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Why? (religious iconography)

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by TN, May 12, 2009.

  1. TN

    TN Hey baby, want a hot dog?

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    Why is Christian iconography so morbid & sad (for the most part...IMO) compared to Buddhist iconography or Hindu? Although Hindu iconography can sometimes be violent it still looks cool & invokes more of a "F YEAH!" than a "damn.".

    Thoughts?
     

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  2. jimmydean

    jimmydean The Official Meat of Ridemonkey

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    :stupid:

    My mom does a retreat once a year and does some crazy icon stuff. Crazy Catholics.
     
  3. Jim Mac

    Jim Mac MAKE ENDURO GREAT AGAIN

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    I don't think you can lump in all sects of Christianity like that necessarily. I love many of the Celtic Crosses of the UK personally - it's iconic.
     
  4. mandown

    mandown Poopdeck Repost

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    Well, the first part of the bible was written (in general) as a code of how to live life and stay healthy in regards to both the body and community. The second part of the bible is where it becomes Christian and more of the morbid images show up. Keep in mind was written as pick-up from where that left off, and it was not written in a single work, but in various unrelated works, which were combined by a council nearly 300 years after the time of Jesus. The writings were from a group of people who had a religion and culture that clashed with that of the ruling religion and culture. Because of this, it was difficult to write works that directly spoke against the ruling element without harsh punishment being dealt. Instead, code was needed and the good-vs-evil and god-vs-devil and angel-vs-demon elements were code for the oppressed-vs-the ruling.

    Of course, most of this was literature and the visual elements didn't come into play until the renaissance, when artists began to develop better skills to depict the writings in painting form. Combine that with the growing wealth of the church, making them the people who could pay the artists (and musicians) of the time to create works that showed the glory of the church, and BANGO! you get strong graphic images that show how dark "the other side" can be and how glorious the path of the righteous is.

    I would imagine that some of the other religions you brought up may have been more widely accepted by the cultures they were rooted in and thus the need to show the clash and conflict was less important.

    Edit:
    Also consider that the final book of the bible is Revelation (no "s" on that kids) and that is the big closer for the book. People tend to remember the first and LAST things they read, so the grand finale of the Bible is a very morbid and conflict laden story, which most of us tend to remember.

    Rember, this is a piece of apocalyptic literature, defined as followed (taken form Wikipedia... yeah, I know):
    The object of this literature in general was to solve the difficulties connected with the righteousness of God and the suffering condition of His righteous servants on earth.
     
    #4 -   May 12, 2009
    Last edited: May 12, 2009
  5. TN

    TN Hey baby, want a hot dog?

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    True. But the I have only lived in the bible belt & up here in catholic/lutheran land so....

    Jesus makes me sad. Shiva makes me want to rock out. That is all I am saying. :D
     
  6. johnbryanpeters

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    Jesus makes me bored. Shiva, well, sh1t, I don't know...
     
  7. drkenan

    drkenan anti-dentite

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    Cuz if it weren't all morbid, they wouldn't be able to make awesome horror trilogies based on it!

     
  8. SkaredShtles

    SkaredShtles I love NEWCASTLE and will ONLY drink NEWCASTLE!!!!

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    You sure as hell aren't looking very hard.



     
  9. AngryMetalsmith

    AngryMetalsmith Business is good, thanks for asking

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    It's the whole " we sin from birth " and " must ask God for forgiveness " concept. The idea that humans are damned from the get go is very morbid.

    It's the Christian way of controlling it's followers. Too many of them get caught up in this idea and fail to live their lives in accordance with the teachings of their Christ. So they act like jerks monday through Saturday, repent on Sunday, then repeat as necessary. This behavior is hypocritical to their guiding principles and creates an atmosphere based upon lies and deceit, which in turn damages ones spirituality. Living this way tends to keep them repressed and downtrodden, so morbid iconography is the more applicable norm.
     
  10. maddog17

    maddog17 Turbo Monkey

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    don't confuse Christians with Catholics
     
  11. Leppah

    Leppah Turbo Monkey

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    I do that same thing on my xbox. When i don't do that good, i just erase my game or account, and start all over. Then i'm good again.
     
  12. mandown

    mandown Poopdeck Repost

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    ovals and circles man: all catholics are christians, but not all christians are catholics.
     
  13. Leppah

    Leppah Turbo Monkey

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    Where do the mormons fit in to this?
     
  14. mandown

    mandown Poopdeck Repost

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    some say no
    http://www.cnview.com/on_line_resources/are_mormons_christian.htm

    some say yes
    http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/response/general/christians/

    i'd likely go with yes. they follow teachings of Christ, thus are Christians be definition. they may have taken a different spin, and support their beliefs with additional books, but they are followers of Christ.


    Edit - Think of the argument as DH vs. FR. To those on the outside, it looks the same and it is born from common roots. To those who hold one or the other close to their hearts, they are very different things.
     
    #14 -   May 12, 2009
    Last edited: May 12, 2009
  15. SkaredShtles

    SkaredShtles I love NEWCASTLE and will ONLY drink NEWCASTLE!!!!

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    In the "insane" Christian camp.

    They're not alone...

    :D
     
  16. syadasti

    syadasti i heart mac

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    Based on personal experience, Quakers are probably the only western religion that does not seem inherently used as a rudimentary political control tool.
     
  17. narlus

    narlus Eastcoast Softcore
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    white people.
     
  18. amishmatt

    amishmatt Turbo Monkey

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    Because it's easier to control people through fear.
     
  19. CBJ

    CBJ Turbo Monkey

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    Only short term.
     
  20. Mr Ridiculous

    Mr Ridiculous Margarita my slippers

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    Unless you get them scared of an omnipotent, immortal deity who is somehow everywhere at once and knows everything they do. That's the trick.
     
  21. maddog17

    maddog17 Turbo Monkey

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    i guess so. my parents are living in florida now and i remember my mom telling me that since there are so many church's down there she runs into that all the time. personally i could care less. i dont believe in any higher power but i gotta hand it to the roman catholics for running their business very well.
     
  22. eric strt6

    eric strt6 Resident Curmudgeon

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    damn Death Cults if you ask me:crazy:
     
  23. JRogers

    JRogers talks too much

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    Well, there is more to Christian iconography than dudes hanging from crosses and the like. Then again, total depravity doesn't exactly make for the happiest of images.

    But maybe the world could stand a few tries at seeing itself through those categories. It might explain some things I've noticed...
     
  24. stevew

    stevew unique white person

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    be happy there aren't statues of priests plundering little boys assholes or face fvcking them.

    the truth shall set you free.
     
  25. Leppah

    Leppah Turbo Monkey

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    I guess multiple wives wouldn't be that bad of a deal if they were hot. But they're never hot. Just creepy. Whenever i see pictures of them, i can't help but think of the movie "lord of illusions" with all of those brainwashed cult followers.
     
  26. Prettym1k3

    Prettym1k3 Turbo Monkey

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    The sad part is, is that Christ's teachings (After all, are "Christians" supposed to be "Christ-like"?) weren't about instilling fear. They were about rebelling against a controlling super-power. They were about taking morality to the next level (You have heard it say don't sleep with another man's wife, but I tell you that if you lust after your neighbor's wife, you have already committed adultery). Christ's teachings don't involve morbidity as people think they do. But the Catholic church, over centuries of rule as the spokesperson for all things Christian, have taken it to the next level. Morbid things are part of the human lifestyle, unfortunately. We all die, some of us horrible and tragic deaths. To not mention morbid things, it would be like leaving out an honest part of humanity. I mean, you couldn't write history, or about the future, without being somewhat morbid, could you? Honestly? Deep down we all know our nature. If you believe we're inherently evil, we will continue to do evil. If you believe we are inherently good, you have to admit that mistakes will be made with horrible and evil outcomes.

    Why, in Catholic churches, is Christ constantly depicted as still being on the Cross? Didn't he die, and rise again on the third day, ascending to heaven? If he did, then the only conclusion I can come to is that depicting him still on the cross is a reminder of guilt, shame, and the responsibility for putting him there that rests with us all. Hence, instilling fear and this "mind control" over the people, is the name of the game.

    But most modern non-denominational, Prostenant, and Bible churches that I know of truly try to stay away from the fear factor and focus on the love and compassion and acceptance (acceptance as humans and as people He loved, not for their sinful lifestyle) Christ had on others. Fear has been used for centuries and the church, particularly over the past decade, has had a wake up call and made leaps forward to end the fear factor.

    Don't get me wrong. Many churches still use fear techniques to "scare" people into joining. But that's the wrong motive altogether. Numbers don't matter. It's about real faith. Many churches have numbers. Few churches have people who have real faith.

    To put it into perspective, I've met "Catholic Practicing Atheists". ...how does that work? :confused:
     
    #26 -   May 13, 2009
    Last edited: May 13, 2009
  27. mandown

    mandown Poopdeck Repost

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    i think the use of the crucifix is because it is a simple symbol to depict and it is meant to remind followers of the ulitmate price one man was willing to pay for his beliefs. christ would not submit to the powers of the time and thus his memory lives on. it is easier to see this as a "morbid" reminder than to think it through more layers and remember the other things it is meant to remind followers of. it is a mutated result of Ocam's razor: