Lemme know how that works out.
Why no more Coil forks?
- Thread starter -BB-
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No surprises here as his machanic is the guy behind SAR. It seems like they have some hydraulic bottom out implemented in there aswell.idk whats going on in this bongshed, but Gutierrez is ripping Coil
Seems like SAR will come out with some aftermarket options for coil enthusiasts.
Canyon is also on coil front and rear afaik.
Yes it does. I have Team and I have stiff spring in it. Its great fork! Did they do something new for 2017 model? My new one feels better than Team 2016 that I had. I think that I should test extrafirm spring in it because I weight 90kg.
Yes,but I read that Marcello is using the SAR setup:
But as UDI already pointed out a dual spring in this formation is nonsense as the resulting spring rate is still linear.
Actually the resulting spring rate is lower then the rate of both the springs.
The interesting part in this setup is, though, that it has a hydraulik bottom out, which imo if executed correctly, is the best endstroke control you can have. Just ask your fellow BOS-fork owner.
29 only right now, so if you ride smaller hoops you'll need to be good with 51mm offset.
"RXF 36 27.5"?
Still air, only the 29er master race gets the priviledge of coil. It'll come soon though I'm sure.
Those forks would be worthy contenders as "an enduro fork for men" if they added a 20mm pinchbolted axle.
Beside Fox, who is selling pinchbolted axle on both sides single crowned forks?
Bos has one side of the axle pinchbolted and X Fusion too on some models...
Bos has one side of the axle pinchbolted and X Fusion too on some models...
At least SOMEONE is listening.
https://www.pinkbike.com/news/hlins-debuts-new-trailenduro-forks.html
https://www.pinkbike.com/news/hlins-debuts-new-trailenduro-forks.html
Yeah, I was a bit confused by the article. It certainly talks about a coil 9'r, but in the 27.5 part, they say it is identical, but then start going into something about a 3 position air spring.If they only release a coil fork in 29":
There's been an air sprung 29er for a while now. The coil 29er and air sprung 650b are new. They meant that the 650b is like the existing air 29er, only 650bified.
I did a full rebuild on my bike yesterday and replaced oil in my Avalanche open bath. The damn lower in the air spring side of my Fox 36 was massively pressurized. What a crock.
I've seen the race techs doing the zip tie thing on pros bikes. Wonky as shit, but the lizards will eventually introduce a valve for this and everyone will get to upgrade.
Rockshox Domain is still coil.
I'm watching video now, not sure about that pneumatic bump stop...
Interesting... very interesting...
1) Buy old 36/Pike
2) Retrofit
3) ???
4) Profit!
1) Buy old 36/Pike
2) Retrofit
3) ???
4) Profit!
Sounds like a better solution than a hydraulic bottom out in that you can tune the end stroke externally. Nice that it doesn't engage until the last 1/3 of travel, so no worry about additional seal drag in the first 2/3rds. Too bad the spring perches are travel specific; I wonder how much each additional perch is.
Hmmm....looks like no 180mm version 
Meh, I have a Avalanche cart. Bottom out done right.
Same, if you have the right spring rate you really shouldn't need that.
210-285g gain seems unnecessary. I think they should make a cheaper/lighter version without the bump stop. Ditching an air spring for coil should certainly try and minimize the one deficit: weight.
The pricing is insane too. If they ditched the stupid bump stop I think it could be affordable / light and a great option.
I coil-converted my 40 / 36 long ago, I'll save the excitement for the air-sprung plebs.
Must admit I got excited when I saw the link on the homepage, but less so after seeing the implementation and $389 price tag. Hopefully with a bit more of this, Fox will bring back what everyone really wants - the good old-fashioned vanilla.
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Didn't Manitou have a hybrid coil/air fork eons ago. Short coil for smooth initial travel then an air spring for the rest of the giddyup?
no idea. but the dual rate air spring they've got with the mattoc is pretty fuckin' bitchin.
From the Ask Us Anything w/ DVO thing on Pinkbike -
bryson-dvo PLUS (2 hours ago)
@Boardlife69: we were the leaders in coil forks during the marzocchi days. Open bath Moto style! We're going to be bringing some of that back very soon!
bryson-dvo PLUS (2 hours ago)
@ibex: Most likely we will do it in the Diamond Chassis. So 140-170 range. Not exactly sure if we're going the full open bath or hybrid style just yet. Depends on the actual ride feel once we start testing
DVOSuspension (35 mins ago)
We do have a lot of past experience in making progressively wound coil springs during our days at Marzocchi and there are some restrictions to achieving the exact spring rate performance because of the small stanchion tube diameters as well as some other factors. We have found its easier to produce a liner coil spring which is lighter and generate the progressiveness from damping and air/oil volume.
bryson-dvo PLUS (2 hours ago)
@Boardlife69: we were the leaders in coil forks during the marzocchi days. Open bath Moto style! We're going to be bringing some of that back very soon!
bryson-dvo PLUS (2 hours ago)
@ibex: Most likely we will do it in the Diamond Chassis. So 140-170 range. Not exactly sure if we're going the full open bath or hybrid style just yet. Depends on the actual ride feel once we start testing
DVOSuspension (35 mins ago)
We do have a lot of past experience in making progressively wound coil springs during our days at Marzocchi and there are some restrictions to achieving the exact spring rate performance because of the small stanchion tube diameters as well as some other factors. We have found its easier to produce a liner coil spring which is lighter and generate the progressiveness from damping and air/oil volume.
I took a few rides on the hybrid 40 a couple of years ago (coil with air end-stroke) and found it very sensitive to tiny pressure changes. Bottom out resistance was just a few psi.
Are you suggesting that I linear rate fork would be acceptable for a wide range of terrain and obstacles? Having spent the last year and a half testing coil forks I can assure you that the ABS is very necessary. I think anyone who rode the old style FOX VAN36 can attest to both putting the hydraulic bottoming piston to the maximum setting and having to over-spring the fork in order to keep it from bottoming.Same, if you have the right spring rate you really shouldn't need that.
210-285g gain seems unnecessary. I think they should make a cheaper/lighter version without the bump stop. Ditching an air spring for coil should certainly try and minimize the one deficit: weight.
The pricing is insane too. If they ditched the stupid bump stop I think it could be affordable / light and a great option.
I coil-converted my 40 / 36 long ago, I'll save the excitement for the air-sprung plebs.
Must admit I got excited when I saw the link on the homepage, but less so after seeing the implementation and $389 price tag. Hopefully with a bit more of this, Fox will bring back what everyone really wants - the good old-fashioned vanilla.
Darren
Yeah, this was my experience.
Two questions for you Darren:
- How much for an extra perch (I change travel on one of my 36s between 150 and 160)
- Are there plans for a 180mm version (my other 36 stays at 180)?
I've already shared my thoughts on coil spring rates and bottom out resistance earlier in the thread. "Over-spring" could mean many things depending on which factors you considered when modeling an existing air sprung fork. I think you may be referring to the very old VAN36 there too, as the HBO was non-adjustable (from memory) on the inverted-RC2 equipped VAN36 (circa 2011-2013). The pre-invert dampers were heavily lacking in compression damping so it's not really a fair comparison.
The answer to your question is somewhat travel-dependent. Personally I'd rather jump up to the 170mm 36 if running out of travel was an issue (= no weight penalty from memory) rather than lug around a sealed air spring unit inside my coil spring. But, full disclosure: I ride a DH bike for stuff that needs 203mm of travel - I run a coil converted new 40 (standard spring for my weight per Fox guidelines), which I've tested with the HBO damper and non-HBO damper. I prefer the non-HBO and very rarely bottom it out (usually only on a botched big landing).
For people hitting bikeparks / big stuff on their 160mm fork a bottom out system may well be necessary (which is fair and probably describes an increasing number of users - so I don't disagree with you) but I would have solved the problem in a more cost- and weight-conscious way personally. The HBO damper added only ~15g.
I think there would be a far bigger market for a lower priced system with a far more basic bottom out system if deemed necessary. I think two versions would net greater sales/profits and reach a bigger audience. If the ABS could be retrofitted it'd be even better, letting people decide (and spend the extra) if they need it for their riding application. Just an idea.
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Just saw this on my FB feed. Was about to come here and post it. Looks like another WIN for Push!!