[OB1]

Shuttling. Why the strong feelings for, or against? It cracks me up to hear shuttlers call climbers "uncoordinated, geeks"....or hear climbers call shuttlers "weak and childish." I want to hear some thoughts on the "climber vs shuttler" hate fest. Let's see if we can get more than false logic used to justify feelings.

ding, ding...round 1.

 

[Da Peach]

I've never heard any of the ones you mentioned.

Shuttlers being fat and lazy? Yeah, got a problem with that?

 

[Gex]

I love a good pedal up the hill but if there is a shuttle truck. FU%# peddling. Ill take my free ride. I can get more laps in and focus on what matters to me the most. Going down the hill!

As for this argument, I have not heard such a thing. In the PNW we know when to take the shuttle.

 

[boogenman]

Shuttling. Why the strong feelings for, or against? It cracks me up to hear shuttlers call climbers "uncoordinated, geeks"....or hear climbers call shuttlers "weak and childish." I want to hear some thoughts on the "climber vs shuttler" hate fest. Let's see if we can get more than false logic used to justify feelings.

ding, ding...round 1.

I shuttle, use a chairlift, gondola, rope tow, sky hook, walk and ride up to the top.

been saving beer cans and bottles for a while now to buy this(worth 5 cents here):

 

[fro biker]

"free ride" = freeride

settled.

walking up may be "tougher" but it is not "better". i'll drive/chairlift/gondola/magic carpet to the top any day if it means i get more runs in.

 

[OB1]

Here's a good "for instance." I was with a big group riding Pisgah. The ride we chose was a loooong shuttle, with a couple good climbs in it. We set up the vehicles at the top and bottom, and began the ride. During one of the big fire road climbs, a truck stopped and offered us all a lift to the top of that climb. 3 of us took that lift and waited at the top for the climbers to catch up. 3 others of us chose NOT to take the lift, and climbed. It ruined the day! The "climbers" that didn't take the lift made snide comments the toward the "shuttle monkeys." The group split in two the rest of the day. There was a real tension. Like the shuttlers were somehow....cheaters. Even though everyone was welcome to ride the truck up. The climbers were angry at the shuttlers, and the shuttlers disliked the climbers because they felt...looked down upon. What is that mentality?

 

[Da Peach]

You should have run them down in the truck.

 

[OB1]

Wow, this topic is like politics/religion I guess. Nobody wants to touch it haha. Why do you think the climbers were bitter toward the guys who took that lift??

I shuttle, use a chairlift, gondola, rope tow, sky hook, walk and ride up to the top.

been saving beer cans and bottles for a while now to buy this(worth 5 cents here):

edit: P.S. Heli shuttling with T.C.? I wonder how many 45lb rigs that thing could carry? Heli shuttling is now on my bucket list boogenman.

 

[I Are Baboon]

I like riding.

 

[TheTruth]

If you have a dh bike then take a shuttle. If you have an xc bike, climb. Any questions?

 

[stevew]

i suggest you take some vagisil on your rides....some of the guys need it.

 

[OB1]

haha. Funny nobody wants to tackle this. But that's cool. I just thought it was a big elephant on the trail that would be fun as a thread. We have all heard the discussions on the hill. "you have to earn it"...."but I prefer riding dh"...."Climbing will give you the endurance you need"..."a full day of shuttling/lifts is where my endurance comes from"..."lazy hippie"..."stuck up gear head"


edit: Funny thing about that ride I mentioned. I showed up that day with one of the guys who declined the lift up that one climb. So I stayed with the climbers just to stay with him. And I was in good enough shape that climbing didn't really bother me. I listened to them run down the guys who jumped on the truck, all the way up. I kept my mouth shut, but was thinking,"why do you guys care if they climb or not?"

 

[stevew]

i don't give a sh!t how someone wants to ride their bike.

 

[owentking]

I think its all bull**** if people have an issue. As long as youre riding youre bike, who cares? I agree with whats already been said. Its like the stupid question of which is better, skiing or snowboarding? It doesn't matter. As long as you're out then life is good. If climbing is important for you then enjoy the climb. If going down is all that matters, more power to ya. Just don't rag on another persons style if its not exactly what you would do. Thats just childish, not the choice to climb or not.

 

[OB1]

i suggest you take some vagisil on your rides....some of the guys need it.

BINGO! That's exactly the attitude I'm talking about(even though you're probably just being funny, or actually talking about the climbers). Anti-shuttle guys seem to think shuttlers are weak pussies. So much so that I've heard guys who I KNOW shuttle all the time, DENY being a shuttle monkey in front of "some guys," for fear of looking like a woose. Hmm, how do you spell wuse? Woose? Wusse? ...Shuttler?

 

[OB1]

We all seem to be in agreement. Who cares what other people are doing...blah, blah, blah. But the fact is, shuttle monkey haters are real. So I titled this thread.....WHY? I'm not being rhetorical. I'm honestly interested in ideas about this. I have my theories. But I'm no psychiatrist.

 

[owentking]

We all seem to be in agreement. Who cares what other people are doing...blah, blah, blah. But the fact is, shuttle monkey haters are real. So I titled this thread.....WHY? I'm not being rhetorical. I'm honestly interested in ideas about this. I have my theories. But I'm no psychiatrist.

I think this is a fantastic thread. Its sad that people hate, period. I'm sure people hate for all types of reasons. Maybe some hate simply cause they really wish they were the shuttle monkeys. Maybe some have had a bad experience with a DH rider. Maybe some have no idea that throwing a DH bike around as you fly down the hill at speeds a hell of a lot faster then a XC bike can handle takes a s*** ton of effort and concentration and has a hell of a lot higher margin for injury (imo) then XC. I stopped DHing after i dislocated my elbow and couldn't straighten it so I switched to XC and I was always bummed that I couldn't do some of the lines that I used to. Now I'm getting a bigger bike again since I'm finding my balls.

 

[OB1]

Well said Owentking.

This theory was PM'd to me. I'll paraphrase. We all "compete" with each other when we ride. Some take it too far, but for the most part there is a healthy unspoken competition. Maybe climbers see the climbing as a sport? Not just a simple exercise that takes no bike skills. It's their opportunity to feel like they are competing. When a rider shuttles, we eliminate the thing the climber is good at. That makes them bitter. Onto something????

 

[Riding]

I like riding.

You are too sweet.

But I like women.

 

[I Are Baboon]

You are too sweet.

But I like women.

Prude.

 

[eric strt6]

Around here the best runs are poaches. No one seemed to mind the one to two riders clandestinely hittind the trails. The large shuttle groups with blaring tunes at drop off pissed off the home owners and started a crack down. They just took a small dozer and removed one of the best local trailhead in response. No problems with shuttling if you keep it low profile and quiet[like I do], unfortunately many don't and all of us pay the price

 

[moff_quigley]

If the ride is on a DH/FR track shuttling = win.

If you are shuttling on an otherwise trail/XC ride = weak sauce IMHO.

 

[owentking]

Maybe climbers see the climbing as a sport? Not just a simple exercise that takes no bike skills.

I wouldn't say climbing takes "no bike skills". I enjoy a good climb (on the right bike) and love pedaling up something which had stumped me times before. Its a good accomplishment, not to mention the endorphine dump from spinning until you want to puke. Am i a masichist? But i agree with the competition thing. Again, it shouldn't matter as long as you're on your bike?

 

[owentking]

And I kinda agree with moff_quigley. Theres certainly a grey area of trails that are very shuttleable but also XCish around me so you get the nice big bikes and the HTs. Again, as long as youre on your bike.

 

[owentking]

Around here the best runs are poaches. No one seemed to mind the one to two riders clandestinely hittind the trails. The large shuttle groups with blaring tunes at drop off pissed off the home owners and started a crack down. They just took a small dozer and removed one of the best local trailhead in response. No problems with shuttling if you keep it low profile and quiet[like I do], unfortunately many don't and all of us pay the price

Thats a very respectable point. I think that would also be a fantastic point to make about the ethics of poaching trails in this thread. I would love to hear some peoples opinions on that one. Thanks for sharing.
http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/showthread.php?t=230295

 

[loco-gringo]

I'll take the "don't care" category. I like to shuttle, but a good XC ride is ok too.

Who am I kidding??? I just ride on the road.

 

[blackohio]

I have a AM bike for long rides and a big boy bike for shuttle runs. Im bothered when a otherwise fun ride gets ruined by some super xc rider barely crawling through a otherwise fun/fast section.

If theres no shuttle, ill hike. Im not about to show some asshole im macho by trying to pedal a 40 lbs bike uphill all day and when im rocketing past him creeping down the trail hopefully ill bust ass and he can creep through it.

 

[JohnE]

i don't give a sh!t how someone wants to ride their bike.

+1. Who cares how another moron rides?

 

[jdcamb]

I'm right and you're all wrong, so there it's settled.....

 

[Sandwich]

do you have any idea how much fun riding a bike down a hill is? whether you climb to get to it or take a bus or a giant hawk it still kicks ass...plus, if you don't climb, you get more runs down.

It's just different. Not worse or better, but a different way of getting your kicks.

 

[Icantdrive65]

I feel it's better when you "earn your turns."
I ride for exercise as well as for fun, so I prefer to climb. In fact, I can ride straight from my back door and never even turn the key in my truck most days.
When I see Mom dropping kids off at the top, I wonder if those kids can climb the hill. It seems like they are missing half of the sport.

All that said, I ride the shuttle when I go to Downieville.

 

[OB1]

I like it.....starting to sound more like what actually gets said on the trail. Some guys say "why climb if that trail if you can shuttle it, and get more runs?" And other saying "why shuttle if you can climb, and get more exercise?"

I was riding in San Diego in January. While bombing down, we ran up behind an xc style rider. When my buddy yelled ON YOUR LEFT, the guy refused to move for awhile. There was plenty of room but he purposely blocked the trail. We didn't want to be asses, so we didn't push our way by. On our way past him, we didn't say anything...but he made a snide, or bitter comment about how he had pedaled up. He assumed we hadn't ridden up because of our big bikes....though we had. So...I guess if he knew we had pedaled up, he wouldn't have minded us passing him. What is that? Why do so many XC guys have this anger toward other riders who they assume didn't pedal up something? I need a T-shirt that says,"don't hate me, I pedaled up." hahaha, like all the liquor stores in L.A. with signs that say "black owned."

 

[OB1]

P.S.....this roll over, pop up motorcycle ad on the right is pissing me off!!

 

[Icantdrive65]

I keep an ear out for riders coming down and I get out of the way early to let them by. I don't hate; it just annoys me that they are "cheating." Around here, most of the good DH trails are not that desirable to climb. There is one trail that everybody climbs and 12 trails that people bomb down. On weekdays you can get away with climbing the DH trails, but you still need to listen for oncoming traffic.

 

[OB1]

Wait...I think I see something here. Question...what's better for a DH racer training for the season:
Shuttling as many runs down an 8 min dh as they physically can
or
2 runs on the same dh, with 2 climbs up
??????????????????????

 

[owentking]

Wait...I think I see something here. Question...what's better for a DH racer training for the season:
Shuttling as many runs down an 8 min dh as they physically can
or
2 runs on the same dh, with 2 climbs up
??????????????????????

That is a good question OB1. My answer to that is both. You need both for training. Getting more runs in allows you to work on your technique and riding while pedaling up gets you in shape, improves your cardio and makes you stronger thus allowing you to go faster on the DH. It gives you more endurance.

 

[Sonic Reducer]

shuttle usually = more laps = more fun.
I know a DHer who is such a hippie that he even dislikes chairlift access because it is mechanized. his bike is pretty pimped out though.

 

[OB1]

haha...nice Sonic.

Owen, that's an interesting perspective. I take a little different view. As a DH team manager. Small bike shop team, but still a team. I tell my guys to spend their week dirt jumping, XC, bmx, etc. When we get a chance to be up on a mountain, it's go time. Pure shuttle. There is no substitute for saddle time on an actual DH course for a DH'r in my mind. We inspect the trail, time trial, and share line ideas. I guarantee nobody has anything left in the tank at the end of the day. Endurance, spent. Strength, spent. Blood, let. I would be disappointed if one of my guys/gals used precious DH energy/time pedaling up a hill. Thats what mid-week is for. At the bottom of each run, I want to see them keel over with burning lungs in sheer exhaustion from pedaling/pumping DOWN the hill. Although....to play devils advocate.... if I lived 10 minutes from good DH runs, you would see me pedaling up a lot during a week. But for most of us, 1 or 2 days a week on the mtn is all we can muster. Gotta squeeze in as much gravity as physically possible. Am I wrong?

 

[jonKranked]

seriously guys? who cares... you sound like the anti-bike sierra club members with some of your logic. Its your bike, ride it how you want and have fun. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

 

[KavuRider]

I like to climb.
Shuttling is ok, depends on the trails. I like shuttling our local mountain because the one trail going UP is usually packed with hikers. The other DH trails going down are usually pretty empty. So it actually makes sense.
On the other hand, it seems that shuttling has become a big thing around here lately and so we now have big vans full of people with trailers going up the hill all weekend. What used to be a fairly under-the-radar thing has now attracted a lot of attention. We'll see how that plays out in the future.

But like many others in this thread, I could care less if someone shuttles or climbs up.