can bet that plenty of people are catching holy hell even as we speak.......

 

[Damn True]

Holding Bush or Rumsfeld responsible for this makes about as much sense as holding the POTUS responsible for a drunken fight in a bar outside of a NC Army base, an off the deep end drill Sgt. , Tailhook or any number of irrespnsible/illegal acts commited by INDIVIDUALS that happen to be in the military.

The people involved in the abuse (no need for the word alleged as the dumba$$es took pictures ) should be tried and punished and their CO probably ought to lose his command. But holding the highest levels of the command structure personally liable for the actions of a few soldiers thousands of miles away, and twenty-odd tiers of command below them is ludicrous.

I'm not a Rumsfeld fan but this smacks of a witch hunt.