[surfinguru]

Hey, kinda had an eye out for an MP3 player, but I didn't want to go with an Ipod. (Sorry, I'm a Windows guy) Anyway, I just found out our company is supplying the hard drives for these players and we're getting a good discount on them. Does anybody here use this brand? ---->Virgin Electronics

 

[stosh]

249 for 5 gig? Sounds high!

 

[DHracer1067]

ipods are 250 for 4 gigs. sounds normal

 

[math2014]

for what use mate?

 

[stosh]

Dell Jukebox 20gig 249

http://www1.us.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/dj_20_new?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs

 

[douglas]

I'm cheap - I got a 256mb for $30

 

[Toshi]

go and play around with the models out there at best buy or the apple store or whatever before you plunk your cash down online.

 

[lanman]

Creative Muvo txfm is great for like running or riding, its tiny, weighs a little over an ounce and holds about 60 songs, plus it has a good built it FM radio, comes with a belt clip and arm band..o ya its like 80 bucks, I love mine.

 

[manhattanprjkt83]

man you are crazy not to go with the ipod, it doesnt matter if you are a windows guy . I am a windows guy as well and dont go anywhere without my ipod, use it to work out, study, ride, ski, in my car via a wireless itrip. It is far superior to the competition and the aftermarket add ons available are great...I would reconsider and not buy a "clone" because that is all they are....

 

[narlus]

so manhattanprjkt83, tell me how the iPod is far superior to the competition? what can it do that the others can't?

can it play FLAC or ogg vorbis files? no
is it cheaper than the others, on a per/MB basis? no
can it support gapless playback? no
does its battery last longer per charge? no

so what are all those neat features which stomp the others?

one might argue that Apple's mighty marketing campaign has turned you into a clone.

 

[Toshi]

narlus:

- firewire, altho some others have usb 2.0
- interface. the wheel is a very natural way to navigate through songs
- non-ugliness, which is important for consumer goods
- iTunes is a good way to manage music, and the iTMS is another draw

 

[syadasti]

Toshi:

-More people have USB 2.0 than firewire. Also Rio supports ethernet for web based management- everyone has that and you can use any OS (or use the player as a music webserver)
-Riostick w/ a clickable scroll wheel are easier and I've used both a iPod and a Karma. I can operate my karma with one hand while driving and not have to look at it. Buttons are better thats why Apple buttonless mouse failed to catch on and touchpads on notebooks have buttons underneath (nobody likes to click on the pad even though most pads can operate that way).
-Yeah some people don't like equipment that looks like women's makeup compact or that has a SS back that gets greasy and dirty as soon as you touch it.
-A dead player is worthless - more battery life means more time actually playing music instead of doing nothing
-Its heavy - 20% heavier than the Karma with 15-16 hour battery vs. 10 on the Gen 4 and 8 on the Gen 3 (the Karma is a Gen 3 competitor - came out at the same time)
-There are no problems with the Rio software and they are releasing a softwareless upgrade where you just drag and drop. Rio's were the first players to have playlist generation on the fly - generation 4 just got that a year after the rio already had it...
-No stupid DRM functionality that requires you to buy third party applications to move music you own to and from your player. No monopolistic aims where the company breaks music you bought from Real...

 

[JMAC]

http://us.creative.com/products/product.asp?category=213&subcategory=214&product=10795

Just another option better than the mini ipod imho

 

[JMAC]

so manhattanprjkt83, tell me how the iPod is far superior to the competition? what can it do that the others can't?

can it play FLAC or ogg vorbis files? no
is it cheaper than the others, on a per/MB basis? no
can it support gapless playback? no
does its battery last longer per charge? no

so what are all those neat features which stomp the others?

one might argue that Apple's mighty marketing campaign has turned you into a clone.

I have a creative zen nomad 40GB, I ahve alot of friends with ipods. Thats why I didn;t get an ipod I hate having things that other ppl do. The only thing I think is better about IPOD is it's wheel interface. However I think every accesory is way ovwer priced for ipods.

 

[mack]

here my take as i have owned both a dell and i pod.

i pod= ok, girly, bad battery life, cant use to transport music

Dell= good batt. life, crappy software, plays songs outa order. can transfer songs

Iriver= kick ass!!! portable harddrive, top notch device.

no flash players

 

[JMAC]

Creative is the way to go.

 

[syadasti]

Creative is the way to go.

Creative makes the Dell units and is an acceptable option but is by no means the only option just as Apple or Rio isn't.

Rio, iRiver, Cowon, Creative, Apple, and others all make decent players that fit a range of needs.

I think the Cowon M5 is one of the best new units I've seen so far, but Rio's Chorma (follow up to the Karma) has not been released, so its hard to say...

 

[syadasti]

Anyone who is looking for a Ridemonkey like site for digital audio players, check out http://www.dapreview.com

 

[JMAC]

Creative makes the Dell units and is an acceptable option but is by no means the only option just as Apple or Rio isn't.

Rio, iRiver, Cowon, Creative, Apple, and others all make decent players that fit a range of needs.

I think the Cowon M5 is one of the best new units I've seen so far, but Rio's Chorma (follow up to the Karma) has not been released, so its hard to say...

WOW i looked at the cowon m5 thats my next mp3 player for sure. Might get the new ipod baby depending on price and memory

 

[stosh]

Toshi:

-Yeah some people don't like equipment that looks like women's makeup compact or that has a SS back that gets greasy and dirty as soon as you touch it.

Bwahhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!

 

[clancy98]

aaaaaahhhhh, looking at cowons mp3 player website is making my computer go CRAAAAAZZZZYYY!!!!

 

[ZoRo]

Hey, kinda had an eye out for an MP3 player, but I didn't want to go with an Ipod. (Sorry, I'm a Windows guy)

Why are you ignoring the rebel force??? It will soon overcome the Empire and destroy the black star named after a pathetic name that sounds like MICROSOFT mofo!!!

peace

 

[syadasti]

Why are you ignoring the rebel force??? It will soon overcome the Empire and destroy the black star named after a pathetic name that sounds like MICROSOFT mofo!!!

peace

Apple is currently the Empire in mp3players, sorry
:nuts:

 

[-dustin]

i like iPods due to the looks. clean. very clean. i am a sucker, i know. but in my opinion, not one player substantially out-performs any other, so i might as well desire the one i think looks better. the Dells are nice, as well, i just don't know what to think about the little scrolling button. i've had bad luck with designs like that.

 

[Repack]

I don't understand half of what most of what you people just said, but I have been hearing about more and more alternatives to iPod. I heard that the Dell and Cambridge Soundworks house-brand players are made by the same company, and are much more durable than an iPod. Also, I have heard that the iPod battery sucks, and that you need to ship it out to get it serviced. The Dell has a replaceable battery.

Are the days of the iPod numbered, or am I just hearing angry rants against the "big kid on the block"?

 

[Toshi]

the ipod has a small group of vocal detractors who apparently have nothing better to do with their lives.

a) there have always been plenty of alternatives. the market has overwhelmingly chosen the ipod
b) i haven't heard any complaints about ipod durability
c) yes, the ipod's battery life isn't best in class at ~8 hours. i replaced the $40 battery in my 1G unit myself, so that part of the hearsay is untrue
d) wake me up when any of these "ipod killers" lasts more than a few months

 

[narlus]

it all depends on what you want out of yr player. see my post above to see certain features that the iPod doesn't support, but the karma does (you can also add in the 5 band parametric EQ and ability to issue an IP address and use it as a network device while docked).

ipod has several things going for it. the innate synergy w/ iTunes, from what i hear it's easy to use (never used one), you can use it as a mass storage device, and it's popular. never underestimate the importance of popularity. after all, where would budweiser be? is that the best beer on the market?

 

[Toshi]

on the other hand, just because something is unpopular doesn't mean it is better than the market leader . the itunes syncing, use as a hard drive for shuttling my junk around, and the general clarity of purpose are what drew me to the ipod. i'd known that other hard drive mp3 players existed at the time of the ipod's announcement, but none had caught my fancy until it.

 

[YETI187]

i ahve an RCA lyra model with 40 gb of memory. i like it. usb 2.0, can transfer files direct from player onto other comps, decent battery life. the downloading takes a bit getting used to as far as creating playlists. i'd reccomend it though. it only cost me $250. special plug so you can hook it up to stereo plugs like those on a tv if you want.

 

[Silver]

I don't use iTunes to rip and encode, but once I've done that, syncing to the iPod and keeping things organized is nice and easy. That's still the biggest plus to the iPod.

 

[syadasti]

the ipod has a small group of vocal detractors who apparently have nothing better to do with their lives.

a) there have always been plenty of alternatives. the market has overwhelmingly chosen the ipod
b) i haven't heard any complaints about ipod durability
c) yes, the ipod's battery life isn't best in class at ~8 hours. i replaced the $40 battery in my 1G unit myself, so that part of the hearsay is untrue
d) wake me up when any of these "ipod killers" lasts more than a few months

a) Toshi I guess that means you should use a Windows PC. The market has overwhelmingly chosen the Windows PC
b) The iPod mini which is supposed to be a sport model has a lower shock rating than a Rio Karma. I've heard of various models, mostly the iPod (probably cause of number of units) skipping and/or dying from shock
c) My Rio Karma's battery works fine
d) I bought my Rio Karma in November 2003 - works fine - no problems

Clarity of purpose with the ipod - well its not a good photo viewer, its not a good PDA, it doesn't have a good battery, it skips every time it advances to the next song (not gapless), it doesn't lend itself to one handed operation as well as the karma, doesn't support formats like ogg (open standard), flac (highest quality open standard), wma (sounds better at low bit rates), etc...

Syncing via iTunes is nothing special, my rio software syncs my computer collection, all I have to do is put it in the doc. The player can generate is own playlists on the fly using over a dozen different schemes.

Enjoy your Budweiser, "king" of beers

 

[narlus]

non-inflammatory question here - what is the advantage of syncing? why would one do it?

i can sync my karma, but i've never thought to try. what is the benefit?

 

[Toshi]

i think syncing is just another term for "moving songs to the device". in my case i have more music than ipod-room so i go into itunes, select which playlists i want on it, click ok, and wait a minute or two as the firewire connection does its thing. in this context syncing would update the device as i change the selected playlists.

for those who have more ipod-room than music syncing just keeps the device stocked with a copy of the entire music collection, updating it to, er, stay in sync whenever the ipod is plugged in

 

[narlus]

then syncing must mean something different for the Rio then, because there are sync options which i've never used, but obviously i can move stuff from my PC to my device. i bought an aftermarket item (riorad from red chair) so that the device looks like a drive using windows explorer, but frankly i think the rio music manager works as good or better (i seem to get incomplete transfers using riorad sometimes).

 

[genpowell71]

Please answer me one question that I'm sure has asked in this thread...

What is the purpose of having all that memory to store music? Last time I checked, you can only listen to one song at a time. Besides, show me someone that can listen to 20 gigs of music in a sitting and I'll show you someone that has no life...

 

[manhattanprjkt83]

narlus:

- firewire, altho some others have usb 2.0
- interface. the wheel is a very natural way to navigate through songs
- non-ugliness, which is important for consumer goods
- iTunes is a good way to manage music, and the iTMS is another draw

thanks toshi, you guys can buy what you want, but i have NEVER had a complaint with the ipod, and you wont see me with anything else any time soon, and like i said, im a windows guy.

 

[narlus]

Please answer me one question that I'm sure has asked in this thread...

What is the purpose of having all that memory to store music? Last time I checked, you can only listen to one song at a time. Besides, show me someone that can listen to 20 gigs of music in a sitting and I'll show you someone that has no life...

ok, here are some reasons:

the larger the drive, the more feasible it is to use FLAC (lossless) compression, so that you lose zero fidelity (oh wait, iPod users can't do this ).

the larger the drive, the less you have to rotate stuff. i can't speak for you, but i listen to different stuff all the time, and buy a lot of music. it's good to get a rotation going.

it comes in handy if you are going on a week or two long vacation. megatunes at yr disposal. just plug into a stereo or boombox and you've got a ton of music. this came in very handy on my trips last year.

 

[Toshi]

the larger the drive, the more feasible it is to use FLAC (lossless) compression, so that you lose zero fidelity (oh wait, iPod users can't do this ).

you're right. we use Apple Lossless Codec instead

 

[flatulant_man]

ipods are 250 for 4 gigs. sounds normal

250 for 4 gigs? you mean for the mini? if so, ok. i really like my full size. and if you want an mp3 player that isn't a mac, you could get the hp version. same thing, just made my hewlett-packard. so if it's supporting the company you don't like, then you can get the best of both worlds, i s'pose.

 

[narlus]

you're right. we use Apple Lossless Codec instead

toshi, you're an open source kinda guy, right?