any major companies using a basic single pivot anymore? only one i can think of is the bullit. i mean not even cannondale is doing it anymore. is it obsolete now?
single piv?
- Thread starter lovebunny
- Start date
cove bikes do single pivot so do orange, im sure there lots of others i cant think of now
giant's another one (for the moment at least), chumba wumba, every kona under the sun (if you want to be really picky about it)
Foes Mono. They have that 'swing link' think, but it really doesn't do anything but help with stiffness.
And our beloved bb7's
-Adam
And our beloved bb7's
-Adam
Yeti AS-X, Turner DHR, Rocky Mountain RMX, Haro Extreme, Gary Fisher King Fisher, Scott Nitrous, Marin's DH bike (if they still make it), Ellsworth Joker ('Joke' being the operative word), Mountain Cycle offerings...So while some of those examples use a linkage design (vs. a pure single pivot like the Bullit), they're still singles...
Or actually, I just remembered according to Specialized, everything is basically a single pivot that doesn't use their chain stay pivot design
Or actually, I just remembered according to Specialized, everything is basically a single pivot that doesn't use their chain stay pivot design
Morewood...which is my favorite bike on the market right now. 
It looks like the new Iron Horse Sunday is also a single pivot bike.
It looks like the new Iron Horse Sunday is also a single pivot bike.
ok yeah i guess those count. but the mono still has the swinglinkskyst3alth said:Foes Mono. They have that 'swing link' think, but it really doesn't do anything but help with stiffness.
And our beloved bb7's
-Adam
But the swing link is not part of the suspension. Simply a device to reduce side flex of the swingarm.
LOLZ @ Ublt2ride said:Morewood...which is my favorite bike on the market right now.
Sunday single pivot?
lovebunny said:
Technically the new C-Dale is a single pivot with a link.
Morewood all the way!
Check out the website below, very cool bike.
My whole team came from Turner DHR, and they said you can't compare the 2 bikes. I myself came from a BB7(Which I sold to your friend Garret), and the Morewood is 10x better hands down.
Check it out and tell me what you think,
Justin
Check out the website below, very cool bike.
My whole team came from Turner DHR, and they said you can't compare the 2 bikes. I myself came from a BB7(Which I sold to your friend Garret), and the Morewood is 10x better hands down.
Check it out and tell me what you think,
Justin
biggins said:
Acutally it is, any bike with the pivot above the chainstay is...the new KHS is also.
Sinister even says it on the site.
http://www.sinisterbikes.com/r9.htm
Let's not forget the honda-i know it can't be bought- but it is a "simple" SP without any linkage and is the most dominant bike in the NORBA series.
If and when the internal tranny comes available to the masses i think the SP will make a HUGE resurgance.
I personally still feel the SP with a linkage is the best out there:Ventana Cuervo,DHR,ASX,Brooklyn are great examples etc
Funny thing,SP without linkages are probably my least favorite bikes out there,even with good shocks.I'd love to be proven wrong if i could ride the Honda someday.
Krispy
If and when the internal tranny comes available to the masses i think the SP will make a HUGE resurgance.
I personally still feel the SP with a linkage is the best out there:Ventana Cuervo,DHR,ASX,Brooklyn are great examples etc
Funny thing,SP without linkages are probably my least favorite bikes out there,even with good shocks.I'd love to be proven wrong if i could ride the Honda someday.
Krispy
Not using that bike currently. Angelfire he was on the plain old version.Zutroy said:
biggins said:
It's very simple there is only on pivot that effect the path of the wheel, therefor it is a single pivot, same way the Konas are also. The rest is just fancy linkage for the shock
Gerrit's been pinning it on his Morewood lately.
yeah SP are still alive and well and will be untill pivots are mantinence and play-free. even after that it will still be cheeper to make a SP bike.
Zutroy said:
maybe and i understand where you guys are coming from but thew shock isnt even attached to the swing arm. its attached to a rocker linkage that is attached to the swingarm so it seems to me that there are more pivots.
its probably that i am just an idiot though.
spacemanspiff06 said:
I don't know about cheaper.... Oranges, Foes and Chumbas are up there in price.
What about the lower end Iron Horse DH/FR bikes, if they can be considered low end, without the DW link? They're simple single pivots yet DW says they are some of the best ridding bikes around.
Maybe it will help to remove the shock from the equation. Imagine moving the rear wheel threw it's travel. Now how many spots are effecting the path of the rear wheel? Just one, where the swingarm links to the frame. It looks similar to a FSR linkage, but the rear wheel is still attached to the swingarm and not a separate link that pivots off the swingarm.biggins said:
Latest issue of Bike mag had a good write up on the 4 main types of suspension linkages, SP, VPP, FSR/Horst, 4-bar. I believe the Kona's are using 4-bar with a pivot on the seat stay (but could be wrong).
DW (the dog, not the link guy)
DW (the dog, not the link guy)
To simplify,on this forum a single pivot is described by the wheel path curving in a circle around the pivot that attached the wheel to the frame.A simple single pivot would be a bike like a Bullit.A Kona for example is a single pivot even though there is a strut and a link driving the shock I like to call these bikes advanced single pivot or linkage driven single pivot.The R9 is another example.
Many people call Konas 4 bar which is far from true.I believe even those goons at MBA call em 4 bars which causes a lot of confusion.
Many people call Konas 4 bar which is far from true.I believe even those goons at MBA call em 4 bars which causes a lot of confusion.
Konas are 4-bars. The location of the axle in relation to the pivots is not important when considering if a suspension is a 4-bar design or not.leprechaun said:
I've owned both 4-bar (FSR) and single pivots...and am now back to both bikes being SP's (Foes FXR, Yet AS-X). It's wierd though, the ASX has taught me two things that I've read about often enough but never truly experienced: pedal feedback and brake jack.
Now I've definitely felt brake jack, just not to the extent the ASX does it. I'd never definitively felt pedal feedback, but climbing on my ASX in the granny, hitting a bump, then wham! the thing freezes out and kicks back at my foot. Bizarre! These are two things I can put up with b/c otherwise I love my Yeti. I'm just not sure why going from a 5.75" travel SP bike w/ linkage to a 7.1" travel SP bike w/ linkage would make these SP tendencies so much more obvious?
p.s. Krispy thanks for the front der. swap the other day...it's all dialed in now
Now I've definitely felt brake jack, just not to the extent the ASX does it. I'd never definitively felt pedal feedback, but climbing on my ASX in the granny, hitting a bump, then wham! the thing freezes out and kicks back at my foot. Bizarre! These are two things I can put up with b/c otherwise I love my Yeti. I'm just not sure why going from a 5.75" travel SP bike w/ linkage to a 7.1" travel SP bike w/ linkage would make these SP tendencies so much more obvious?
p.s. Krispy thanks for the front der. swap the other day...it's all dialed in now
WheelieMan said:
Think it depends on whos def of four bar you use.
i love my single pivot
Listen to the Leprechaun.
The real question is the wheel path. Is it limited to rotating around one pivot? If so, it's a single pivot, no matter how the shock is driven. That is true of the SC heckler and bullit and also true of the Konas.
So why use linkages on SP designs? Because it allows you to (somewhat) independently tune shock rates and pivot location. Shock rate is the amount of shock compression for a given amount of wheel travel. It has a huge effect on performance, and can change depending on the location of the shock and the pivot. But the location of the pivot also has a big effect on pedaling, braking, and other performance issues. Using a linkage allows you to determine pivot location without as much concern over how it will impact shock rate as would normally be the case.
The real question is the wheel path. Is it limited to rotating around one pivot? If so, it's a single pivot, no matter how the shock is driven. That is true of the SC heckler and bullit and also true of the Konas.
So why use linkages on SP designs? Because it allows you to (somewhat) independently tune shock rates and pivot location. Shock rate is the amount of shock compression for a given amount of wheel travel. It has a huge effect on performance, and can change depending on the location of the shock and the pivot. But the location of the pivot also has a big effect on pedaling, braking, and other performance issues. Using a linkage allows you to determine pivot location without as much concern over how it will impact shock rate as would normally be the case.
If you call a kona a 4 bar, then my DHR is a 4 bar. There are just as many linkages doing the same thing on each.
A kona should behave the same as say...an RMX. Same pivot location. Same linkage driven shock. Same wheel path.
Maybe Spec did invent the term 4 bar, but if the wheel is attached the the frame with 1 piece, then it's a fricken single pivot
A kona should behave the same as say...an RMX. Same pivot location. Same linkage driven shock. Same wheel path.
Maybe Spec did invent the term 4 bar, but if the wheel is attached the the frame with 1 piece, then it's a fricken single pivot
I'm no engineer but I don't think this is accurate. Like a lot of people I think you are confusing "four bar" with "Horst Link." The terminology can be confusing but if you do a search there are plenty of technical articles that explain it. I'm pretty sure a Kona is a four bar, it just has the wheel path of a single pivot.buildyourown said:
