[Honeywell]

Originally posted by LeatherFace


Hmmm, so now I suppose you feel using that Biblical quote will greatly support your arguement. Okay, let's look at this. If you want to go by the Bible, and the OT teachings of "an eye for an eye," let's look at what it says about the death penalty.

In the Mosaic law the death penalty was inflicted for
murder, Gen. 9:5,6; Num. 35:16-21,30-33; Deut. 17:6;
adultery, Lev. 20:10; Deut. 22:24;
incest, Lev. 20:11,12,14;
bestiality, Ex. 22:19; Lev. 20:15,16;
sodomy, Lev. 18:22; 20:13;
incontinence, Deut. 22:21-24;
rape of a betrothed virgin, Deut. 22:25;
perjury, Zech. 5:4;
kidnapping, Ex. 21:16; Deut. 24:7;
upon a priest's daughter, who committed fornication, Lev. 21:9; for witchcraft, Ex. 22:18;
offering human sacrifice, Lev. 20:2-5;
for striking or cursing father or mother, Ex. 21:15,17; Lev. 20:9;
disobedience to parents, Deut. 21:18-21;
theft, Zech. 5:3,4;
blasphemy, Lev. 24:11-14,16,23;
for Sabbath desecration, Ex. 35:2; Num. 15:32-36;
for prophesying falsely, or propagating false doctrines, Deut. 13:1-10;
sacrificing to false gods, Ex. 22:20;
refusing to abide by the decision of court, Deut. 17:12;
for treason, 1 Kin. 2:25; Esth. 2:23;
sedition, Acts 5:36,37.


Soooo, if you are going to bring the age old adage into this, let's make sure we don't leave anyone out...don't say an eye for an eye unless you are familiar with the Bible...and eye for and eye just brings us down to the same level as the killer. We become him.

If someone committs a crime against another person let's say murder, that person deserves to be killed. If they steal something, cut off their hand (although I'd think that would be considered cruel and unusual punishment ). You get the idea, that's what I meant by an eye for eye, as it is reffered to in Matthew 5:30, 8:18 and Mark 9:43. But not only can it be applied to sin in our life like the Bible was talking about, but I believe it would also make a good form of punishment .

 

[Spud]

“Innocent people on death row is unacceptable. Until I can be sure that everyone sentenced to death in Illinois is truly guilty, no one will meet that fate. I can't support a system proven to be so fraught with error and come so close to the ultimate nightmare of taking an innocent person's life. People are starting to understand that there's a possibility that innocent people are going to be put to death. I don't think anybody wants that on their hands or their consciences. It's just a matter of right and wrong." -Gov. George Ryan

Illinois Gov. Ryan is a republican and has a long record of being pro capital punishment. He put a temporary moratorium on capital punishment in his state after DNA testing completely exhonerated people sentenced to death in his state.

Let's get a system that works before we start offing people.
:angry:

 

[Zonic Man]

This little thing called the Constitution and those pesky amendments.

 

[LeatherFace]

Originally posted by fourgivn1


You sure refer to the Bible a lot for someone who doesn't believe it's the Truth.

I only refer to it when others use it to support statements they make--by no means do I think it is the truth. I was raised Catholic, so I know where to look to find to rebut arguments that use all of their supporting "facts" by citing the Bible. I merely quoted (cut and pasted ) to point out how silly it is to use the Bible to support capital punishment (that good old "eye for an eye" adage), because I find that most people quote the Bible in places that further their beliefs, no matter what it is.

For example, I was reading some articles on a freaked out "Family Values" site and this woman wrote in about how she wouldn't let her grandchildren read Harry Potter because Harry was a wizard, which translated in her twisted brain as "witch," and the Bible says that witches and witchcraft are evil. "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live" I believe is the phrase, and I only know that because I studied the Salem Witch Trials. So she is advocating against Harry Potter. Give me a break! People have too much time on their hands, and tend to twist the words of a book into whatever they want them to be. That was merely my point.

But I kick butt at Bible Trivia!

 

[fourgivn1]

Originally posted by LeatherFace


I only refer to it when others use it to support statements they make--by no means do I think it is the truth. I was raised Catholic, so I know where to look to find to rebut arguments that use all of their supporting "facts" by citing the Bible. I merely quoted (cut and pasted ) to point out how silly it is to use the Bible to support capital punishment (that good old "eye for an eye" adage), because I find that most people quote the Bible in places that further their beliefs, no matter what it is.

But I kick butt at Bible Trivia!

Yep, you do that. Although I will say this, and this is not intended as a slam or an insult in any way.....it is very easy to rebut arguments, especially Biblical arguments, depending upon your point of view.

For instance, on the one hand, anyone who says "Ah, the Bible is a collection of stories" or "There's no proof that Jesus existed" is going to learn otherwise if they do any sort of research at all, because it's obvious that they're finding archaeological stuff and papyrus scrolls and such that support the Bible and the People in it. Just recently, as a matter of fact, a find was discovered that made a reference to the Biblical David. Before that time, there was no concrete find that directly refered to him, so a lot of non-believer scientists sort of gloated over that fact. Now they can't. *L*

On the other hand, one will never 'prove' that God exists, as far as looking for concrete, hard proof. Faith obviously requires that one make a few assumptions. And it is unfortunate (from my point of view) that people can't always make those assumptions. Why do I say this? Well, it is obvious that since there's really not 100% proof for EVERY religion, they all must be taken on faith. And Christianity has by far the largest amount of concrete evidence (in archaeological/historical/literary form).

Well, the same people that trust courts every day to convict people on the basis of evidence, can not accept God's existence, His Son's existence, etc., on the basis of evidence. It's fairly easy to prove that Jesus was not a liar or a lunatic by using logic, known facts (i.e., all the prophecies He spoke about were fulfilled - that can be proved easily), deductive reasoning, etc., and that He spoke the truth about the things He said. Once that is established, it is inferred that He spoke the truth about EVERY WORD He said, and then, of course, since He spoke of God, then God must exist. But people can't accept that because they can find no evidence for God HIMSELF.

No, I'm not taking witnessing potshots at you. But I will say that Christian arguments are a LOT stronger than most of the 'representatives' (the quotes denote facetiousness *L*) make them out to be. A good argument in the hands of a dumb believer makes - you got it - a dumb argument. I'm not by ANY means saying I'm a smart believer (although I'd like to think I am) but I ALWAYS go and research something if I do not know the answer, and I admit it if I'm wrong.

 

[Damn True]

you guys are like smart and stuff

 

[fourgivn1]

Duh, thanks! Me happy you give compliment.