ok i need a new bike

sanjuro · Jan 25, 2006

By perchance, did you pump up the shock or tune up your bike?

jacksonpt · Jan 25, 2006

Have you had the shop look at the bike since you've started having the problems? Squeeky brakes is fairly common - assuming you have disks, wipe down the rotors and run a rag between the calipurs - that should help. Chain suck can also be pretty common - is the drivetrain clean, lubed, and dialed in properly? The play in the rear makes me nervous - perhaps a poor build by the shop... maybe just needs to have some of the bolts tightened down?

I'm not sure what riding is like in CA so it's hard to make suggestions, but...
- Kona Dawg, lots of value, perhaps not quite enough travel
- Jamis Dakar XLT, one of the best values available
- Yeti 575, about $200 more than your budget, but is a killer ride
- Santa Cruz Blur LT - good ride, not sure about price

binary visions · Jan 25, 2006

jacksonpt said:
Have you had the shop look at the bike since you've started having the problems?

Have the shop examine everything. New bikes occasionally have break-in problems since they've not been ridden to get the kinks out

.

Squeaky brakes are very common even on well-tuned bikes. As Jackson said, running a cloth over everything (a clean cloth! This is important) can help, as can wiping your rotors down with isopropyl alcohol.

The play in the rear of the bike might be some bolts backing out. Either you or the shop can try tightening all of the linkage bolts (but don't go all crazy on them if you don't know the torque specifications - better the shop do it so you don't break anything). The bolts can have a little bit of blue loc-tite applied to prevent this in the future.

Chainsuck can be caused by a number of things and unfortunately, Gary Fishers seem to be more prone to it, but you can start by wiping off your chain and re-lubing it. The play in your rear linkage may well be contributing to the chainsuck, so solving the play might clear up this issue.

If you've got a lemon, well, you've got a lemon, but don't give up on it before you've had it gone over and some work done.

Good luck!

robdamanii · Jan 25, 2006

I'm going to suggest a Kon Dawg. Lots of value, tuff as nails build.

BIGHIT756 · Jan 25, 2006

you could check out the specialized line of enduros, or even stumpjumpers. the kona dawgs are a great ride also, but most of them are marzocchi forks. specialized tends to use more fox forks on the enduros, and SJs....there should be one from each line at around 2000-/+

robdamanii · Jan 25, 2006

bicycleman said:
also i have heard on here that Konas ride wierd or feel wierd
is this true?

They don't ride or feel weird to me. Make sure you get a very good fit, just like you would for any bike. The only thing I can think of is people complaining about the 4 bar style suspension, but when it comes down to it, there's really nothing wrong with it or any other design out there.

As for the Fox problem, if you were looking at something like a Dawg deeluxe or something, you'd have enough left over to drop a new fork on there and be gold.

robdamanii · Jan 25, 2006

bicycleman said:
well if i went for the dawg primo
it comes with a fox
is this a good idea

Frame tubing Kona Clump Butted Aluminum, 5" Travel
Rear Shock Fox Float RP3
Fork FOX Float R 130mm
Headset Aheadset STS
Crankarms RaceFace Evolve XC X-Type
Chainrings 44/32/22
B/B RaceFace Evolve XC X-Type
Pedals Shimano PD-M520 Clipless
Chain Shimano CN-HG53
Freewheel Shimano CS-HG50 11-32 9 speed
F/D Shimano Deore LX
R/D Shimano Deore XT
Shifters Shimano Deore LX
Handlebar
RaceFace Evolve DH OS riser
Stem RaceFace Evolve XC
Grips Kona Jack****
Brakes Hayes Hydraulic HFX-9 XC
Brake Levers Hayes Hydraulic HFX-9 XC
Front hub Shimano HB-M525 disc
Rear hub Shimano FH-M525 disc
Spokes Stainless 14g
Tires Nokian NBT 26 x 2.3
Rims Sun S.O.S. Welded
Saddle WTB Laser V Race
Seatpost IRD Quad 2
Seat clamp Kona QR
Colors Green

Looks like a nice enough build to me. Frankly, I'm on last year's primo and I love it.

You may not like the shifters/rear derailleur combo or the shimano clipless pedals. But YMMV.

sanjuro · Jan 25, 2006

I own a Dawg Primo and no complaints from me. Try to keep it in tune though...

Bearmntpicnic · Jan 25, 2006

SPecialized line is my pick the high end Iron horse bikes are pretty rad too

ioscope · Jan 25, 2006

I think that you are simply overlooking maintenance and solutions. If all cakes did this you would hear about it.

sanjuro · Jan 26, 2006

bicycleman said:
no no as of now im keeping the bike it has been in and out of the shop 5 times. But do you think that i should request that they replace the rear triange because of the damage which was caused by the bike not me
:mumble:

Hey I was Just Ridin' Along and...

jacksonpt · Jan 26, 2006

bicycleman said:
im not an idiot

I beg to differ...

bicycleman said:
also i have heard on here that Konas ride wierd or feel wierd
is this true?

if you weren't an idiot, you'd know that bikes feel different to everyone. Feel is very dependant on what you're used to and what you are expecting. Considering how popular Konas are, I find it hard to believe there is a design flaw in them. The few I've been on feel great, but that's just me

jacksonpt · Jan 26, 2006

bicycleman said:
i know of these problems as a thing that happenes to the cake
im not an idiot
i pumped everything up
the drvetrain is clean
and lubed with WL
i did clean the rotors and sand down th pads
thanks
and i did take it into the shop
and they thik they are smart when the one guys and idiot
and he think you cant put locktite in the bolts
and the started cranking them down with a hand wrench and i stopped him
Has no oneheard of these problems happening aton on the Cakes

punctuation is your friend

robdamanii · Jan 26, 2006

No offense dude, but read to the end of that thread.

jacksonpt · Jan 26, 2006

bicycleman said:
ok does this mean anything to you
heres a qoute from "Blue"
"Konas suck. Don't get a faux 4-bar (Trek, Kona, new Turner, GF, etc).

<snip>

incase you cant tell read the first line.

and now all of a sudden im the idiot

No, it's not all of a sudden, you've been an idiot since you asked the question. Did you bother reading the rest of that thread? I'm not going to get into a pissing match with you... you posted a question with very little info, we responded, and you took offense. Perhaps public forums aren't the place for you?

Konas (and 4bars in general) RULE... now what are you going to do???

jacksonpt · Jan 26, 2006

bicycleman said:
but, do you think that I should request that they replace the rear end, because of the damage from the chain suck, witch was not caused by me.

I dunno, you haven't described the damage or posted any pics of it. If it's just superficial, then no. I mean, you can ask, but they'll just say no. If it's more than that, them maybe. And as far as the "it's not caused by me" standpoint, it's your word against theirs. Chain suck doesn't just happen for no reason. If everything looks kosher, perhaps you should take the bike to another shop for a second opinion. Do you know any local riders who might be able to suggest a more reputable shop?

IMO, if you're lucky, you'll get some touch-up paint for free.

sanjuro · Jan 26, 2006

bicycleman said:
ok does this mean anything to you
heres a qoute from "Blue"
"Konas suck. Don't get a faux 4-bar (Trek, Kona, new Turner, GF, etc).

My advice with your budget: Blur XC or a Titus Moto-Lite. An IH Azureus is also a good choice, as well as a Giant Trance 1...The Trance is prolly your best bang for buck, full XT/XTR kit with Crossmax SL wheels and a Fox F100RL fork. All of the above mentioned bikes have awesome build quality and ride. If you don't mind the single pivot, the new C'Dale Rush is also an awesome pick, the Lefty is a creation of God himself..."

incase you cant tell read the first line.

and now all of a sudden im the idiot

BTW, I let Blue's comment go originally. I own a Kona Dawg Primo and I have ridden the Coiler and the Stinky.

Kona has got a funny reputation by idiots who think there is some mythic perfect bike waiting out there. My bike might ride well because of the Fox suspension, but hell, it rides well. And durable, and good looking.

Are there better suspension designs? Well yes and no. Others have their advantages and disadvantages.

Don't take my word on it? Well did you know the Downhill World Champion rides on, guess what, a Kona? Does it mean Kona is the best DH design? Nope, it just means you can win a world championship on a Faux-Bar linkage.

jacksonpt · Jan 27, 2006

bicycleman said:
also if you use touch up paint on the frame doesnt it void the warranty
because it says if you alter the frame in any way, and i believe that would be altering the frame but im not sure

I don't think so, especially if you get it from the shop/manufacturer because of an apparent problem with the bike.

I had a similar situation with my Jamis road bike - under real high torque situations (climbing out of the saddle, for example), the rear wheel would pull out of the dropouts. This caused the cassette to scrape across the chainstay digging up the paint. I complained to the shop I bought the bike and to Jamis directly. The solution was an upgraded rear skewer and some touchup paint for the scratches.

When they talk about altering the frame in any way, I think they mean structural stuff, i.e. altering the material itself. You'd just be touching up the paint.

robdamanii · Jan 27, 2006

jacksonpt said:
I don't think so, especially if you get it from the shop/manufacturer because of an apparent problem with the bike.

I had a similar situation with my Jamis road bike - under real high torque situations (climbing out of the saddle, for example), the rear wheel would pull out of the dropouts. This caused the cassette to scrape across the chainstay digging up the paint. I complained to the shop I bought the bike and to Jamis directly. The solution was an upgraded rear skewer and some touchup paint for the scratches.

When they talk about altering the frame in any way, I think they mean structural stuff, i.e. altering the material itself. You'd just be touching up the paint.

I think he's thinking about a warrantee issue of a complete paint change. Kona will not honour a warrantee for a frame that has been repainted by a non-authorized Kona painter. I believe it has something to do with the stripping of the old paint off the frame and how it relates to the structural integrity of the frame.

jacksonpt · Jan 27, 2006

robdamanii said:
I think he's thinking about a warrantee issue of a complete paint change. Kona will not honour a warrantee for a frame that has been repainted by a non-authorized Kona painter. I believe it has something to do with the stripping of the old paint off the frame and how it relates to the structural integrity of the frame.

ah - when he mentioned "touch-up paint", I just assumed he was talking about touching up some scratches on the chain stay caused by chain rub/suck, not a complete repaint.

robdamanii · Jan 27, 2006

jacksonpt said:
ah - when he mentioned "touch-up paint", I just assumed he was talking about touching up some scratches on the chain stay caused by chain rub/suck, not a complete repaint.

That's what I'm assuming too; just touching up the chain suck damage. What I'm guessing he's referring to is a policy like Kona has. I just don't think he realized it only applies to a complete repaint.

SkaredShtles · Jan 27, 2006

I have to agree with jacksonpt wholeheartedly about the idiot part. :rolleyes:

bicycleman - please put a modicum of thought and effort into your posts.

rooftest · Jan 27, 2006

Touch up the paint? It's a frickin' mountain bike! Dumb!!!

As for chain suck - I notice the better I get (as I don't try to shift faster than the bike is able to), it's less of a problem. I think you'll see that with all bikes.

sanjuro · Jan 27, 2006

Warranty is not a no-questions-asked return policy. If a frame broke because of normal wear-and-tear, or there was a part which did not function correctly, that would be covered under warranty.

A bike which did not function correctly because poor adjustment or simply the rider does not like it, that is not covered under warranty.

Returning a bike for these reasons is a funny one. No shop wants to accept a bike return, and many shops will not if it has been ridden or cannot be sold as new. Good shops will work with you, change parts if needed, make sure those adjustments are correct.

From my perspective, I think a shop which just takes the bike is a bad one, just as if they refused to help you at all. Of course, I work at a shop.

robdamanii · Jan 27, 2006

bicycleman said:
okk thanks guys.
but also i mean they are not just little scratches there is a spot where there is no paint at all of an area about 2" by 1" would this be ok for touch up paint or not.
also i dont know much about ZR9000, does it rust?
And is it any better

ZR9000 is a zirconium (I believe) enriched aluminum alloy, and therefore, by the grace of chemisty, will only oxidize, not rust.

Edit:

Found the composition. It's from Klein's site, but they're all owned by Trek anyway.

zr9000 alloy™

Klein's proprietary alloy blends the advantages of aerospace grade aluminum, zirconium, copper and manganese into lighter, stronger tubing with a 98 percent better fatigue life than industry-standard aluminum. Its improved strength allows for thinner Gradient tube walls in key areas of the frame, which has lowered frame weight by another astonishing 15 percent.

robdamanii · Jan 28, 2006

bicycleman said:
so that would mean that it would be twice as strong fatigue wise as a pure aluminum frame
Thanks alot
but then does aluminum oxidize

Yes, aluminum oxidizes, as I said earler.

Wumpus · Jan 28, 2006

Touch up the paint if it is bothering you. It is not going to rust or cause any problems if you leave the aluminum bare. A thin layer of oxidation will form on the surface(the aluminum will have a dull dirty look) and that is all.

Chain suck can be caused by a lot of things. Dry chains(try a wetter lube), bad chainlines(don't cross gear), not enough chain tension(maybe removing a few links), shifting under load(plan ahead and shift accordingly)...

Angus · Jan 30, 2006

bicycleman said:
No im not an idiot,

Well maybe your not,

bicycleman said:
i know of these problems as a thing that happenes to the cake
im not an idiot
i pumped everything up

and i did take it into the shop
and they thik they are smart when the one guys and idiot
and he think you cant put locktite in the bolts
and the started cranking them down with a hand wrench and i stopped him
Has no oneheard of these problems happening aton on the Cakes

But your grammar leaves lot's of room for speculation,
If I had to make assumptions about you using only the previous quote, I would assume one of the following to be true.

1) English is your second language.
2) You are eight years old.
3) You are a "special needs" individual

I have a lunch riding on this , so please tell me which category best fits.

ok i need a new bike

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