[nauc]

http://www.abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=5442615&page=1

lets see....

cigs kill 300,000+ americans every year

obesity kills around 300,000 americans every year

alcohol kills around 80,000 americans every year

weed still hasnt killed anyone

why is weed illegal again?

*rollseyes*

 

[Sherpa]

Hello PaWN

 

[4xBoy]

"I'm calling her a criminal," Tallahassee police chief Dennis Jones told 20/20, who maintains that both drug dealers and drug users are considered criminals to his department.

So what is a person that forces someone to choose Death or jail? F---ing pigs.

 

[llkoolkeg]

The weed won't kill ya but the man surely will if you dare to peaceably enjoy it.

 

[Silver]

The only reason this story gets any attention is because she's a fairly cute white girl. Make her an overweight black or hispanic and this doesn't make the back page of the neighbourhood free rag...

 

[ire]

The only reason this story gets any attention is because she's a fairly cute white girl. Make her an overweight black or hispanic and this doesn't make the back page of the neighbourhood free rag...

Crackers get attention

 

[nauc]

Crackers get attention

unless it makes blacks look bad...

http://www.crimelibrary.com/news/original/0507/0301_channon_christian.html.html

 

[sanjuro]

While I don't agree with the punishment, she had marijuana and ecstasy with her. While this is a Saturday night for most people, I wouldn't carry that much gear with me. I wouldn't be carrying at all.

EDIT: I reread this story. I would never agree to go to a big buy for guns and massive drugs with strangers, nor would I advise my client to do the same. She had a bad lawyer protecting her interests.

http://www.alternet.org/drugreporter/93082/the_killing_of_rachel_hoffman_and_the_tragedy_that_is_pot_prohibition/

Under prohibition, Rachel faced up to five years in a Florida prison for possessing a small amount of marijuana. (Under state law, violators face up to a $5,000 fine and five years in prison for possession of more than 20 grams of pot.)

Under prohibition, the police in Rachel's community viewed the 23-year-old recent college graduate as nothing more than a criminal and threatened her with jail time unless she cooperated with them as an untrained, unsupervised confidential informant. Her assignment: Meet with two men she'd never met and purchase a large quantity of cocaine, ecstasy and a handgun. Rachel rendezvoused with the two men; they shot and killed her.

 

[binary visions]

Seems to me like the issue here has nothing to do with marijuana and has everything to do with some f**kwits in the police department.

 

[Lowlight7]

Rachel was in a drug court diversion program when she became an informant.

Since when do they recruit CIs from drug diversion programs?

Since when do they send CIs on buys with people they don't know?

 

[sanjuro]

Since when do they recruit CIs from drug diversion programs?

Since when do they send CIs on buys with people they don't know?

 

[Drunken_Ninja]

ur laws in the states about the pot are fvct. i mean here i got diversion once and it meant 25hours of volunteer work for a dime. I know someone who did 4 days in jail for a half quarter though. it aint pretty what they do to weedheads. it is better to take the charges and get a lawyer than to risk your life just to wear a wire or sign a deposition. You can get shot for doing that. narcs get paid to be in the line of fire, if they wont do the job themselves then obviously if they are too chicken then u should be too. i dont think this girl was to bright to be cooperating with them. Dont they teach this stuff in college in the states? cause i learned all this in school here. the subject of drugs must be really taboo on campus there...

 

[nauc]

Seems to me like the issue here has nothing to do with marijuana and has everything to do with some f**kwits in the police department.

what

if weed were legal, she wouldnt have gotten busted in the first place

 

[JohnE]

Seems to me like the issue here has nothing to do with marijuana and has everything to do with some f**kwits in the police department.

Agrees...there are some serious liability issues here...

 

[manimal]

what

if weed were legal, she wouldnt have gotten busted in the first place

but it's not.

"if that stop sign wasn't there i wouldn't have gotten a ticket for running it"

you either obey the law or you don't, it's that simple.



and yes, that agency's CI policy needs to be seriously scrutinized. you don't send a first-timer out on a big order, especially one involving guns.

 

[kidwoo]

but it's not.

"if that stop sign wasn't there i wouldn't have gotten a ticket for running it"

And as your punishment, you must stand in front of other cars running stop signs to help up arrest more people.


You're a cop with probably at least a few petty drug busts like this, so enlighten me.

What the fvck does working as an informant have to do with assigning a sentence? You either broke the law or you didn't. You therefore either earn the penalty or you didn't. When the hell did this get out of jail free for putting yourself at risk shlt come about as standard operating procedure. And having had some friends go through this, it most certainly was standard operating procedure where I went to college.



Also: nauc: lay the fvck off the weed for a while. It just took you a year to put together a thought to respond to this thread.

 

[manimal]

And as your punishment, you must stand in front of other cars running stop signs to help up arrest more people.


You're a cop with probably at least a few petty drug busts like this, so enlighten me.

What the fvck does working as an informant have to do with assigning a sentence? You either broke the law or you didn't. You therefore either earn the penalty or you didn't. When the hell did this get out of jail free for putting yourself at risk shlt come about as standard operating procedure. And having had some friends go through this, it most certainly was standard operating procedure where I went to college.

little fish, big fish. I can't vouch for the agency that got the girl killed but we don't do things like that.

if i get some low level dealer or user ,with a FELONY charge, they all get the same speech. "here's the number to our vice unit, if you feel like helping us out then call, if not, don't. if you do help us out, your cooperation will be noted when your case comes up for trial ie; the DA will be much nicer to you and may not go after the harshest penalty. (hence the reason there is a range of punishments the judge can dish out for any given conviction...ever heard of "mitigating" and "aggravating" factors in a case? helping us put a hurting on the local drug trade is a "mitigating" factor thus lessening your overall punishment.)

now, by "helping us out" we mean that you give up your supplier, or, make a low level buy at the latest and greatest crack house (not big deals and most definitely not with guns involved...that's what undercover officers are for).
either way, your name stays anonymous and off of a search warrant, if it comes to that, and, if you continue to help us out you can earn some $$ for your efforts.

if you're possessing or dealing in felony amounts you should know the game already and know that you're already putting yourself in danger. the amount of dealers working for the man is astronomical and goes to prove that in the drug industry you trust no one.

 

[kidwoo]

You and I have had this discussion before so I know we differ on this. But there's a very large division between what you see as the all encompassing 'drug industry', and some college kids buying an ounce of weed here and there and then selling personal bits to chicks like this one. It's glaringly obvious to me that this girl wasn't sent in to bust whomever she buys a few 8ths from but rather sent into that bigger realm where she's dealing with two gnarly guys with guns.

In general I think putting people in a situation to either rat on their associates or face what's likely the maximum penalty for their crimes rather than just sentence them on the circumstances surrounding the crime is bunk. But in a situation like this where it seems this girl was taken out of the sorrity chicks selling small baggies to each other realm and into the bigger money dickhead realm, the biggest tragedy is dumb cops not knowing the difference.

Based on your post, it sounds like you guys at least see this difference.

 

[manimal]

You and I have had this discussion before so I know we differ on this. But there's a very large division between what you see as the all encompassing 'drug industry', and some college kids buying an ounce of weed here and there and then selling personal bits to chicks like this one. It's glaringly obvious to me that this girl wasn't sent in to bust whomever she buys a few 8ths from but rather sent into that bigger realm where she's dealing with two gnarly guys with guns.

In general I think putting people in a situation to either rat on their associates or face what's likely the maximum penalty for their crimes rather than just sentence them on the circumstances surrounding the crime is bunk. But in a situation like this where it seems this girl was taken out of the sorrity chicks selling small baggies to each other realm and into the bigger money dickhead realm, the biggest tragedy is dumb cops not knowing the difference.

Based on your post, it sounds like you guys at least see this difference.

1. they don't automatically get the maximum punishment if they don't help out, it just doesn't show as a mitigating factor at sentencing.

2. yes, we see the difference and we have very rigid standard operating procedures regarding the use of CI's.

 

[Silver]

1. they don't automatically get the maximum punishment if they don't help out, it just doesn't show as a mitigating factor at sentencing.

Which is NOT what a 23 year old idiot girl from Florida hears, and the cops know it.

This is a great object lesson for all you parents out there. Your child should have the phone number of your lawyer, and should be told that the police aren't on your side, and that you keep your ****ing mouth shut until you have counsel with you.

 

[kidwoo]

1. they don't automatically get the maximum punishment if they don't help out, it just doesn't show as a mitigating factor at sentencing.

So out of curiosity: Give me the rundown of how you guys bring this up in a typical scenario.

 

[manimal]

So out of curiosity: Give me the rundown of how you guys bring this up in a typical scenario.

first off, this is only brought up on felony charges; large amounts of narcotics, smaller amounts packaged for sale, etc. so it's not like a "kid" is just in possession of a dime bag, this is for people that know what they're getting into.

so say i snag some low level dealer with 10 dime bags of weed in his pocket. i take him to the PD and process him. after that's all done i ask him if he wants to help himself out and talk about where he gets his dope. if he says no we simply head over to the magistrates office and he either gets a bond or a written promise to appear and i'm done with him until the case comes up in court. (bond is determined by the magistrate and depends on multiple factors to include prior charges, history of failures to appear in court, whether or not he resisted arrest, etc.) i usually ask for a written promise as long as the arrest went smooth, regardless of whether the guy wants to help out or not....it just adds another half hour to my time with him if i have to walk him over to the jail.

if he says, "yes". we sit down in an interview room and i ask him questions to try and get as much info on his supplier and how the dealing works (mcdonalds method, drive thru, walk ups, etc.)
then i give him the number to vice and tell him that his cooperation so far will be noted in court with the instruction that he can get paid for working for them as well as mitigate his case in court with his furthered cooperation.

there's no coercion or promises made; just a simple "you scratch my back, i'll scratch yours" sentiment portrayed.

then, if they go work as a CI they first make some very small purchases to prove their reliability before we can even use them on a case. once they're found reliable we can use them to find local dope houses through small purchases....they make money off of it as well.

so no, it's not like we snag some sorority girl for having a roach in her ashtray and send her out to a gang controlled neighborhood to buy a kilo of coke.

 

[kidwoo]

so no, it's not like we snag some sorority girl for having a roach in her ashtray and send her out to a gang controlled neighborhood to buy a kilo of coke.

Well that's good. Because it sure seems like that's what happened in this case last year.

Do you guys really use the term 'dime bag?' I remember hearing that term in my 8th grade health class in the 80s, from a book written in the 70s along with terms like 'smokin grass', 'shootin horse', 'swallerin bennies, blues and reds', and 'sniffin nose candy'

 

[manimal]

Well that's good. Because it sure seems like that's what happened in this case last year.

Do you guys really use the term 'dime bag?' I remember hearing that term in my 8th grade health class in the 80s, from a book written in the 70s along with terms like 'smokin grass', 'shootin horse', 'swallerin bennies, blues and reds', and 'sniffin nose candy'

yup.., nick bag, dime bag, duece, pee-wee, doughball..... all terms still used on the streets.

"you got anything on you today?" "yeah man...i got 2 dime bags and a pee-wee in my pocket"

 

[kidwoo]

yup.., nick bag, dime bag, duece, pee-wee, doughball..... all terms still used on the streets.

Oh yeah!!


You gotta tell me what these mean. I was around a lot of drugs in college and I've never heard of a single one of these

Does a doughball come with chocolate chips? Does a wayward officer ever get confused and order a dozen jelly filled powdered of them?

"Pee wee" sounds like something you order up in the castro in San Fran.

 

[manimal]

Oh yeah!!


You gotta tell me what these mean. I was around a lot of drugs in college and I've never heard of a single one of these

Does a doughball come with chocolate chips? Does a wayward officer ever get confused and order a dozen jelly filled powdered of them?

"Pee wee" sounds like something you order up in the castro in San Fran.

i'll give you one. "pee-wee" is what black crack dealers sell to white boys. it's about a $10 rock sold for $20.

 

[kidwoo]

They callin me a lightweight!!!??????


That's awesome.

Don't hold out on me.


Doughball?


Deuce?